Toto Drake Gmax Fill Valve Issues - stutters as toilet tank finishes filling

**suceress** · 12-11-2012, 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by Terry

Lowes Hardware carries the 528MPK valve, which is like the 528T except it will work with more toilets.

If you have a Drake, it's the Red Flapper, also sold at Lowes.

Thank you! It's actually cheaper at Lowes-- well, it won't be once I add the tax and the gas to get there, but it will only take a few hours to get there and back vs waiting a few days for ordering from amazon. I hope that they actually have it in stock up there. Those site to store things where they say it will be available "today" never actually work out that way in my experience. I wonder if I will even need a new flapper if the old one is in good condition. I suppose I can try it out and if the old one doesn't work then I can get a new one. I should probably pick up a new one and keep it on hand just in case.

**Terry** · 12-11-2012, 08:28 PM

It doesn't hurt to have a spare flapper. If you don't need it, it will save a drive later.

**wjcandee** · 12-11-2012, 10:17 PM

Your question about the lever: there are lots of levers from many manufacturers available online and at your plumbing supply that will work with that Toto; you just need one that is appropriate for the location it is in the tank (i.e. side lever).

And remember that the toilet lever is one of the only reverse-threaded items that you'll find in the house. That is, instead of lefty-loosy, righty-tighty (i.e. clockwise to tighten), you will turn the nut clockwise to LOOSEN the nut holding the handle in place, and counterclockwise to tighten it.

**gusherb94** · 12-12-2012, 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by Terry

From my experiences, The Fluidmaster 400 series overfills "all" bowls.
I shot video of one American Standard toilet that overfilled the bowl by two gallons.
The toilet was on a stand and draining into a fish tank that was marked.

At the price of water now, they would wind up costing the homeowner a lot of money every year.

Fluidmaster is selling the 400ARHR - their answer to the 528MP. I like the Korky's better for a few reasons, number one being that you set the water level and it refills spot on to where it's set time and time again unlike the 400A, and they seem more rust resistant. The 400ARHR has the adjustable refill rate just like the 528MP.

**suceress** · 12-12-2012, 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by Gary Swart

This is a bit behind the OP, but I'll toss it in FWIW. The problem may not be too much pressure, but every homeowner should know what the pressure is in the home. Too much is damaging to not only the toilet, but dishwasher and clothes washer that have valves that are constantly under pressure. They are not designed to last under high pressure. Your other faucets may withstand the added pressure OK, but pressure over 60 psi is really unnecessary and over 80 psi is really excessive. Pressure gauges are available at almost any hardware store for just a few dollars. If the pressure is over 80 psi, you are really pushing the envelope and a pressure regulator and thermal expansion tank should be added and the pressure adjust to a safe level. Toilet supply valves should always be full on. Shutting a valve partly does not reduce pressure, only flow.

Thank you for the suggestion! I actually was thinking about the pressure and wondering if it was too much or too little and how to check it. I really don't even know where the parts you mentioned would be installed.
About 3 months ago I kept having problems out in the pump house with the water well. The lever that tells the compressor (that pumps the water up into the cistern/holding tank) kept sticking so the compressor kept running. Well, even a few months before that it had sheered off one of the pulley wheels and I had to replace it, but eventually the motor in it died. We just didn't have water all of a sudden in the middle of summer. The old pump guy we called is now senile and he forgot to come out and we ended up waiting over a week before someone gave us the number for a reliable pump & well person. He came out and said we needed a new compressor. I won't bore you with details, but it was not easy to get our hands on one with such short notice but we managed and got it set up. Then the pipes connecting to the cistern blew apart and actually came out of the cistern. The pump guy was not available so we called our usual plumber who came out, took one look at it without touching anything, said "You'll have to get a pump man", charged $65 and left. We were able to get in touch with the pump guy who had to climb inside the now empty cistern (bc the pipe had come out and water had poured out) and have someone on the outside hold the pipe while he screwed it back on from the inside. Then we discovered that the pump had burned out. We were desperate for water and the weekend was approaching so we made the mistake of buying some piece of crap Countryline jet pump that claimed to pump 21GPM but was extremely weak. That thing lasted about 3 months before blowing a ball bearing. So this time we were patient and waited a few days for the pump guy to get the new pump (which turns out to be the same as the original pump-- not the Countryline thing). It says it is 15GPM @1HP but it has better water pressure. It's a Gould pump. Our old one probably would have lasted longer if not for the plumbing leaks and frequent power outages/surges. Anyway, that was off topic... LOL. It was not fun when we went through all the problems, but looking back it is sort of funny that it all happened like that.

