REQUEST HELP WITH SYSTEM DESIGN AND SOFTENER SETTINGS

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Majorshooter

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Good day all and thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
Great site, have read many posts and appreciate folks that take their time to help.
Looking for help with system design and water softener settings.
Type of RO unit is big consideration. continuous like the Evolution R-1000 or tank reservoir unit.
Well has only 1.5 GPM recovery rate so efficiency is a consideration I think.

New well drilled to 225 ft. Results from water tests below.
First test straight from well untreated, taken through old water hose used with lake water on washer machine, possible contaminants, coliforms present, my bad.

Second test through new clean pex pipe after treatment.

Treatment= 1 micron sediment filter (new well still has some minor sediment), water softener, 5 micron sediment filter with charcoal, 8 GPM UV light.
Charcoal filter was for absorbing that sulfur gas smell.

Arsenic is the issue for sure. Is that number treatable and if so what is your product recommendation.
Also your recommendation for smell. Smell is gone after water sit in cup for a bit.

Question: Neighbor in next door cottage is a geologist but (summer 1 month resident) I haven't had a chance to run this by him but; he had students here with him for summer investigating Arsenic as lake has no arsenic in water but Arsenic attached to rock. Long story short I am also looking for opinion on whether Arsenic levels can decrease over time in drilled wells after sediment settles.

I have not set the Softener master settings yet. It is set as it was for previous owner (friend of neighbor) who had been sold a water softener without really needing one (his words).
Unit is a Fleck 5600SE and is 2 1/2 yrs old.

No hardnes in second results for some reason, I paid for it but 4 results missing. Oh well, (no pun intended).

Results

Before treatment:
Procedure Units Acceptable Limits
Aluminum 6 ug/L
Antimony $ <2 ug/L [<=6]
Arsenic $ 46 H ug/L [<=10]
Barium $ 11 ug/L [<=1000]
Beryllium <0.4 ug/L
Boron $ 37 ug/L [<=5000]
Cadmium $ <1 ug/L [<=5]
Calcium 34.1 mg/L
Chromium $ <2 ug/L [<=50]
Cobalt <2 ug/L
Copper $ <2 ug/L [<=1000]
Iron $ 355 H ug/L [<=300]
Lead $ <2 ug/L [<=10]
Magnesium 6.0 mg/L
Manganese $ 146 H ug/L [<=50]
Molybdenum <10 ug/L
Nickel <2 ug/L
Potassium 1.3 mg/L
Selenium $ <2 ug/L [<=50]
Silver <2 ug/L
Sodium $ 13.0 mg/L [<=200.0]
Strontium 739 ug/L
Thallium <2 ug/L
Tin <2 ug/L
Titanium <2 ug/L
Uranium $ <2 ug/L [<=20]
Vanadium <2 ug/L
Zinc $ 13 ug/L [<=5000]
Hardness as CaCO3 109.8 mg/L
pH 8.3 unit(s) [7.0-10.5]
Alkalinity as CaCO3 131.0 mg/L
Chloride $ 6.3 mg/L [<=250.0]
Fluoride $ 0.34 mg/L [<=1.50]
Sulfate $ 6.8 mg/L [<=500.0]
Nitrate + Nitrite (N) $ <0.01 mg/L [<=10.00]

After treatment:
Procedure Units Acceptable Limits
Total Coliforms Absent
E.coli Absent

