Fleck 9000 Issue & Unusual Set-up?

[Reach4]

o new hiccup in this problem. I am still waiting for the results of the water test. I have been regenerating the 5600 every night which has been working so far. Go into the basement today and find that the brine tank for the 5600 is completely full of water and now trickling out onto the floor. The head unit/valve body on the 5600 appears to be allowing a small amount of water to be continuously trickling into the brine tank. The 5600 is currently in Service mode. Thoughts?

You have at least two problems with that softener. The safety float should have prevented that. Plus some other problem must exist. Either too much water is being injected, or the brine is not being drawn out.

I am presuming that the 5600 softener has its own brine tank, and that tank has a safety float.

 

[ditttohead]

The Fleck and Clack safety floats are designed to prevent these slow flow failures, the imported safety floats are not well designed and will usually fail when the brine valve leaks slowly. Remove the brine line from the 5600 valve and wait a few minutes, you should not get ANY leakage past the brine valve in the service position. Any leakage, even a drip every 5 minutes will cause the problem you are seeing. It is common to replace the brine valve and o-ring when you rebuild the seal and spacer kits.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Thank you everyone for your help so far! I did remove the brine line from the valve body. There was a steady slow flow of water coming out of it. I pulled the float out of the brine tank and cleaned it. It had a lot of rust on it. I also pulled the piston and brine valve and gave them a quick cleaning to try to get me by for the weekend. That stopped the continual flow. I then hand scooped a bunch of water out of the brine tank to lower the level about 6 inches from the overflow. That night the system regenerated when I checked it in the morning the brine line was not continually running anymore, but the tank was full to the overflow again. I had ordered a piston, seal, and brine valve rebuild kit for the 5600 which showed up today. I will be installing that tonight. Any idea if there is a way to force the system to drain the brine tank or do I have to manually scoop the water and salt out? Also, how do I test the float?

To answer Reach4's question, yes the setup has a separate brine tank with a safety float.

Also, I am still waiting on the water test results.

Again, thank you for your help!

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Never mind in regards to draining the brine tank. Reading through the service manual I see that there should be a "Brine Draw" setting. I will give that a try.

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Sorry, should also mention that I will blow through the drain line as recommended to ensure that it is not obstructed.

 

[Bannerman]

The Braw Draw phrase of regeneration will be 60 minutes duration. That phase is actually 2 combined processes, Brine Draw and Slow Rinse. With the usual quantity of brine, the brine will be typically transferred from the brine tank to the media tank within approx 15 minutes, and the remaining ~45 minutes will slowly rinse the resin to drain to flush away calcium, magnesium and excess brine.

Because there is an excess of brine currently within the brine tank that will likely take longer than 15 minutes to transfer, the remaining slow rinse time will then be insufficient so the initial flow to faucets after this regeneration may taste salty as a result.

Since you are planning to perform a manual regeneration after rebuilding the 5600, to prevent the initial salty flow, suggest extending the Brine Draw/Slow Rinse by removing the power plug during the Brine Draw phase of regeneration. Without power, the valve cannot proceed to the next step so slow rinse will continue until power is restored. You could set a timer on your phone to remind you when to restore power. If you allow 60 minutes BD/SR and then restore power, the programmed BD/SR time remaining will continue and the remaining regeneration cycle will continue until completed.

The brine pickup assembly if Fleck or Clack should not be rusty as it is primarily plastic. Suggest including a photo.

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Bannerman, thank you for the suggestions. I put the rebuild kit in the 5600 last night and blew the drain hose out. The drain hose was not obstructed. I then scooped most of the salt out of the brine tank so that I could keep an eye on the water level. I regenerated the softener twice last night to monitor the water level in the brine tank. It stayed consistent, so it appears that the issue is resolved. The water in the bottom of the brine tank is extremely dirty and there is some rust staining on the float as previously mentioned. I assume that I can clean the brine tank out?

Also, I am more than happy to post pictures, however this forum does not seem to allow me to imbed them like the other forums that I participate in. Who do you recommend for picture hosting?

 

[Reach4]

It stayed consistent, so it appears that the issue is resolved. The water in the bottom of the brine tank is extremely dirty and there is some rust staining on the float as previously mentioned. I assume that I can clean the brine tank out?

Nice. So now you know how often you should clean out your brine tank -- maybe half the time since the previous cleaning.

 

[Bannerman]

Photos 800 pixels or less may be included directly as an attachment within this thread.

The fluid level maybe viewed in the brine well when the salt height is above the brine.

Because Brine Fill is the final stage of regeneration, the water that enters will prepare the appropriate quantity of brine for the following regeneration cycle. After cleaning the brine tank, there will be no brine prepared for the following cycle so water will need to be manually added. Although each gallon will dissolve 3 lbs salt, if your 5600 is currently configured to use 9 lbs per cycle, suggest adding 3.5-4 gallons with a bucket as there will some amount of fluid which remains in the brine tank after each brine draw. Water that is manually added to the brine tank should be poured into the brine well so as to not dissolve the dry salt that is above the liquid level.

