Anyone familiar with RPS Water Pumps?

[curvecrazy]

I‘m in the market for a replacement motor for my well pump. My current 5 amp 1/2hp 220v 3 wire pump is pulling 7amps and 12amps when running. So I’m assuming that it’s running on limited time.

I came across RPS Water Pumps. They sell pumps and replacement motors under their own brand name. I asked if they’re motors are made by Franklin Electric or Pentair? They claimed to make their own pumps. Which would lead one to believe that they’re USA made. Or that’s at least what they seemed to be eluding to. On further questioning, the motors are made in Taiwan and China. They off a 2 year warranty, which requires that the pump be sent back to them. When asked what the lead time would be to replace a defective pump, the chat person didn’t respond. Also, asked if more than one fails in two years, whether yet another pump would be supplied to fulfill the promised 2 year warranty (many warranties give a warranty period, but they’ll only replace the item once in that time, leaving the customer still in the stated warranty period and the company refusing to honor the warranty as many times as necessary to get the customer through the promised warranty period), they also didn’t respond.
RPS is selling a 5amp 1/2hp 3 wire 220v motor for $239 and free shipping.

1/2HP / 220V Single Phase / 3 Wire / 3.85" RPS Pump Motor

Rugged stainless steel RPS Water Pumps 1/2HP motor end. Single phase, 220V, 3 wire (3+G). Includes a 6ft pump cable pigtail. Compatible with range of RPS Pump Ends including 05RPS05, 07RPS05, 10RPS05, 18RPS05, 25RPS05. Also compatible with pump ends from other brands such as Goulds, Grundfos...

www.rpswaterpumps.com

I guess RPS is into the solar pump field quite a bit. And, I guess they were into that before they got into the deep well submersible AC pumps.

RPS has 30 day returns (you ship) for a full refund if new unused. 60 day returns allow credit only. Which is kind of BS.

I was looking at Gould Centipro (MO5412) 1/2hp motors too, and I think I found a place selling those (Pentair) around $267 plus $40 some shipping.

Goulds M05412 1/2HP 4 Submersible Motor 230V 3 Wire 1Phase 60hz [M05412] - $268.67 : Water Pumps Pro | Commercial & Residential Water Pumps

Water Pumps Pro | Commercial & Residential Water Pumps Goulds M05412 1/2HP 4 Submersible Motor 230V 3 Wire 1Phase 60hz [M05412] - Goulds M05412 1/2HP 4 Submersible Motor 230V 3 Wire 1Phase 60hz Control Box Required for 3 Wire motors SINGLE-PHASE MOTORS: Three-Wire Motors 1/2 HP 230V FEATURES...

waterpumpspro.com

I’m also noticing that there’s 1/2hp 3 wire 220v Franklin Electric motors (Model #558757) that are listed as 1 speed. I’m presuming that that’s what I have now, because I have the old Franklin Electric “Solid State Starter Control Box” on the wall. As I understand it, Franklin Electric doesn’t warranty their pumps anymor, unless installed by a certified supplier?

I’m a bit confused, because all the newer motors seem to indicate variable speeds. And I’m not sure if I can replace an older single speed motor with a newer variable speed, and reuse my “start capacitor” control box?

And……

I am planning to install a CSV… so, I’m not sure which type motor would be better for that application.

I wanted to reuse my old Franklin pump end if possible, having read how the newer design floating ends aren’t as “worthy”. Although, maybe that’s a stupid idea.

 

[curvecrazy]

Update…
The customer service rep got back to me and said that their warranty policy includes a free shipping label to return the defective pump and free shipping for the pump replacement. And that the warranty would include unlimited replacement if need be.
That sounds good. But anyone who’s purchased inferior merchandise, especially something requiring labor to install, will acknowledge, that after the warranty replacement failed (too), that they’re not going to be inclined to continue on that vein.

In other news….. There’s various new (but stored for years) 1/2hp Franklin Electric pumps on Ebay, that are supposedly new, but manufacturer dates going back 10-20 years, and of unknown current condition(running or not). I could get one of these for about the same as a chinese pump, but, untested, possibly needing antifreeze fluid fill. I saw a previous post on that, which denoted removal of the motor bottom, and the diaphragm. I am not exactly clear on how (where) you’d top off the deionized water, (middle area where the diaphragm covers((presumably))) and how you’d be absolutely sure that there’s no air in there.

I suppose I could put it into a container of water, bottom up, maneuverings it this way and that to allow any air to bubble up, then assemble the bottom diaphragm while still underwater?
Ha ha.. No. How about this… Put it in a bag full of de-ionized water, then put a shop vac hose in the top and turn on the vacuum for 30 seconds or so while holding the top of the bag sealed tight around the vacuum nozzle! That should convince any free air inside the pump to airvacuate in the direction of the vacuum.

