Best Toilet for Large BMs

[Reach4]

I have not seen a Caroma toilet. But I know that you can't expect them all accept standard seats. I would think that most people like elongated toilets, and round is usually not elongated.

 

[Terry]

Most drains are 3"
When I have installed a Caroma with the 4" trap, 95% I'm dropping into a 3" drain.
I have sold many of the Caroma bowls with the 3" trapway and the results have been good. Just pick one you can afford, and it will be good.
A 3" trapway is 2.5 times the area of a 2" trapway.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Mart]

In terms of engineering, if the 3” trap is so much more efficient for large deposits, why isn’t it the typical industry standard? What’s the trade-off that drives Toto and most other to usually design with 2 1/8” (or so) traps, when so many people care about flushing power and probably never consider waste diameters and lengths?

For that matter, why doesn’t MaP/s testing protocol (link below) score toilets on deposits longer than 4” and wider than 1”? I take it from your earlier comments in this thread, Terry, that even a 1000 g MaP rating is essentially not material in assessing whether any toilet without a 3” trap will clog if it has to cope with a much larger-than-average, but not probably uncommon-size crap? Also hard to understand for average toilet-shopping consumers like me who likely otherwise assume that a 2” trap would usually accommodate a 2” diameter turd.

https://www.map-testing.com/assets/...l Version 7-Final-effective April 1, 2018.pdf
3.2.1 MaP test media is comprised of either of the following:
3.2.1.1 Cased Media: One or more 50 ± 4g test specimens (“test specimen”) consisting of soybean paste contained in latex casing, tied at each end forming a ‘sausage’, and meeting the requirements of Section 5.2, and four loosely crumpled balls of toilet paper (“paper”), OR
3.2.1.2 Uncased (Raw) Media: One or more 50 ± 4g test specimen (“test specimen”) consisting of extruded soybean paste meeting the requirements of Section 5.1 and four loosely crumpled balls of toilet paper (“paper”).
3.2.2 Each test specimen shall be 100 ± 13mm in length and 25 ± 6mm in diameter.

 

[Terry]

The Washdown toilets used in places like Europe and Australia are not at all like the North American toilets, dependent more on a siphon function and a better bowl rinse. The average stool is 3/4" x 4" which easily fits down a 2" trapway. Older toilets from the early 90's had 1-1/2" trapways and 2" was considered an upgrade. Map scores were hovering between 150 and 400 grams.
It's a rare situation that someone has very large stools, normally caused by a medical condition. Of the thousands of toilets I sell, most have what I call a standard 2" trapway. TOTO, Kohler, American Standard, Gerber to name a few brands. When someone asks the embarrassing question,
"What works for large stools?"
For that, basically for the 1% of the population, it's either a pressure assist, the Kohler Highline with the Flushmate is one, or any of the Caroma bowls. Should all toilets be made for the 1% and should we all learn to brush down the bowls after use like they do in other countries? If that's what you like sure. But as a 99%er, I prefer something that stays a bit cleaner without whoosh of the pressure assist and the splashy washdown of the Caroma. That being said, when I travel, that's when I'm most likely to wind up using a Caroma or a pressure assist.

 

[Mart]

Actually, with my 4 old circa 2000 3 GPF A.S. toilets, we’ve been exceptionally lucky, I guess, as we’ve never once had any of them clog. And though we’d be average “emitters” in the 99% club, I’m sure I’ve had more than a few extra-large stools over the decades. Anyway, I take your point — the trade-off is between cleaner bowls in the absence of pressure and/or extra water assistance and added capacity for those who constitute the 1%. But honestly, off-topic though it might be, it would be better all-round if the MaP protocol also tested for size and cleanliness differentials, don’t you think? Time for them to modernize, too, perhaps.

 

[Jadnashua]

Some medical conditions cause really slow waste movement through the bowel. This allows it to absorb lots of the moisture, making the thing particularly hard and stiff, and often, long as more and more gets added to the end before it decides it has to come out. Small and stiff, no problem for most. Long and stiff, it's like trying to move a log around a curve...sometimes, it's just too long.

Sometimes, the solution is lots of fiber and staying well hydrated, but some medicines can inhibit bowel contractions that move things along, and thus, the problem.

 

[Dezlboy]

INTRO: I'm going with the self-purchase and self-install of Caroma Caroma Stanley Smart II. Plumber was over for non-related issue, and saw Caroma in boxes. He tried to talk me into Gerber Viper 1.6 or American Standard Edgemere 1.28. But their 2'" traps ruled them out.

Plumber touted their 3" flush valve and he modifies the tank to hold more water for a "better" flush. Also said low flush toilets are geared for PVC pipes, while mine are circa 1938 cast iron with likely corrosion and thus not a smooth surface. He never heard of Caroma - and I believe more interested in what happens AFTER the BM is past the toilet into the waste pipes.

