Building trap in modern code

[WalnutContractors]

Why are building traps still required in some modern codes?

City of Yonkers, NY: Sewer and Water Lines, Drains and Traps

Ch 57 Art IX Each building shall be separately trapped. Where possible, an iron running trap shall be placed on the building (house) drain near the inside of the front wall of the buildings and on the sewer side of all connections. If below the cellar floor, it mus

ecode360.com

 

[Reach4]

@Sylvan has pointed out some potential advantages. One that surprised me was that if gasoline spilled into the combined sewer, gasoline vapors would not get into the house plumbing.

I doubt the ability of a whole house trap to stop rats.

With whole house traps on the sewer, the sewer will need its own vent. In the more common/modern choice, each house helps to vent the sewer.

The main disadvantage is that they can clog up, and become a maintenance item.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[John Gayewski]

They are illegal in the UPC. They don't do anything worth the clog caused by them.

 

[Sylvan]

Why are building traps still required in some modern codes?

City of Yonkers, NY: Sewer and Water Lines, Drains and Traps

Ch 57 Art IX Each building shall be separately trapped. Where possible, an iron running trap shall be placed on the building (house) drain near the inside of the front wall of the buildings and on the sewer side of all connections. If below the cellar floor, it mus

ecode360.com

I live 3 blocks from Yonkers and decades ago they had the best polititions money can buy

ONLY A Moron would eliminate a building house trap and this is the reason

City sewers are known to have methane among other gases that are not only flammable they are carcinogenic.

So knowing these city sewers are not properly vented they decided to do away with a building house trap in uncivilized areas and have each building allow the city system to vent through each building connected to their system

This is a fantastic idea except people are lax when it comes to replenishing the seals or traps such as indoor floor drains or going on vacations and the trap seals evaporate or some moron uses a "cheater vent" as they have no real skills and depend on a piece of plastic to maintain integrity of a vent

A Storm trap and a Sanitary trap and a combination trap are designed to protect the occupants of the building from obnoxious fumes.

A running trap with two access points allow snaking or water Jetting upstream and downstream and to clean the trap when needed.

· NYC311

portal.311.nyc.gov

It’s Manhole Explosion Season: What You Need to Know About a Century-Old Problem

The blasts injure people, wreak property damage, power outages and traffic disruptions annually. We take a deep dive as risk is at height.

www.thecity.nyc

If you want to give a tip please consider Saint Judes, Disabled Veterans or the Shriners

 

[Sylvan]

They are illegal in the UPC. They don't do anything worth the clog caused by them.

If people would not throw a fetus, wetones, grease ,toys ,paper towels, rags,pampers etc down a drain the house trap would never get a blockage

The yearly cleanings I do are to remove roots and in some cases excessive grease people love to pour down a kitchen sink or better yet motor oil poured down a backyard drain that helps leaves and soil adhere to the drain lines

I have an account the home was built in 1865 ORIGINAL cast iron with an original running trap and they cannot recall a main sewer stoppage

The Dodge foundation has several mansions in my area and even though they mined copper their building drainage system is cast Iron with a main trap, In the 30+ years I worked for mr. Dodge there was never a main sewer or trap stoppage.

A rat can pass through a sewer trap so do snakes. TRAPS prevent foul air from entering but an added bonus is when a structure is being replaced and and the sewer is being replaced it is not uncommon to find diamonds , gold, bullets , needles and other items that some are worth a fortune and others risk your health when you come in contact with it

 

[John Gayewski]

If people would not throw a fetus, wetones, grease ,toys ,paper towels, rags,pampers etc down a drain the house trap would never get a blockage

The yearly cleanings I do are to remove roots and in some cases excessive grease people love to pour down a kitchen sink or better yet motor oil poured down a backyard drain that helps leaves and soil adhere to the drain lines

I have an account the home was built in 1865 ORIGINAL cast iron with an original running trap and they cannot recall a main sewer stoppage

The Dodge foundation has several mansions in my area and even though they mined copper their building drainage system is cast Iron with a main trap, In the 30+ years I worked for mr. Dodge there was never a main sewer or trap stoppage.

A rat can pass through a sewer trap so do snakes. TRAPS prevent foul air from entering but an added bonus is when a structure is being replaced and and the sewer is being replaced it is not uncommon to find diamonds , gold, bullets , needles and other items that some are worth a fortune and others risk your health when you come in contact with it

When I flush my fetus'es I prefer they don't get slowed down by a trap and make it all of the way to the city sewer, that way they can raise it for me.

 

[Sylvan]

When I flush my fetus'es I prefer they don't get slowed down by a trap and make it all of the way to the city sewer, that way they can raise it for me.

Then your lucky to have self priming traps for all your fixtures and oscillation is not a concern for you as you have vent covers on your roof terminal.

The main thing in your life is faster flow and reports of what can happen has little or no concern to you, to only to expert witness and doctors and personal injury lawyers and those who had other priorities than installing a trap

Removing a house trap has little risk as it only happens once in a while when someone is affected and it is worth the risk as traps cost money.

Leaves, bird nests, squirrels, hoarfrost blocks a vent terminal I wonder where the gases that enter a building go?

Below is just nonsense as it only can happen to others correct?

