Help me Save my Well...

[ChuckinSC]

I've been trolling this site for a while now and I have learned a Lot! I've got a property that I am about to build a garage on, and then build a house. It already has a septic system and a 420' well, but no pump... (And no well seal either...)
The other day I started to drop a pump in to 300' but ran into something at 120'. That's when I said 'Oh,,,This ain't good...' Now, this lot had been vacant for years and there were 4 wheeler tracks everywhere. -So, some dumb kid has dropped some crap down this well casing. I had a few choice words as I discovered this, but they didn't help the matter. Now I am tring to find some kind of solution for the problem.
The casing is 120' if 6" pvc with a static level of 50'. My pump stopped just at 120'. When I tie a 6 hole brick (And soak it in bleach...) to 200' of rope, it falls to the same 120'.
I am imagining that a red brick (just like the ones that were laying all around the pumphouse) would slide down the ID of the PVC and hang at the edge of the casing. I'm thinking 'If they've been soaking for years, wouldn't it bust up pretty easy?' Then my buddy points out all of the cement cylinders scattered around. I don't know what they're for but they are about 5" diameter by 14" long, and look as though they would fit the well casing like a mortar round. I bet that's it, dammit!
I'm not going to be able to pound through 6" of concrete with a pipe from 120' up. Is there some way to fix this or does it have to be drilled out with a drilling rig?
Any help would be helpful here.

 

[LLigetfa]

Sounds like those cylinders are test samples from a construction site. Probably should send down a camera to see for sure what is down there.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[ChuckinSC]

That's sorta' what I figured... I have a DIY GoPro, but id don't think that'll cut it here.
If it was determined to be concrete cylinders, how could that be remedied? Would a driller be able to punch through them or is it a lost well?
I didn't think of that, but that's probably just what they are, construction samples...

 

[Valveman]

Kids love to hear stuff fall in a well and hit the water. Even if there were not concrete cylinders and bricks handy, they would have found something to drop in there. You would be surprised at the stuff I have pulled out of wells. A well should never be left open like that. Even critters will smell the water and fall in. If it was wood or something soft you maybe able to stick something in it and fish some out. If it is 180' of compacted decomposing rabbits and mice, (which I have seen) it can be bailed or blown out. But if it is anything hard, you are out of luck.

Now the static is 50' and you still have 120' of hole, so you could set a pump and see what you get. But I wouldn't drink the water.

 

[ChuckinSC]

That sure isn't what I wanted to hear.
I just looked at it and I find that the cylinders slide perfectly into the casing. I was hoping that being that tight, maybe it could be drilled, but that's somebody else's call. I am tying to set up someone with a camera setup.
At this point I've got power turned on and a 1 horse pump attached to 300' of 250psi PE all laid out waiting to go down the hole, but no way to use it. (Oh, and a PSIdeKick CSV)
I may have to resort to left over M-80s...

 

[Smooky]

Most modern drilling rigs can easily drill through bricks, concrete, wood or even lost well pumps. The biggest problem is getting the truck with the drilling rig attached, lined up exactly as needed to go down the existing casing. Once the truck is backed up, it has the be leveled so the rig is plumb. If the site is unlevel it is especially difficult. It is easy for the drilling rod to be off. Most well drillers say it can't be done because it is such a pain. I've seen it done a few times but most would prefer to drill a new well.

 

[Craigpump]

Most modern drilling rigs can easily drill through bricks, concrete, wood or even lost well pumps. The biggest problem is getting the truck with the drilling rig attached, lined up exactly as needed to go down the existing casing. Once the truck is backed up, it has the be leveled so the rig is plumb. If the site is unlevel it is especially difficult. It is easy for the drilling rod to be off. Most well drillers say it can't be done because it is such a pain. I've seen it done a few times but most would prefer to drill a new well.

Deepening wells is done all the time, it can be a pain to set up, but with practice these guys get good at.

I think one those concrete slugs are hanging up at the bottom of the pipe where the size refuses or the well isn't 420 ' like you think.

 

[Valveman]

Deepening sure. But drilling out concrete cylinders, bricks, and chunks of wood is a different deal. Either way you have to reduce the size of the hole. You would need a 5" bit to go inside the 6" casing. Then if you can get it deepened you would only be able to fit 4" liner in the 5" hole. Wouldn't be able to gravel pack or screen properly. If that is the only place you can drill and you have plenty of money they might get it drilled out. But moving over and starting with a new well would be better and less expensive.

 

[LLigetfa]

... or the well isn't 420 ' like you think.

That crossed my mind as well. Is there a written well report or is it just hearsay?