QUESTION: The opening at bottom of bowl (inside the bowl, not where wax ring goes) appears to be the same size as my current toilet. Measurement was by shoving my fist into each opening (I know, I know). Do you ever "see" the BM not make it into that opening? Sometimes mine are so large they get stuck in the bowl. I guess that's just an issue that the Caroma can't solve.

 

[Terry]

INTRO: I'm going with the self-purchase and self-install of Caroma Caroma Stanley Smart II. Plumber was over for non-related issue, and saw Caroma in boxes. He tried to talk me into Gerber Viper 1.6 or American Standard Edgemere 1.28. But their 2'" traps ruled them out.

Plumber touted their 3" flush valve and he modifies the tank to hold more water for a "better" flush. Also said low flush toilets are geared for PVC pipes, while mine are circa 1938 cast iron with likely corrosion and thus not a smooth surface. He never heard of Caroma - and I believe more interested in what happens AFTER the BM is past the toilet into the waste pipes.

QUESTION: The opening at bottom of bowl (inside the bowl, not where wax ring goes) appears to be the same size as my current toilet. Measurement was by shoving my fist into each opening (I know, I know). Do you ever "see" the BM not make it into that opening? Sometimes mine are so large they get stuck in the bowl. I guess that's just an issue that the Caroma can't solve.

If you're plugging up normal bowls with your BM's, then installing product limited to a 2" trapway isn't solving the problem, is it?
I've sold a few hundred of the Caroma bowls, mainly to those with your issue.
MaP test works with 3/4" x 4" stools. If you need to flush something like a 2" stool, then the Carama is what you should be looking at.
If you're worried about water in the tank, the Carama has buttons at the top, hold one down until the entire tank drains. That's more like 3 gallons.

 

[Dezlboy]

If you're plugging up normal bowls with your BM's, then installing product limited to a 2" trapway isn't solving the problem, is it?
I've sold a few hundred of the Caroma bowls, mainly to those with your issue.
MaP test works with 3/4" x 4" stools. If you need to flush something like a 2" stool, then the Carama is what you should be looking at.
If you're worried about water in the tank, the Carama has buttons at the top, hold one down until the entire tank drains. That's more like 3 gallons.

Terry, thanks for the reply, especially as you were kind enough to repeat yourself (again) for me. I tried to steer my plumber to think about the clog in the toilet, not the issue of "movement" through the drain pipe. He touted a toilet that he uses at home, but refused to let me try that product out at his house.

 

[Terry]

Terry, thanks for the reply, especially as you were kind enough to repeat yourself (again) for me. I tried to steer my plumber to think about the clog in the toilet, not the issue of "movement" through the drain pipe. He touted a toilet that he uses at home, but refused to let me try that product out at his house.

You've got this.
I almost was wondering if he was going to offer clear toilets on a weekly basis for you to back up his belief that all toilets handled large BM's the same.

 

[Toilet Novice]

You've got this.
I almost was wondering if he was going to offer clear toilets on a weekly basis for you to back up his belief that all toilets handled large BM's the same.

I had never heard of Caroma for this issue until discovering this website, and am grateful to have found about the brand and the insight (both the good and bad). I am zeroing in on the

Sydney Smart II One Piece
Easy Height Elongated
1.28/0.8 gpf (4.8/3L)
Dual Flush HET

It is available with "lever handles on left or right side of tank (987200/R)"

and also with "Top Mounted flushing buttons" (987150)

I have never used a toilet with buttons, but am not against it. I saw a comment (not on this message board) about some non-Carona toilet with buttons (can't remember which brand/model) complaining that the buttons were not holding up for long. That spooked me a little on buttons. I thought buttons might be harder to fix in terms of needing replacement buttons, whereas a traditional lever handle might hold up better and be easier to fix. Or maybe those who install Caromas have never heard of any problems with the buttons.

I thinking either would work for holding the button or handle for additional water.

If anyone has any insight on whether a handle or buttons might be preferable on this model, I would appreciate your insight.

Thanks!

P.S. The other model that I'm looking at is the Caravelle 989100 which costs more. Terry wrote, "Just pick one [Caroma] you can afford, and it will be good." That makes sense to me unless there is something that makes the Caravelle better than the Sydney (other than styling). From what I can see in the pictures, the Sydney Smart II tank has more rounded corners and edges, while the Caravelle tank is boxier. The rest of the toilet appears very similar to me. I think the main difference might be styling, but if there is some functional advantage to the Caravelle, that would be helpful in making a decision between the two.

 

[Terry]

If anyone has any insight on whether a handle or buttons might be preferable on this model, I would appreciate your insight.