Procedure Units Acceptable Limits
Aluminum 4 ug/L
Antimony $ <2 ug/L [<=6]
Arsenic $ 42 H ug/L [<=10]
Barium $ <2 ug/L [<=1000]
Beryllium <0.4 ug/L
Boron $ 36 ug/L [<=5000]
Cadmium $ <1 ug/L [<=5]
Calcium <0.5 mg/L
Chromium $ <2 ug/L [<=50]
Cobalt <2 ug/L
Copper $ <2 ug/L [<=1000]
Iron $ 50 ug/L [<=300]
Lead $ <2 ug/L [<=10]
Magnesium <0.5 mg/L
Manganese $ <2 ug/L [<=50]
Molybdenum <10 ug/L
Nickel <2 ug/L
Potassium 1.4 mg/L
Selenium $ <2 ug/L [<=50]
Silver <2 ug/L
Sodium $ 64.5 mg/L [<=200.0]
Strontium <2 ug/L
Thallium <2 ug/L
Tin <2 ug/L
Titanium <2 ug/L
Uranium $ <2 ug/L [<=20]
Vanadium <2 ug/L
Zinc $ <5 ug/L [<=5000]
Procedure Units Acceptable Limits
pH 8.5 unit(s) [7.0-10.5]
Fluoride $ 0.33 mg/L [<=1.50]
Nitrate + Nitrite (N) $ <0.01 mg/L [<=10.00]

Cheers

Foster
 

Majorshooter

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Where is the pump -- 205 ft maybe? What is the well diameter? What is the static water level? These are to estimate the water storage in the well.
How big is the resin tank?

pump at 215'. well dia 6", static was 30'. I have all the reports if required.
How do i tell IRT size of resin tank?height x width?
Thanks for quick reply.
Foster
 

Reach4

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Majorshooter

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http://www.hydro-terra.com/well-volume-calculator/ comes up with 272 gallons, so there should be plenty to regenerate the softener.


Yes. If you have trouble measuring diameter, take circumference and divide by pi. Then round diameter down to whole inch. Or you could divide by 3 and round to the nearest inch.

Reach4
Its a 9" diameter and a height of 45" before the top starts to round.
 

Reach4

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That is going to be 9" x 48" 1.00 cu. ft. ( nominal 32,000 grains )

You would benefit from a KL filter before the softener. It would remove iron, manganese, arsenic, and H2S(smell). It would let you use less salt. While a softener removes iron, manganese (but expect to do periodic cleaning), it does not remove H2S.

With your iron and no iron filter, I would use iron treating salt and/or ResCare feeder.

I would also sanitize your well and plumbing system. The first line of https://terrylove.com/forums/index....izing-extra-attention-to-4-inch-casing.65845/ has a link to a nice sanitizing article, but then I go into my possibly-overkill extension. Sanitizing can help iron and H2s "sulfur smell". If your hot water has more smell, there is something you can do about that.

Here is what I would go with.

System info (not programmed)
salt lb/cuft = 6 ; A choice ( efficiency vs capacity)
BLFC = 0.5 ; Brine Refill rate GPM *** common size, but confirm by checking label on controller.
cubic ft resin = 1 ; ft3 resin = (nominal grains)/32,000
Raw hardness = 9 ; including any compensation
People = 2 ; gallons affects reserve calc
Estimated gal/day = 120 ; 60 gal per person typical calc
Estimated days/regen = 18.5 ; Computed days ignoring reserve

Fleck 5600SXT Settings:

DF = Gal ; Units
VT = dF1b OR dF2b ; Downflw/Upflw, Single OR double Backwash
CT = Fd ; Meter Delayed regen trigger
NT = 1 ; Number of tanks
C = 20.0 ; capacity in 1000 grains
H = 9 ; Hardness-- compensated for iron and manganese
RS = rc ; rc says use gallons vs percent
RC = 120 ; Reserve capacity gallons
DO = 7 ; Day Override, reduced due to iron
RT = 2:00 ; Regen time (default 2 AM)
BW = 5 ; Backwash (minutes)
Bd = 60 ; Brine draw minutes
RR = 5 ; Rapid Rinse minutes
BF = 4 ; Brine fill minutes
FM = usually t0.7 ; flow meter, make note of what is there


Is VT =dF2b an option? If so, I think I would go with that.
 
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ditttohead

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You can not simply program the 5600SXT as a DF2B, it requires a different cam. The 5600 is a mechanical switch position valve, not an optical positioner like the 5800 series and 7000, so single or double backwash is valve specific.
 

