Bad Pressure Tank need advice to move forward.

[Larry C Moe]

I know almost nothing about forums and have about the same knowledge on pressure tanks. It's been almost 2 weeks with limited water for my family of 3. I need advice on how to move forward on this. I will try to make this brief as possible. About 2 weeks ago we got a deep freeze 11 below zero.
The next morning the water pump was down. I took a look at it and didn't see that the switch was bad, I have replaced them in the past but I was tried and I guess I didn't see one side of the contacts was flipped out a wack. Called a local guy and got charged $220 for a darn switch replacement. (^*%&^(*(&&^&. Not really complaining, the guy got here fast was very friendly.
Anyway, our well, is about 55 feet from the house the pump and tank are underground in an (lack of better term) old bucket lift well, that I guess was filled with rock to make a floor than they made a concrete cap with an access entry. From the access hole to the pump is about 8 feet down.
When down inside the area, there are to rounded sections, one section is about 3 feet in diameter and the adjoining round section is about 4 feet in diameter. The Sta-Rite Jet pump sits halfway between the two sections with the suction pipe right in the middle of the smaller section and the old Sears vertical 86-gallon pressure tank sits in the lager section kind of haphazardly on a few cinder blocks. Original house is well over 100 years old 2nd story was added at some point and another first-floor addition was adder later. The old Sears pressure tank has an water inlet about 1 foot up from the bottom of the tank and the outlet is on the other side of the tank about 2 inches from the bottom of the tank. There is no tee fitting. I have tried to find similar tanks but have not found anything like it as far as I can tell. I have seen a few that have the larger what look to be inlets and outlets, but I don't know if that is what they actually are. I'm under a lot of stress here and I'm sorry if I'm giving to much information. The old Sears tank is about 19" wide by 61" high. I can't find any tanks that are 19" wide, it's very tight down there and I'm worried a larger diameter tank won't work and the wider it is the harder it will be to get it down in there. If I were to buy a tee-fitting style tank, I'm not sure I would be able to plumb it out it's just tough to move in there, and I'm not a (6'2" 300lbs) small guy. So, can anyone tell me about the tank I have and where I can get one? Also, I was thinking about going with the CSV / PK1A but how do I determine if our plumbing can handle it? It's also kind of worries me that the PK1A only has a 12-month warrantee.
Any help here will be extremely appreciated.

 

[Reach4]

How big is the well pipe -- 2 inch ID 2.4 inch OD? If you say 4 inches OD or bigger then we will discuss submersible pumps.

https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick is a combo package. https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick

You may be able to negotiate to buy an extended warranty. Not sure.

Without a CSV, WX-203 is the best fit that I know of https://www.supplyhouse.com/Amtrol-...32-Gal-WELL-X-TROL-Well-Tank-w-Durabase-Stand A skinny 15 inch wide 47" tall

If the old tank is galvanized that WX-203 might act like a bigger tank than the old tank, BUT if you had a galvanized tank, there would have been a way to inject air. You no longer would want to inject air.

I did not study your description totally, but it sounds like you have a pit. Pits flood, and changing things to not have a pit is the right thing to do. As a workaround, put in a utility pump with a switch that can automatically turn the pump on before the water rises enough to contaminate the well. Pump the water up and into the yard.

So if you want to discuss improvements, tell us more about your pit and well. Maybe post a photo or two.

 

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[LLigetfa]

From your description, I say you have a hydro-pneumatic tank which requires a means to maintain air above the water. Those tanks don't need to be replaced unless they are rusted out and leak beyond repair. I've seen some with so many wood slivers poked into the holes that it looks like a porcupine. What fails on them is the AVC (Air Volume Control).

Why do you think the tank is bad?

 

[Larry C Moe]

How big is the well pipe -- 2 inch ID 2.4 inch OD? If you say 4 inches OD or bigger then we will discuss submersible pumps.

https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick is a combo package. https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick

You may be able to negotiate to buy an extended warranty. Not sure.

