Fleck 5600 SXT water usage higher than expected

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ribeye

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Hi all,
Thanks for all the great info in this forum. I recently had a softener installed for the first time in my life and this website helped me so much in deciding what system to get, how it works, how to program it, etc. I've had great soft water for 14 days now and the first regeneration just occurred this morning. I have a smart water monitor that tells me the regeneration ran for 92 minutes and used 93.0 gallons of water, but I can't seem to figure out how those numbers came along. No water was used during the regeneration so the readings should be for the softener alone. Hoping somebody might be able to enlighten me.

Here are all my specs:
Fleck 5600 SXT 48K grain softener, 1.5 cu ft, 10x54 mineral tank
BLFC 0.5 gpm
DLFC 2.4 gpm
Inject 1 gpm (not sure what this is for but it's on the sticker)
2 people x 75 gallons per day = 150 gallons per day

Programmed for 8 lbs salt / cu ft (use 12 lbs salt per regen):
DF = Gal
VT = dF1B
CT = Fd
NT = 1
C = 36
H = 18
RS = rc
RC = 150
DO = 28
RT = 2:30
BW = 6
BD = 60
RR = 6
BF = 8
FM = P0.7

So my thought was the regeneration process includes the 4 steps below, but I don't fully understand what's actually happening during regeneration so please correct me if I'm wrong:
1. Backwash 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
2. Brine draw 60 minutes x 0.5 gpm = 30.0 gallons
3. Rapid rinse 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
4. Brine fill 8 minutes x 0.5 gpm = 4.0 gallons
This would give me a total of 80 minutes and 62.8 gallons of water.

It appears the actual results take an additional 12 minutes and 30.2 gallons of water over what I was expecting.

Does anyone know if there are additional steps in the regeneration process that I am missing? Or am I doing the math wrong? Any input would be greatly appreciated!
 

Reach4

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What injector? See page 26 of the service manual.

Checking the gallons would be hard, but you could start a regen, and set a 79 minute timer. Go watch the drain line, and see how long it continues to put out water.
Note that the majority of the BD cycle is slow rinse, because the brine has been sucked out, and the air check valve has closed.
#00 Injector - Violet
#0 Injector - Red
#1 Injector - White
You probably have white, and if so, I expect the brine is all sucked out in about 12.5 minutes. I would expect red to take about 16 minutes.

I would prefer red, or even violet, but violet would call for an increase in BD time to maybe 85 minutes. I think red would be fine with 60 minutes.


To check calibration on your monitor, fill a 5-gallon bucket at the tub or with a hose.
 
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Bannerman

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No water was used during the regeneration so the readings should be for the softener alone.
The water consumed for regeneration, does not flow through the softener's water meter since the meter turbine will be located on the softener's outlet, not on the inlet or drain line.

The most significant water for regeneration will be consumed during items 1, 3 & 4 that you calculated above.

Item #2 will be determined by the colour or number of the injector that is installed, which is why R4 asked which injector is installed. The 0.5 GPM BLFC is designed to govern only the brine fill rate, not the draw rate.

Because the Brine Draw cycle is actually 2 cycles which are combined together (Brine Draw & Slow Rinse). Slow Rinse flow through the injector will cause a vacuum to be created on the brine line which will draw brine from the brine tank at a slower rate than 0.5 GPM.

All of the brine will be typically transferred from the brine tank to the resin tank within 1/4th of the BD setting (1st ~15-minutes of a 60-minute Brine Draw cycle). Once the brine has been drawn down to the air check valve at the bottom of the brine tank, the AC valve will close to prevent air from being drawn, but the Slow Rinse portion of the cycle will continue for the remaining ~45-minutes, to push the brine through the entire resin bed while also rinsing away calcium, magnesium, chloride and excess brine from the resin.

The purpose of the short Rapid Rinse cycle directly after, is to recompact the resin bed after regeneration, since compacted resin will reduce the amount of hardness leakage through the resin bed.
 

ribeye

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Thanks for the responses everyone.
What injector?
I don't see any of the colors that you mentioned, but there is a sticker that says "Inject: 1", so I think you're right that I probably have the #1 white injector. I thought the 1 was referring to gpm but the injector number seems to make more sense.

Curious if you have an RO system?
I do not have an RO system. I do have a Fleck 5600 SXT backwashing catalytic carbon filter (1.5 cu ft, 10x54 tank) installed right before the softener, but that wasn't regenerating because it's only been 14 days and I have the day override set to 28 days.