Majorshooter

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OK, I think I remember seeing something in these forums reference this KL filter IRT iron. Kallox or something like that. Please explain or provide a link as my google searches for KL filter are not successful.
I had contacted a local water treatment company requesting their recommendation and their reply was a two tank system as well. He said the first oxygenated the water removing the gas smell and oxidizes the arsenic. The second tank removed the arsenic and softened. I said I already have a water softener but he said it wouldn't work as it would be to small and would have the wrong media in it. He did not see my system, did not ask the size of the tank or have any idea what media I had.
So; Is this KL filter the oxygen tank he was talking about?
Is my softener tank big enough for the arsenic removal?
Is the typical water softener media sufficient to remove the arsenic after oxidization?
This KL filter, can I build one from a typical water softener tank and head or do I need to purchase it?

I am excited to be moving towards a whole home arsenic removal system rather than those little under the sink systems but am really trying to cut costs if safely possible.
The system he wanted to sell me was $2980.00 cash and carry.
I hope I can use the existing components in my design.

As far as sanitizing my plumbing I have replaced all lines up to the point of going into the walls and removing that copper. All the rest is replaced with 3/4 pex. I plan on renovating the kitchen so all copper will be replaced with pex. The bathroom sink will be replaced with pex as well but the tub and shower will have to wait as I do not wish to dig into the wall for that right now. Later though for sure.:)

Thanks for the help.

Cheers

Foster
 

Majorshooter

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OK,found Katalox Light filter from searching this forum. I googled it and found it is the media.
So it is not an oxygen system.
removes:
♦ Iron (Inlet conc. up to. 100 mg/L)
♦ Manganese (Inlet conc. up to 20 mg/L)
♦ Arsenic
♦ Hydrogen sulfide
♦ Uranium, Radium
♦ Heavy Metals
♦ Radionuclide

So I see the need for the second tank for the iron and manganese as Katalox Light doent appear to handle the high numbers in my water.
My current system really dropped the numbers.
Iron 355 to 50
Manganese 146 to 0.5

So if I get another water softener tank I could rebed the tank with the Katalox Light media to remove the arsenic and my current tank would remove the remaining iron and manganese. Unless of course I could find a Katalox tank to start with.

So I would need to plumb the brine tank to both systems for regeneration?
Is there a certain head on the KL tank or one like I have be fine?
Programming for the KL tank?

Reach4, The settings you quoted are for the current water softener right?
So what do you mean by System info (not programmed).
I have the book that came with the tank and understand the Master Programming part.
Am reading it again now.

Cheers

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Majorshooter

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Programmed existing Fleck to the settings recommended by Reach4.

Old Fleck 5600SXT Settings:
DF = Gal ; Units
VT = dF1b OR dF2b ; Downflw/Upflw, Single OR double Backwash
CT = tc
NT = 1
DO = 3
RT = 2:00
BW = 10
Bd = 60
RR = 10
BF = 6
FM = 0.7

I had set the DO to 3 back when I got the system as I didn't know water state and erred on side of caution.
Should save water and salt with new settings I would imagine.
Display now reads time of day and a number (2102).
What is this number?

Cheers

Foster
 

Reach4

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I think 2102 would be the number of gallons of capacity remaining.

Katalox Light is one of the more expensive media. The system you were quoted was probably for an older media.

As for converting, KL needs a higher backwash rate than a softener does.

The main thing KL is usually used for is for iron, I think.

KL calculator: http://www.watchwater.com/systems/kl_system.php Note that its result is mostly based on the flow rate and iron concentration plays a lesser part in its algorithm. Its results call for high amounts.

Click Inbox above.
 

ditttohead

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You have a lot going on in this thread.

A softener for Asresnic reduction? Not gonna work unless it is a cation/anion blend which can be made to work but presents its own set of complexities...
KL for arsenic reduction, yes but not the KL. It is the introduction of iron onto the media that causes the reduction of the Arsenic, not the KL media itself...
 
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