On a website question: Why does it say I'm in Kansas? I never picked that as a location and I've never been to Kansas. I know running an IP trace seemed to lead back to Kansas because I have satellite internet.

I really do appreciate all of the responses.

I forgot to mention that I called Lowes and they said they had 4 of the Korky MaxPerformance valves on the shelf. Hopefully we'll be able to pick that up in the afternoon.

**suceress** · 12-12-2012, 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by wjcandee

Your question about the lever: there are lots of levers from many manufacturers available online and at your plumbing supply that will work with that Toto; you just need one that is appropriate for the location it is in the tank (i.e. side lever).

And remember that the toilet lever is one of the only reverse-threaded items that you'll find in the house. That is, instead of lefty-loosy, righty-tighty (i.e. clockwise to tighten), you will turn the nut clockwise to LOOSEN the nut holding the handle in place, and counterclockwise to tighten it.

Thanks! I remember that from reading the instructions on the lid, but its good to have a reminder. I'll have to look at side handles when we hit Lowes today. I think I watched a video on how to change out the parts. For some reason actually seeing things done helps me better than having it described.

**jadnashua** · 12-12-2012, 07:17 AM

It would be unusual to have excessive pressure in a home with a well although it is possible. If it was high, you could save a lot of wear and tear and money by lowering it.

**suceress** · 12-12-2012, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by jadnashua

It would be unusual to have excessive pressure in a home with a well although it is possible. If it was high, you could save a lot of wear and tear and money by lowering it.

Thanks. I really don't know what the pressure is or where I would put the gauge to check. I forgot to look for those when I was at Lowes today. They were out of the side handles with metal rods and I refuse to get those flimsy plastic ones. I wish there was a way to attach a different lever to the existing metal rod from the thing that broke. Lowes seemed to be out of a lot of stuff today. It seems they were going through some change in inventory and a lot of displays were not up. At least I did get the MaxPerformance valve though. I actually had to explain to the clerk that the one in the kit was not the same valve and showed him the difference. I hope it won't be difficult to remove the old one and put the new one in. Right now the bathroom is occupied so I will have to wait until it is vacated before I can work on it. I'll try to post pictures if I can remember.

Ok, I may sound dumb, but is there a video that shows how to change out the default flush valve and install the Korky MaxPerformance? I saw the little diagrams and read the instructions, but I always do better when I can actually watch something being done.

**jadnashua** · 12-12-2012, 05:01 PM

I'm not sure I've seen a video, but it's really pretty simple. Often, you may not even need any tools - it depends on how strong your fingers are. The most time consuming thing is probably sponging out the water so it doesn't all drain out the hole when you take the old valve out. Make sure to have the valve rotated so that nothing rubs and the chain to the flapper valve doesn't get caught up on things. You don't even need to put the locking tab back in unless you want to. Make sure to use the clip for the hose.

**suceress** · 12-12-2012, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by jadnashua

I'm not sure I've seen a video, but it's really pretty simple. Often, you may not even need any tools - it depends on how strong your fingers are. The most time consuming thing is probably sponging out the water so it doesn't all drain out the hole when you take the old valve out. Make sure to have the valve rotated so that nothing rubs and the chain to the flapper valve doesn't get caught up on things. You don't even need to put the locking tab back in unless you want to. Make sure to use the clip for the hose.

Ok. Even dumber question here because my brain is just frazzled today: Will I need to remove the tank from the toilet to install the new valve? I watched the video on servicing the valve and it didn't show that being done, but I'm getting the idea from the diagrams that I may have to do that. (Maybe its wishful thinking on my part that it won't be necessary so I want to make sure).