It’s clearly a better idea to get a recent built pump that would not have leaked coolant. And, which would actually have a warranty. But I’m thinking that the older pump is probably built better, and would perfect match my “Start Capacitor Control Box”.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[curvecrazy]

I ended up purchasing the 1/2hp 3 wire replacement motor from RPS. And also the wire splice kit. They offer a two year warranty and supposedly free return and replacement shipping if you have a failure.

I had considered Lowes and buy a Vevor. Just to use the motor on my pump end. My concern was prior reviews of those units being wired with 18 gage wire (30ft lead). But that turned into a complete fiasco. I couldn’t get straight answers from Lowes. They cover the vevor pumps for 30 days. For full refund if failure. Beyond that, it was unclear if I would be covered. Using a Lowes card supposedly might cover you for a year. But they wouldn’t commit to that. Supposedly, they have to order these in and scan the upc to determine if a restocking fee applies! Like what? And if you buy the purchase protection, it’s a third party provider and it’s out of their hands.
Trying to get intelligent answers out of them was pointless. How do you offer vevor submersible well pumps for sale and not have the details figured out to answer questions of prospective customers? You have to scan the item to know if there‘s going to be a restocking fee? Seriously?

So I’m waiting on the new RPS motor. Have to make sure that the check valve is functioning properly while I‘m in there. Sure hope it’s not just compromised/ corroded connections at the pump. But I guess I’ll see.

 

[Fitter30]

So your just replacing the motor not the whole pump? Did you compare the specs on the pump gpm, head and depth? Did you order their start box? Because you want to match the motor with start box.

 

[curvecrazy]

I ordered the replacement motor only($238). And the splice kit($7). Splice kit came with 5 crimps and sleeves. Free shipping over $100.

Discussion on this forum lead me to believe that the newer floating pump end designs are designed for planned obsolescence. Less quality materials compared to previous, and greater failure rates (No thank you). As I understand it, the 1/2hp pumps are all the same for the various gallon per minute ratings… the pump ends determining gallons per minute. More stages in the pump end being more expensive pump ends with greater head pressure capabilities. I had no issues with the performance of my original pump end. It has been getting us the water we need for 15 years that we’ve used it.
I had a complete Franklin Electric pump unit that I was replacing (before). It appeared to be manufactured in 2001. It was drawing excessive amps when pumping at 60 feet depth. And it had started hop skipping when building pressure from pressure switch “on”(40psi) to pressure switch “off”(60psi). It would start 38psi, stop at 41psi, rest, start stop at 44psi, rest, start and go until it hit the 60psi cutoff. So it wouldn’t pump straight through from start to stop any longer, but bounce i’s way up, while the pressure switch contacts remained closed feeding 240 volts. There’s something to do with load, because, tested, on the surface, in a large trash can, running on it’s original wire (1969? vintage) with 1” water line routed around back into the trash can, it would run great and steady and encouraging and show proper rated amp draw of 5 amps on black and yellow leads. Then, once dropped back into the well, it would be doing the same behavior again. 12 amps on the yellow and 7 amps on the black.. and voltage at the one side of the pressure switch bouncing up and down erratically in the first half of it’s pressure build travel. Weird. Must be something internal with the windings. One side of the pressure switch power was bouncing as far down as like 6 volts from 120 volts… until it hit 45 psi or so, then it would draw the clean 120 volts, no bouncing voltage.
I simply removed the original motor and checked the pump end for any signs of damage or binding. It seemed fine. So I replaced the original Franklin motor with the RPS motor. The RPS motor is the same. 240 volt three wire with the 5 amp rating. RPS instructed me that my original Franklin Electric “Solid State Starter Box” should work fine. My capacitor failed in (during) this process of me testing the old pump and the new. It was at least 15 years old. I replaced it with a new one from the local electrical motor repair shop. Like for like. 59-71mfd. And then I was back in business. I changed out the old pump wiring with new 12/3 solid submersible wire from Lowes. The old wire was that flat stuff, stranded, with grey sheath. It was spliced in several places and it wasn’t showing pretty. Various air bubbles in the casing, and BB like protrusions in the area that had been submerged, and rub spots through the outer insulation, one rubbed right through to the starter wire (red) stranded core. I didn’t trust it. So I replaced the whole thing. It was due.