Without a CSV, WX-203 is the best fit that I know of https://www.supplyhouse.com/Amtrol-...32-Gal-WELL-X-TROL-Well-Tank-w-Durabase-Stand A skinny 15 inch wide 47" tall

If the old tank is galvanized that WX-203 might act like a bigger tank than the old tank, BUT if you had a galvanized tank, there would have been a way to inject air. You no longer would want to inject air.

I did not study your description totally, but it sounds like you have a pit. Pits flood, and changing things to not have a pit is the right thing to do. As a workaround, put in a utility pump with a switch that can automatically turn the pump on before the water rises enough to contaminate the well. Pump the water up and into the yard.

So if you want to discuss improvements, tell us more about your pit and well. Maybe post a photo or two.

Not sure of well pipe size I will measure it soon as I get a chance. I know the PVC running to the tank is 1 1/4 OD with a larger male thread adaptor for both in and out of the tank. Thanks for the info, I will reply again ASAP. The pit has never flooded we are probably on the highest ground for miles around and immediately around the pit it slopes down about 15%. Most of our neighbors get flooded every year. I remember over hearing my father-in-law (deceased) talking/ laughing at his insurance agent who was try to sell him flood insurance, he then said you have never been here have you.? LOL He lived here for 60 years.

 

[Larry C Moe]

From your description, I say you have a hydro-pneumatic tank which requires a means to maintain air above the water. Those tanks don't need to be replaced unless they are rusted out and leak beyond repair. I've seen some with so many wood slivers poked into the holes that it looks like a porcupine. What fails on them is the AVC (Air Volume Control).

Why do you think the tank is bad?

The tank has a small steady stream leak just below the water outlet it's all rusted right there and as far as I can tell the leak is right on the corner. The tank does have a Schrader valve near the top of the tank, it will still take some pressure but the more air I put in the faster the leak gets. Also, when filling with air and I pull off the hose the Schrader valve spits out some water. Now that I think about it, I believe my father-in-law installed a new bladder in this tank.

 

[Larry C Moe]

How big is the well pipe -- 2 inch ID 2.4 inch OD? If you say 4 inches OD or bigger then we will discuss submersible pumps.

https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick is a combo package. https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick

You may be able to negotiate to buy an extended warranty. Not sure.

Without a CSV, WX-203 is the best fit that I know of https://www.supplyhouse.com/Amtrol-...32-Gal-WELL-X-TROL-Well-Tank-w-Durabase-Stand A skinny 15 inch wide 47" tall

If the old tank is galvanized that WX-203 might act like a bigger tank than the old tank, BUT if you had a galvanized tank, there would have been a way to inject air. You no longer would want to inject air.

I did not study your description totally, but it sounds like you have a pit. Pits flood, and changing things to not have a pit is the right thing to do. As a workaround, put in a utility pump with a switch that can automatically turn the pump on before the water rises enough to contaminate the well. Pump the water up and into the yard.

So if you want to discuss improvements, tell us more about your pit and well. Maybe post a photo or two.

Ok, I posted 3 photos, please have a look. The water in there is from the resent leak from the tank, I can't say it has never flooded from rain but to the best of my knowledge is has not, again we are on very high ground. We would love to improve the pit but at this point in time it's not an option. Thanks

 

[Larry C Moe]

The tank has a small steady stream leak just below the water outlet it's all rusted right there and as far as I can tell the leak is right on the corner. The tank does have a Schrader valve near the top of the tank, it will still take some pressure but the more air I put in the faster the leak gets. Also, when filling with air and I pull off the hose the Schrader valve spits out some water. Now that I think about it, I believe my father-in-law installed a new bladder in this tank.

Ok, I posted 3 photos, please have a look. Thanks

 

[Valveman]

Sorry for the delay. Perfect application for the PK1A with the 4.5 gallon size tank. I don't see any airmaker in the system, which is not needed with the PK1A or a bladder style tank anyway. The tank on the PK1A has a 6 year warranty, and it the only thing likely to fail. The CSV is a simple valve which will last many decades as long as you don't let it freeze of burn the well house down. We could offer a 20 year warranty on the CSV and it would make any difference. Warranty is only for something that was manufactured incorrectly, which if happens will show up the first day not after 20 years. The CSV will deliver much stronger pressure and make your pump last several times longer than normal.