**jadnashua** · 12-12-2012, 08:45 PM

Generally, no, you do not need to remove the tank. Look at where the water supply hose goes to the bottom of the tank. You unscrew that (after turning the water off!), then there's a nut that holds the valve in place - you remove that, and the whole thing lifts out from inside. Course, you want to have drained the tank first. Then, the new one goes through the hole, you tighten the nut up, reattach the supply hose (it's not a bad idea to change that unless it is nearly new), adjust the valve so the fill height is correct, and you're close to done, On the volume adjustable one, you need to balance the tank/bowl fill so when the tank is full, the bowl just became full. The instructions cover it pretty well.

**wjcandee** · 12-12-2012, 10:56 PM

Here's the video on how to install the 528 MaxPerformance:

You won't need to remove the tank.

The problem with the Fluidmaster refill adjuster is that it's a slide thing on the hose. It doesn't stay in place firmly and it is, in my view, more challenging to adjust than the Korky refill valve, which you turn.

The Fluidmaster vs. Korky is an age-old debate. If you're a homeowner, I think the Korky is far easier to install yourself, is quieter, is easy to adjust, shuts off smoothly, and otherwise does a fine job. I now have them on 6 of my 7 toilets, and a Korky will go on the seventh one when the Voreto valve that came on the Toto Carlysle II finally starts acting up.

The official Toto Universal Replacement Fill Valve (TSU99A.X) is made for them by Korky, and is basically a 528MP with a few tools to adjust it to Toto factory specs.

**suceress** · 12-13-2012, 09:37 AM

Thank you guys so much! I feel like an idiot because I didn't try to just take apart the old flush assembly first (I was afraid I would break something so I wanted a replacement before messing with it). While I was waiting for a reply to this thread I went and took it apart. I found that after removing the cover and the float part (or whatever it is that moves up when the water line hits it) the thing that only turns 1/8 or whatever turn in the first video needs to be turned more before it unlocks. I was stuck on that part until I just decided to try turning it more. I don't have strong fingers so I gently used a wrench. I had to use pliers to pull out the thing inside that was supposed to be white. Man, that thing was absolutely disgusting and full of some sort of debris. Metal buildup from the water or something. Not sure. But I took everything out and cleaned them as best as I could. The black marks wouldn't come off of the red washer inside (or whatever that thing is) but it still looked to be fine. I think the gunk on the white thing was the problem. I put everything back together and it worked just fine. I did have to replace the flapper. I examined the old one more closely and noticed it was starting to change shape just a tiny bit on the ends. I also took the lever off of an as yet uninstalled Toto (still need to finish some floor installation and other stuff in that bathroom before it is ready) and used it to replace the broken one. It is a shame that piece of plastic in the lever is so flimsy. I wish I had been able to find just that piece and I could have replaced it instead. Meanwhile, I have an adjustable toilet lever that I put on the other tank. It matches the porcelain and chrome theme for that bathroom.

I'm going to bookmark this and download the video for when I do need to change out the flush valve eventually.

I'm not a terribly coordinated person so I'm amazed I finished this with only a little blood (scraped my knuckles on the tank trying to pull some things apart). So I'm proud of myself. I think it is inspiring me to work on more projects.

Again, thank you for all of the replies!

**Terry** · 12-13-2012, 09:54 AM

I'm glad you got this one knocked out. Jamie has walked women through the process of checking the assembly cap on the 528 over the phone, without tools. It should take less then a minute.
Of course, with Seattle water, things come apart easier then in other parts of the country. Most of our water is from snow melt.

**wjcandee** · 12-13-2012, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by suceress

I'm not a terribly coordinated person so I'm amazed I finished this with only a little blood (scraped my knuckles on the tank trying to pull some things apart). So I'm proud of myself. I think it is inspiring me to work on more projects.!

This is how you start to get the bug. Happened to me. Congratulations on this project and we look forward to doing more with you in the future!