It’s my understanding that any control box will work in the =/- 1hp designation with a 1/2hp 3 wire 240 motor. The 1/2hp box is probably most ideal, as the capacitor rating is designed to be right in the sweet spot. But, it’s my understanding that there’s no magic that’s attained by using the manufacturer specific box with the manufacturer specific motor. They all do the same thing. The capacitor sends a jolt of current to the motor to get it moving from static “cling”. From there, 122 volts is sent on each leg (black/ yellow). The motor has what it needs and it goes.
I haven‘t gotten around to checking the running voltage on the new motor after dropping it down in the well. It was reading 6.4amps test running in the trash can on the surface. I ran it steady for about 5 minutes, then dropped it down into the well. I did check the pressure switch voltages, and the one leg is now pulling 120volts with no jumping around at all. I‘ll get around to checking the amps installed in the well soon. It’s in there, pumping water, and she’s happy. As opposed to how very unhappy she was when the capacitor failed and I couldn’t make anything work and no water in the house for 12 hours. We had been buying time limping along on that old worn Franklin motor. It was on it’s last legs. In that respect, I’m very happy that it’s changed out and it’s working and running issue free again.

The electrical motor repair shop has a brand new control box for 3/4hp pump, which has a slightly higher rated capacitor(86mfd), for $50. I was tempted to just throw that on there. But it’s been running no issues since Tuesday night. I should grab a backup capacitor for the shelf. Not a bad idea for future failures.
The RPS pump motor came by UPS ground in three days from CA to NY. I had paid for USPS Priority 3 day ($11.94). I contacted them by email and received a timely refund for the USPS Priority shipping. Pump motor has a two year warranty. Not bad as most manufacturers are giving just 12 months now. Deal is that you contact them if you have an issue, they attempt to troubleshoot. If it’s wired right etc… they send you out a new pump motor free of charge and pay for return shipping of the problem pump motor back to them for analysis. Once I gave them a chance, they seem like a pretty straight forward supplier. Easy to deal with so far. Included was a high quality detailed installation book, walking the novice installer through all phases of installation. They claim that their pumps are built for 15 years typical lifespan. Guess time will tell right?
I did open up the end of the pump and top up the coolant, which seemed low. Distilled water. Removed all air as has been specified by here on the forum. It appears to have been manufactured in 2022.
I considered the Goulds 1/2hp motors on ebay. The warranty wasn’t as long, and they were more expensive.
I’m hopeful.

 

[Fitter30]

I ordered the replacement motor only($238). And the splice kit($7). Splice kit came with 5 crimps and sleeves. Free shipping over $100.

Discussion on this forum lead me to believe that the newer floating pump end designs are designed for planned obsolescence. Less quality materials compared to previous, and greater failure rates (No thank you). As I understand it, the 1/2hp pumps are all the same for the various gallon per minute ratings… the pump ends determining gallons per minute. More stages in the pump end being more expensive pump ends with greater head pressure capabilities. I had no issues with the performance of my original pump end. It has been getting us the water we need for 15 years that we’ve used it.
I had a complete Franklin Electric pump unit that I was replacing (before). It appeared to be manufactured in 2001. It was drawing excessive amps when pumping at 60 feet depth. And it had started hop skipping when building pressure from pressure switch “on”(40psi) to pressure switch “off”(60psi). It would start 38psi, stop at 41psi, rest, start stop at 44psi, rest, start and go until it hit the 60psi cutoff. So it wouldn’t pump straight through from start to stop any longer, but bounce i’s way up, while the pressure switch contacts remained closed feeding 240 volts. There’s something to do with load, because, tested, on the surface, in a large trash can, running on it’s original wire (1969? vintage) with 1” water line routed around back into the trash can, it would run great and steady and encouraging and show proper rated amp draw of 5 amps on black and yellow leads. Then, once dropped back into the well, it would be doing the same behavior again. 12 amps on the yellow and 7 amps on the black.. and voltage at the one side of the pressure switch bouncing up and down erratically in the first half of it’s pressure build travel. Weird. Must be something internal with the windings. One side of the pressure switch power was bouncing as far down as like 6 volts from 120 volts… until it hit 45 psi or so, then it would draw the clean 120 volts, no bouncing voltage.
I simply removed the original motor and checked the pump end for any signs of damage or binding. It seemed fine. So I replaced the original Franklin motor with the RPS motor. The RPS motor is the same. 240 volt three wire with the 5 amp rating. RPS instructed me that my original Franklin Electric “Solid State Starter Box” should work fine. My capacitor failed in (during) this process of me testing the old pump and the new. It was at least 15 years old. I replaced it with a new one from the local electrical motor repair shop. Like for like. 59-71mfd. And then I was back in business. I changed out the old pump wiring with new 12/3 solid submersible wire from Lowes. The old wire was that flat stuff, stranded, with grey sheath. It was spliced in several places and it wasn’t showing pretty. Various air bubbles in the casing, and BB like protrusions in the area that had been submerged, and rub spots through the outer insulation, one rubbed right through to the starter wire (red) stranded core. I didn’t trust it. So I replaced the whole thing. It was due.