 

[Larry C Moe]

Sorry for the delay. Perfect application for the PK1A with the 4.5 gallon size tank. I don't see any airmaker in the system, which is not needed with the PK1A or a bladder style tank anyway. The tank on the PK1A has a 6 year warranty, and it the only thing likely to fail. The CSV is a simple valve which will last many decades as long as you don't let it freeze of burn the well house down. We could offer a 20 year warranty on the CSV and it would make any difference. Warranty is only for something that was manufactured incorrectly, which if happens will show up the first day not after 20 years. The CSV will deliver much stronger pressure and make your pump last several times longer than normal.

Oh, great thank you so much for the information, I will be ordering it today. I'm so glad I came here; I can't thank you enough.

 

[Larry C Moe]

Oh, great thank you so much for the information, I will be ordering it today. I'm so glad I came here; I can't thank you enough.

This is what I should order correct?

Custom PK1A PSIDE-KICK Pressure Tank Kit $497​

 

[Larry C Moe]

This is what I should order correct?

Custom PK1A PSIDE-KICK Pressure Tank Kit $497​

I didn't see the link till now....I will order from the link do I need to clear cookies?

 

[Valveman]

Sorry. I should have just given you the link. https://cyclestopvalves.com/collections/frontpage/products/custom-pk1a-pside-kick-kit

In the boxes below check the standard pressure switch at 30/50 and the 4.5 gallon tank size. If your pump will do it I can help you turn the pressure up to 40/60. But most jet pumps come at 30/50 because that is all they can make.

 

[Reach4]

Oh, great thank you so much for the information, I will be ordering it today. I'm so glad I came here; I can't thank you enough.

If that jet pump goes out, you might want to put in a 1/2 HP 10 gpm submersible, with a flow inducer instead. That will probably outperform a 1 HP jet pump, and no priming.

That can feed the CSV also.

 

[Larry C Moe]

If that jet pump goes out, you might want to put in a 1/2 HP 10 gpm submersible, with a flow inducer instead. That will probably outperform a 1 HP jet pump, and no priming.

That can feed the CSV also.

Oh, the pump we have is just a 1/2 HP, is there a chance our pump won'
t handle this set up? The pump was new the end of 2019 and it cost a small fortune the well man that was here said it was still in great shape.

​

 

[Reach4]

I think I may have confused your well with somebody else's. Does your suction pipe suck from a big hole, or a small hole. If a small hole, you would not able to switch to a submersible.

If your pump is ever able to pump, but not pump to more than about 20 or so PSI, the jet could be clogged. We can tell you how to clear that. For now, forget my comments on the pump regarding a potential submersible.

 

[Larry C Moe]

I think I may have confused your well with somebody else's. Does your suction pipe suck from a big hole, or a small hole. If a small hole, you would not able to switch to a submersible.

If your pump is ever able to pump, but not pump to more than about 20 or so PSI, the jet could be clogged. We can tell you how to clear that. For now, forget my comments on the pump regarding a potential submersible.

Here is a picture.

 

[Valveman]

Just stay with the 30/50 pressure as that is probably all your 1/2HP pump can make. But it will work fine with a CSV.

 

[Larry C Moe]

Just stay with the 30/50 pressure as that is probably all your 1/2HP pump can make. But it will work fine with a CSV.

I'm sorry, I still have some questions. First would there be any benefit in ordering the larger 10-gallon tank.? or is that only for pumps that can make more pressure.
Also, we have an 86-gallon (toasted now ) pressure tank and the pressure in the house was pretty good, will we get as good pressure with the system you suggest.? I do realize that an 86-gallon tank does not hold 86 gallons of water, but like I mentioned the pressure was pretty good. We just had to another expenditure come up with a car breakdown yesterday and we could not order it till we had an idea of cash availability. Again, sorry for asking more questions, but I have two woman that are depending on me to get this right and if I don't, I will be down the well without a paddle.

 

[Larry C Moe]

Just stay with the 30/50 pressure as that is probably all your 1/2HP pump can make. But it will work fine with a CSV.

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Date 01/09/2023