The water consumed for regeneration, does not flow through the softener's water meter since the meter turbine will be located on the softener's outlet, not on the inlet or drain line.
Sorry, let me clarify. In my original post, I was referring to the readings from my smart water monitor (Phyn Plus), not the screen on the Fleck unit. The Phyn is installed right after my main water shutoff and before everything else, so it was detecting the total time and total gallons of water that was used in the regeneration cycle of my softener.

So it seems like my my math is mostly messed up at #2. When I look at the tables on page 26 of the service manual, am I supposed to be using my PRV's pressure setting for inlet pressure? If so, my PRV is set to 50 PSI. Using the line graphs for injector #1, the flow during brine draw at 50 PSI should be around 0.34 gpm, during slow rinse around 0.65 gpm, or total flow for #2 around 0.85 gpm (that doesn't seem to make sense that total flow is higher than brine draw and slow rinse individually... maybe I'm reading the tables wrong).

Recalculating the regeneration cycle given this new information, I get:
1. Backwash 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
2a. Brine draw 13.5 minutes x 0.34 gpm = 4.59 gallons (estimated the time somewhere between Reach's 12.5 and Bannerman's 15)
2b. Slow rinse 46.5 minutes x 0.65 gpm = 30.23 gallons
3. Rapid rinse 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
4. Brine fill 8 minutes x 0.5 gpm = 4.0 gallons
This would give me a total of 80 minutes and 67.62 gallons of water.

Or if I use the oddly higher total flow number, I get:
1. Backwash 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
2. Brine draw 60 minutes x 0.85 gpm = 51.0 gallons
3. Rapid rinse 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
4. Brine fill 8 minutes x 0.5 gpm = 4.0 gallons
This would give me a total of 80 minutes and 83.8 gallons of water.

My Phyn smart water monitor said the regeneration took a total of 92 minutes and used 93.0 gallons. So either way I calculate it, I still can't seem to get that close to the actuals which are much higher than expected. I guess I would be okay with not being able to figure out the gallons used since maybe the flow rates can vary, but I would have thought at least the time should be easy to calculate since those are in the settings. Can't figure out why it ran for 92 minutes when I set it to run for only 80. If anyone has anymore insights please let me know.
 

Bannerman

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2a. Brine draw 13.5 minutes x 0.34 gpm = 4.59 gallons (estimated the time somewhere between Reach's 12.5 and Bannerman's 15)
2b. Slow rinse 46.5 minutes x 0.65 gpm = 30.23 gallons
The injector acts as a venturi so Slow Rinse flow through the injector, creates a vacuum on the brine inlet port to draw brine from the brine tank. The amount of liquid flowing through the injector during Brine Draw, will be the combined total of 0.65 + 0.34 GPM for about 15-minutes. Once the brine level has lowered to the midpoint on the air check valve screen just above the bottom of the brine tank, then the air check valve will close and the flow rate will lower to 0.65 GPM through the injector for the remaining ~45 minutes of a 60-minute Brine Draw cycle.

Because the brine within the brine tank was created using the 4 gallons that entered the brine tank during stage 4 of the previous regen cycle, the 0.34 GPM during Brine Draw should not be counted since doing so, would be counting that 4 gallons twice. The only new flow to be considered during Brine Draw will be 0.65 GPM which will occur for the entire 60-minute Brine Draw cycle.

The Fleck 5600 utilizes a small electric motor to slowly move the valve gearing. The program times specified will be the time for each cycle, not including the additional time required for the motor to advance the valve piston position to the next cycle position. While the motor is advancing the valve piston, some water will continue to be consumed and flowing to drain, but the flow rate will vary as the piston position is altered.
 
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ribeye

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Thanks for sharing the knowledge Bannerman. I just Googled a venturi - very cool.

So it sounds like the correct calculation for the regeneration cycles should look like this:
1. Backwash 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
2. Brine draw 60 minutes x 0.65 gpm = 39.0 gallons
3. Rapid rinse 6 minutes x 2.4 gpm = 14.4 gallons
4. Brine fill 8 minutes x 0.5 gpm = 4.0 gallons
This would give me a total of 80 minutes and 71.8 gallons of water.

The remaining 12 minutes and 21.2 gallons (to get to the total 92 minutes and 93.0 gallons reported by Phyn) would appear to be related to the transitions between each cycle position. I'll try to watch the whole regeneration next time to confirm. Thanks for the help everyone!
 
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