It’s my understanding that any control box will work in the =/- 1hp designation with a 1/2hp 3 wire 240 motor. The 1/2hp box is probably most ideal, as the capacitor rating is designed to be right in the sweet spot. But, it’s my understanding that there’s no magic that’s attained by using the manufacturer specific box with the manufacturer specific motor. They all do the same thing. The capacitor sends a jolt of current to the motor to get it moving from static “cling”. From there, 122 volts is sent on each leg (black/ yellow). The motor has what it needs and it goes.
I haven‘t gotten around to checking the running voltage on the new motor after dropping it down in the well. It was reading 6.4amps test running in the trash can on the surface. I ran it steady for about 5 minutes, then dropped it down into the well. I did check the pressure switch voltages, and the one leg is now pulling 120volts with no jumping around at all. I‘ll get around to checking the amps installed in the well soon. It’s in there, pumping water, and she’s happy. As opposed to how very unhappy she was when the capacitor failed and I couldn’t make anything work and no water in the house for 12 hours. We had been buying time limping along on that old worn Franklin motor. It was on it’s last legs. In that respect, I’m very happy that it’s changed out and it’s working and running issue free again.

The electrical motor repair shop has a brand new control box for 3/4hp pump, which has a slightly higher rated capacitor(86mfd), for $50. I was tempted to just throw that on there. But it’s been running no issues since Tuesday night. I should grab a backup capacitor for the shelf. Not a bad idea for future failures.
The RPS pump motor came by UPS ground in three days from CA to NY. I had paid for USPS Priority 3 day ($11.94). I contacted them by email and received a timely refund for the USPS Priority shipping. Pump motor has a two year warranty. Not bad as most manufacturers are giving just 12 months now. Deal is that you contact them if you have an issue, they attempt to troubleshoot. If it’s wired right etc… they send you out a new pump motor free of charge and pay for return shipping of the problem pump motor back to them for analysis. Once I gave them a chance, they seem like a pretty straight forward supplier. Easy to deal with so far. Included was a high quality detailed installation book, walking the novice installer through all phases of installation. They claim that their pumps are built for 15 years typical lifespan. Guess time will tell right?
I did open up the end of the pump and top up the coolant, which seemed low. Distilled water. Removed all air as has been specified by here on the forum. It appears to have been manufactured in 2022.
I considered the Goulds 1/2hp motors on ebay. The warranty wasn’t as long, and they were more expensive.
I’m hopeful.

Motors all not the same and don't all use the same starter box will one work with another motor. But capacitor maybe a difference in capacity and the potential or solid state relay would have a different pick up voltage. That pickup voltage is when the capacitor drops out. When i go through all the work to do a job that would have to pull a pump replace a motor i want the best long term outcome.

 

[curvecrazy]

Well… it’s been working fine and great so far. I can’t argue with you on electric motor technical. And RPS technical support assured me that my 1/2hp Solid State Franklin Starter box and 59-72 size capacitor would work fine.. with their 1/2hp motor, no need to buy theirs or to get something else. The local electrical place also explained that it’s not critical. They said I could use the 3/4hp box with a slightly larger capacitor(too), and that it would work fine. Theyeven went as far as to say that a 1hp control box would work fine on anything under 1hp! Correct? Wrong? I really don’t know. I would rather just use the right one, naturally. But the supplier and my local knowledge base (electrical motor repair people that repair and test electric motors all day long every single day) are both giving me the green light. And, my pump is, so far, working fine.

I’m thinking that ((you)) probably know more than both? {{{{HUMOR.. not really}}}}

If I have problems, I’ll be sure to post up, and update everyne, not that anyone (but you) seems to care. I really thought that I’d have more response to this post, or I wouldn’t have posted up at all! fwiw. ‍♂️

 

[Valveman]

I would have replied earlier, but I have no experience with RPS motors. I thought they made solar pumps. Their motor looks like a copy of a Franklin, which many are. There is not much difference in the other brands that I know of. Everybody makes the connections Nema Standard, so everyone's motor will interchange with all other pumps. I don't see much difference in control boxes either. Time is the only thing that matters. Maybe you will come back here and let us know how good RPS motors are? I am always looking for a better quality pump or motor, but I haven't seen any improvements made by any company in a long time.