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Reach4, yup you got me there. I am pretty particular about maintaining my vehicles and toys. Honestly it never occurred to me that the softener had a maintenance cycle. It's just a thing in the basement that you pour salt into and it magically works. I'm learning differently obviously. We have lived here for roughly 8 years and it was a bank repo before that that sat mostly empty other than an occasional renter for it's life before that since being built in 06 (was foreclosed on mid-construction), so I am guessing that it has never been cleaned since being installed 14 years ago. That won't happen again.

Bannerman, I'll get some pictures shortly.

 

[Reach4]

so I am guessing that it has never been cleaned since being installed 14 years ago. That won't happen again.

So every 7 years is what, 2000 to 4000 pounds of salt? The number of pounds of salt to go through will vary with the salt and the size of the brine tank.

Here is a prior discussion: https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/thoughts-on-how-often-to-clean-the-brine-tank.62381/

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Ok, figured it out. This is the overall system.

This is looking down the brine tank of the 5600 (the square brine tank in the previous picture). I still have just a minimum amount of salt in it because I planned on cleaning it tonight.

This is the components that are in the brine well.

And this is a closeup of the bottom section. I had previously done a quick cleaning on this, but I did not try to disassemble it, so you can see the rust if you look between it and the line.

Let me know if you need pictures of any other part of it.

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Bannerman, I apologize, I just reread your post and realized that I was not clear before. The pickup is not actually rusty, it is plastic as you mention. It was just covered in a film of rust.

 

[Bannerman]

The aircheck grill at the bottom appears to be genuine Fleck but I don't see a safety valve or safety float located near the top of the tube.

The aircheck grill houses a floating ball that will lower as the brine level decreases, which will come to rest on and close off the brine tube opening to prevent air from being drawn into the 5600 when the brine level is low. The additional brine remaining in the tank during Brine Draw mentioned earlier, will be below the Check Height line shown on the grill.

The safety valve and float are utilized to prevent overflow incase the brine tank becomes too filled with fluid. The safety valve and float will be located within the brine well so unless you removed the float and relocated the brine well cap below the safety valve with the float removed, the setup does not appear usual.

 

[Water Pro]

Ok, figured it out. This is the overall system.

View attachment 68184


This is looking down the brine tank of the 5600 (the square brine tank in the previous picture). I still have just a minimum amount of salt in it because I planned on cleaning it tonight.

View attachment 68185


This is the components that are in the brine well.

View attachment 68186

And this is a closeup of the bottom section. I had previously done a quick cleaning on this, but I did not try to disassemble it, so you can see the rust if you look between it and the line.

View attachment 68187

Let me know if you need pictures of any other part of it.

apologize for not believing you about the constant fill. it is rarely an issue even if the brine valve is sticking because MOST float designs will not allow it to constantly fill. your design is rather simple and (if I remember correctly) has a check ball in the bottom and no actual float mechanism. it's more of just a fill/brine tube. edit. didn't see bannerman s post discussing this exact thing. lol

 

[Water Pro]

Reach4, yup you got me there. I am pretty particular about maintaining my vehicles and toys. Honestly it never occurred to me that the softener had a maintenance cycle. It's just a thing in the basement that you pour salt into and it magically works. I'm learning differently obviously. We have lived here for roughly 8 years and it was a bank repo before that that sat mostly empty other than an occasional renter for it's life before that since being built in 06 (was foreclosed on mid-construction), so I am guessing that it has never been cleaned since being installed 14 years ago. That won't happen again.

Bannerman, I'll get some pictures shortly.

your going to be a pro at this by the time your done. lol

 

[ClassicMuscle]

Bannerman and Water Pro,
You are correct in that there is not any form of a float in the brine tank or well. Just the aircheck with the ball at the bottom. Should I add a float setup to this?

 

[Reach4]

You are correct in that there is not any form of a float in the brine tank or well. Just the aircheck with the ball at the bottom. Should I add a float setup to this?

It is usual to have one. It would have prevented the trickling onto the floor. On the other hand, if it had not trickled onto the floor, you might not have noticed the need for seal changing. You could have gone through a lot more salt. Click Inbox, above.

 

[Bannerman]

Suggest ensuring both softeners are equipped with a safety valve and float. Not only will they prevent brine tank overflow due to malfunction, but since each valve utilizes electrical power to advance through each stage of regeneration, if there was to be a power outage while Brine Fill is taking place, the brine tank will continue to fill until after power is restored.

Here is a link to a page which shows the complete Fleck 2310 assembly including safety valve and float. Each component maybe purchased separately if desired.

https://www.barnstead-water.com/spe...185&title=2310BV-COM+2310+Safety+W/PU+&+Float

 

[ClassicMuscle]

The water test results just showed up. Here are the items that were detected:

Calcium - 223.4 mg/L
Copper - 0.006 mg/L
Iron - 3.555 mg/L
Lithium - 0.045 mg/L
Magnesium - 73.30 mg/L
Manganese - 0.134 mg/L
Potassium - 9.4 mg/L
Silica - 25.0 mg/L
Sodium - 183 mg/L
Strontium - 2.382 mg/L
Zinc - 0.037 mg/L

Alkalinity (Total as CaCO3) - 320 mg/L
Hardness - 860 mg/L
PH - 7.2
Total Dissolved Solids - 1600 mg/L
Turbidity - 38.0

Chloride - 7.5 mg/L
Sulfate - 930.0 mg/L

What next