A bit of Yankee ingenuity and a home made cable tool drill might be able to drill or bust through it. Lots of YouTube videos on cable tool drilling.

 

[ChuckinSC]

Well, I've had a few developments since the last post. I had a well company come out and drop a camera in to determine how to handle the problem.
Good News, It's Not concrete... It turns out to be the old pump and pipe dropped down the well.
Bad News, The Well company tells me that he can't (won't) do anything about it... He can't even give me a name, or suggest Any solution. But he sure did charge me.
As he started to break down his camera setup I asked him to save me a hard copy so I could figure out something on my own. Turns out that his little, old, pixelated, 4" monitor had no way to record a video or save a file...!? But I still had to pay the same price for a mental image.
Anyway, I built up a few treble hooks out of 3/8 allthread and dropped it in. Within 15 seconds of finding the bottom I had had a bite! As I pulled and pulled, I felt 100-150 lbs and saw the poly rope stretching. Surely that's not right. I must be snagged on the casing?
The next step was to order a 50 meter borescope / endoscope from eBay. After feeding this down on 130' of PVC (with a LED flashlight) I found a brass spigot that I snagged with my fishhook. Now I knew that I had a good bite. As I pulled, it took nearly 200 lbs to get it to move, but it Moved!
At this point I didn't expect to have this much weight, but I was determined to keep it moving. I tied a cinch knot to the line with a loop in it to go over my shoulders. So I could lift the line and lash it and re-cinch it.
All was going really well. Once I had the pump, 300' of 1" sch80, wire, and various fittings to the surface I could see that, sure enough, it still had the well seal attached. Apparently the bolts were loosened and it folded as it went down. So I was pulling a wedge all the way back up the casing!
Anyhow, here's the good part... The pipe was getting close enough to grab and lash down when the hook touched the edge of the casing and let loose of the whole works! -I think I know the last guy feels after loosening the bolts and losing his pump. After a few words, and some jumping around, I realized that I had done it once. -I can do it again...
The next time will be with a winch.

 

[Boycedrilling]

Now that's a fishing story!

 

[Reach4]

When you get it back up, please take a picture of the hooked equipment. And your lifting apparatus too.

You might hook it while alone, but it would be nice to have a helper for the actual lift. Once you clear the casing, I expect you connect a strap on, which is also connected to something that will not go down the casing.

Anyway, congratulations. You have to feel much better for various reasons.

 

[Valveman]

Hope you have as good of luck with the second try. One thing about fishing, with anything that comes up, pipe, wire, rope, etc., quickly get a clamp on it.

 

[Texas Wellman]

Yep. Seems like the fish always lets go right at the top. Learned the hard way over the years to be ready to grab as soon as you can.

 

[VAWellDriller]

Yep. Seems like the fish always lets go right at the top. Learned the hard way over the years to be ready to grab as soon as you can.

Hands and fingers are worth more than a well and pump.....don't learn the harder way. You're better to let go if things go south.

 

[Texas Wellman]

Grab was figurative. I wouldn't grab it with my bare hands. I usually have something ready like a pipe wrench or vise handy but I know what you mean!!

 

[ChuckinSC]

Ok, just to follow up, I rigged a cheap 12v winch over my casing and went fishing again. This time a couple of my pals were over to help out.
We tried to snag something blind with no luck, so I re-rigged my camera on the PVC and promptly snagged the spigot with my treble hook.
With a good bite, we started winching up 10 feet at a time. At the top of the pull, I had to lash the line and drop my 'gripper' for another bite. I found that we had to take it slow because the well seal was under the spigot. Every time we pulled, it lifted all the water and had to drain back down through it.
Once it hook was within reach, we added another for safety. (Lesson learned...) After that the PVC was coming out. I had tied a prussic knot to the pipe and began winching it up also. After a while it was getting lighter and things got to moving pretty quick. My buddy has a few pics of that, but I was hauling that #$@! outta there. It was a lot to pull, but all 300' of drop pipe and the pump came right outta there.
I've got my 420' well back!
Now I've gotta' put together an email to my well guy...

 

[Reach4]

Nice.

http://www.animatedknots.com/prusik/index.php

 

[Craigpump]

I'd like to see a pic of that well seal

 

[ChuckinSC]

Here you go:

It looks like the bolts were removed and the pump was lost. The bottom plate and the rubber went with it, but the top plate must have stayed up top.
The rubber and bottom plate acted like a cylinder piston to lift all of the well water as it was hoisted. I discovered that we needed to give it time to bleed back down in between pulls.