Air: Sewer Gas

Learn how sewer gas can cause health problems, and how to avoid them.

www.dhs.wisconsin.gov

Sewer Gases in the Home

The intrusion of sewer gases into the living space should be discovered and fixed before occupants suffer ill health.

www.nachi.org

 

[John Gayewski]

Then your lucky to have self priming traps for all your fixtures and oscillation is not a concern for you as you have vent covers on your roof terminal.

The main thing in your life is faster flow and reports of what can happen has little or no concern to you, to only to expert witness and doctors and personal injury lawyers and those who had other priorities than installing a trap

Removing a house trap has little risk as it only happens once in a while when someone is affected and it is worth the risk as traps cost money.

Leaves, bird nests, squirrels, hoarfrost blocks a vent terminal I wonder where the gases that enter a building go?

Below is just nonsense as it only can happen to others correct?

Air: Sewer Gas

Learn how sewer gas can cause health problems, and how to avoid them.

www.dhs.wisconsin.gov

Sewer Gases in the Home

The intrusion of sewer gases into the living space should be discovered and fixed before occupants suffer ill health.

www.nachi.org

The sewer gas goes out the roof through the piping we install. A trap won't seal out a city worth of people's sewer gas. The vents and your fixture traps keep gas out. A house trap being illegal in upc jurisdictions is illegal for a reason. An inch of water column is an inch of water column meaning your 1.5 inch fixture trap holds as much pressure as your 4" house trap. So other than slowing down waste I can't see how they are useful.

 

[Jeff H Young]

Evidently house traps might still be used? There would be no reason to install here . kinda like selling snow shoes in Florida not much call for it

 

[Sylvan]

The sewer gas goes out the roof through the piping we install. A trap won't seal out a city worth of people's sewer gas. The vents and your fixture traps keep gas out. A house trap being illegal in upc jurisdictions is illegal for a reason. An inch of water column is an inch of water column meaning your 1.5 inch fixture trap holds as much pressure as your 4" house trap. So other than slowing down waste I can't see how they are useful.

NYC has 4"vent terminals to prevent hoarfrost and if your venting a fixture that has a vent including 2" prior to going through the roof it has to be increased to 4" This provides circulation from the FAI located within 4 feet of the BLDG traps

I can't count the number of vent terminals that were blocked by leaves or vandalism or in one case scale from the CI

The city sewer cleanouts have tiny holes for venting and in Manhattan they had double caps with an air space between to absorb the explosions that were occuring from methane

A lot of people install cheater vents or blind vents which of course will not keep obnoxious fumers out of a dwelling as it uses ambient air to vent a fixture

If a system is installed properly and given the correct amount of pitch then having a house trap will not cause any problems

If the house trap serves as a combination waste and storm then the rains and melting snow (storm water) will help scour the traps

Too much to lose not having one and too little gain not having one.

Negative pressure and positive pressure does weaken the trap seals so the only real protection from trap seal loss is the boulding hose trap that prevent public sewer gases from entering

 

[Tuttles Revenge]

I was listening to some commentary about how our democracy / republic works a while back. We are made up of thousands of tiny jurisdictions from neighborhoods to cities to counties to states to our Unite States...(obviously a US POV here) Each has the ability for self governance in most manners of our daily lives and each of these microcosms is an experiment. Plumbing and building codes are one of the ways in which we have the opportunity to test to see the advantages and disadvantages of one manner or another of rules for buildings and plumbing.

Whether or not to have a building trap is just one small component to an entire system of plumbing code. Overall are people in areas governed by non building traps dying disproportionately? Doubtful. The experiment of the UPC system is likely going just fine.

 

[Jeff H Young]

I suppose running storm drains , roof and deck drains into the sewer might be a reason for a house trap because roof drains and such are not trapped ? at least that's something we never do then again we don't put rain water in the sewer

 

[Reach4]

Sacramento and San Francisco have "combined sewer" systems.

 

[Sylvan]

I suppose running storm drains , roof and deck drains into the sewer might be a reason for a house trap because roof drains and such are not trapped ? at least thats something we never do then again we dont put rain water in the sewer

Any storm line roof drains for example, yard drains, area drains must have a a trap 40 pipe diameters upstream of a sanitary drain when connection to it

Also when using a combination sewer the storm traps as mentioned above OR can be in a separate system and have a separate main storm trap to avoid having individual traps and the storm running trap shall be tied in by a wye to the main sewer past the sanitary trap

When working on a 27 story building there is no separate lines storm /sanitary in the streets in NYC even though it was proposed in 1968

The problem is subways, utilities and the costs associated with tearing up the streets and then having the pitch to discharge the waste / stormwater

Running storm trap connecting to a sanitary system . Built in 1863

 

[Jeff H Young]

Sacramento and San Francisco have "combined sewer" systems.

gold rush towns probably not well planned

 

[Sylvan]

Any storm line roof drains for example, yard drains, area drains must have a a trap 40 pipe diameters upstream of a sanitary drain when connection to it

Also when using a combination sewer the storm traps as mentioned above OR can be in a separate system and have a separate main storm trap to avoid having individual traps and the storm running trap shall be tied in by a wye to the main sewer past the sanitary trap

When working on a 27 story building there is no separate lines storm /sanitary in the streets in NYC even though it was proposed in 1968

The problem is subways, utilities and the costs associated with tearing up the streets and then having the pitch to discharge the waste / stormwater

Running storm trap connecting to a sanitary system . Built in 1863

Church over 116 years old