It's rare that I ever have to service a Caroma. They hold up well.

 

[Dezlboy]

Review of Caroma Stanley Smart II after one month. As one of the one percent, the Caroma earns 5 stars!
The end to constant plunging is such a relief. No longer is "taking a dump" a pain in the ass.

Vast majority of times, one flush and done! Once in a while a second flush is needed. And rarely, need to hold down the flush button for a longer flush. Every time one flush didn't do the trick, the "stuff" did not move at all on the first flush. Sort of it it was stuck to the bowl with some in the trap hole. Never had an issue with the "stuff" actually getting stuck in the trap.

All in all, I never thought a toilet could be so satisfying.

 

[000]

This is a fantastic thread full of useful information for such a specific issue! I am so glad I found this site. Terry, I was wondering if there are any brands, other than Caroma, that use a 3” trapway? This brand unfortunately only produces ADA height bowls which ironically works against me. I need the shorter standard 15” height version. I read earlier in the thread someone else had this concern and you recommended using a stool, but I cannot use one for mobility reasons. What would your alternative brand recommendation be?

 

[i-guy]

Are there any toilets out there these days with both a 3" trapway and pressure assist? My kid's medical issue gives her stools that are not long but very wide, usually 2" but sometimes 3+" inches. The clogs can take 1h-plus to clear (we have a toilet auger now). I'm guessing that she needs the high-pressure to break it up, and a wider trapway wouldn't hurt.

 

[HomeownerinFlorida]

Review of Caroma Stanley Smart II after one month. As one of the one percent, the Caroma earns 5 stars!
The end to constant plunging is such a relief. No longer is "taking a dump" a pain in the ass.

Vast majority of times, one flush and done! Once in a while a second flush is needed. And rarely, need to hold down the flush button for a longer flush. Every time one flush didn't do the trick, the "stuff" did not move at all on the first flush. Sort of it it was stuck to the bowl with some in the trap hole. Never had an issue with the "stuff" actually getting stuck in the trap.

All in all, I never thought a toilet could be so satisfying.

 

[HomeownerinFlorida]

This may help others... I bought the Kohler pressure assist for my 1st house based on suggestions from this forum. I am totally happy with it. Made the plunger obsolete. At the time I bought the Kohler, I was single with no kids. The noise didn't bother me. BMs the size of Loui vill slugers go down with ease.

In my girlfriends house she has El cheapo toilets and they get stopped up about once a week. She doesn't like the noise of the Kohler in my house. It looks like I'm going to have to go with Carmona and just deal with the cleaning.

 

[HomeownerinFlorida]

I'm so pleased to find this thread.

Longstanding Problem:

(The efficiency experts all want to cite how many golf balls or whatever... they need to measure with Polish kielbasy [yes, that's the plural of kielbasa].)

Our yoga center; rest rooms have total nine toilets. People here are into healthy diets, high fiber and ruffage, not much animal protein. Result is generous extrusions (largest maybe 2 1/2" x 15", no exaggeration) which create a continual maintenance headache and burning sinuses.

My surmise is that the problem is (a) the size and curve of the trap and then, assuming the kielbasa can get beyond that, (b) the smallest diameter from there to wherever it's going. (Is that reasonable?) The toilets under $300 (x 9, Yikes) I've checked out online at Home Depot, Lowes, and plumbing supply houses have traps max 2 3/8". I've looked at macerators, but the trap is still the limitation.

Suggestions other than relocation?

I have a Caroma Sydney Smart II toilet. I have a healthy diet and get tons of fiber. Sorry to be gross but I have large BMs similar to what you described and they flush no problem. Caroma is the toilet you are probably looking for. They have a 4 inch trapway and can handle large amounts of waste.

 

[LA1]

If your son is in the 1% or so with a medical problem and produces long, hard stools, probably the best toilet for that is made by Caroma which has the largest trapway of any readily available toilet. Don't confuse flapper valve size with trapway size. It's not only the diameter of the trapway that makes a difference, it's how it is shaped. Toilets that try to make sharp turns are very tough on longer, harder inputs! The Toto line has a much nicer pathway than most out there.

Do not confuse suggested list prices with actual street prices on Toto toilets. For a fair estimate of what is a good price, check out Terry's storefront. While he does not sell outside of his area (he does not ship), you can use that as a negotiation price locally. Many models that work quite well from Toto are a lot less than that $500 pricetag.

i Have a Toto, I am 6'5" 215 lbs, still clog my Toto about 2-3x a month. I found putting dish soap in and working it down in works b/c dish soap is an emulsifier. I just want a toilet with a passageway about 15-20% bigger..or one of those government toilets with no tank, just a flush lever. push the handle down and everything goes even made my tie flutter lol.