PEX Crimp Rings Reduce Flow?

[PumpNewb1]

Hi All -

Recently, I installed a Aquasana system at the entrance of my well system (1550 Sq Ft Cape/1963). It came out good but I used PEX 3/4" with a crimp system. The rest of my run is 3/4 copper before breaking up into 1/2 other fixtures.

Honestly, I never really run more then 1 fixture at once because of well water but after watching a bunch of you Pros (YouTube) everyone pretty much universally says go with Uponor (Pex A) expansion system because it doesn't reduce water flow. I cherish my water flow and have to replace a long 3/4 run into the joists because I am refinishing the basement and want to sheetrock (low ceilings so can't go down).

My question: Does Crimp Rings really reduce water flow that noticeably? If in belief it does I literally will buy a expansion kit and redo my Aquauna and run the new PEX with it too.

I really appreciate your time.

 

[Reach4]

My question: Does Crimp Rings really reduce water flow that noticeably? If in belief it does I literally will buy a expansion kit and redo my aquauna and run the new pex with it too.

You cannot use expansion unless you have PEX-A pipe.

Significant depends on your point of view.

Its the fittings that have a smaller ID. The crimp or clamp only holds the pex to the fitting.

F1807 brass fittings have bigger ID than F2159 plastic fittings. https://www.pexuniverse.com/types-of-pex-fittings

https://www.esmagazine.com/ext/resources/ES/White_Papers/Files/PDF/Worm-White-Paper.pdf says

When specifying fittings, one must design with the same system intended to be used in the application. If an engineer specifies a PEX system with F1960 fittings, but the contractor installs any of the alternatives, system velocity — and therefore performance — will be significantly impacted.

ASTM F1960 fittings are, in many cases, preferred over alternate fitting connections. In an F1960 connection, the installer simply uses an expansion tool to expand the PEX-a pipe and PEX-reinforcing ring before inserting a fitting. As the ring and pipe shrink back down to their original size, it creates a strong, durable connection that holds tight with up to 1,500 psi of radial force. A 1-in F1960 engineered polymer (EP) fitting has a 67% greater flow rate, at 8-ft per second, than a F2159 plastic fitting and 22% greater flow rate than an F1807 brass fitting.​

 

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[PumpNewb1]

=

You cannot use expansion unless you have PEX-A pipe.

Significant depends on your point of view.

Its the fittings that have a smaller ID. The crimp or clamp only holds the pex to the fitting.

F1807 brass fittings have bigger ID than F2159 plastic fittings. https://www.pexuniverse.com/types-of-pex-fittings

https://www.esmagazine.com/ext/resources/ES/White_Papers/Files/PDF/Worm-White-Paper.pdf says

When specifying fittings, one must design with the same system intended to be used in the application. If an engineer specifies a PEX system with F1960 fittings, but the contractor installs any of the alternatives, system velocity — and therefore performance — will be significantly impacted.

ASTM F1960 fittings are, in many cases, preferred over alternate fitting connections. In an F1960 connection, the installer simply uses an expansion tool to expand the PEX-a pipe and PEX-reinforcing ring before inserting a fitting. As the ring and pipe shrink back down to their original size, it creates a strong, durable connection that holds tight with up to 1,500 psi of radial force. A 1-in F1960 engineered polymer (EP) fitting has a 67% greater flow rate, at 8-ft per second, than a F2159 plastic fitting and 22% greater flow rate than an F1807 brass fitting.​

Thanks for taking the time to explain that to me. I love hard data like this. I would have never would have believed that F2159 reduced flow compared to F1807. I see so many peoples set ups with those plastic fittings.

The big question becomes can I live with a 22% reduction in flow rate in my system. Most likely will invest in the manual expansion tool.

 

[Thomas K]

Reach4: I, too, will be replumbing with Pex B, and had no idea that plastic elbows can reduce flow more than brass. So, technically, you're advising plumbing Pex with the F1807 fittings for better flow. Are these brass fittings easy to install, and will they work with Sharkbite Pex clamps?

I also have a lot of copper pipe hanging beneath the ceiling of 1st floor room in split level that I want to replace with Pex. I'm planning to sweat Pex adapters to the 3/4" copper mains around the water heater area and run Pex from there out. Since toilets, shower, tub, and sinks are in close proximity to water heater, would I be better off to run (2) 3/4" Pex line over to wet wall and install a couple of Pex manifolds like one in photo?

One thing you do see in technical articles is that brass fittings can corrode in acidic water, and that plastic elbows are better for all around plumbing useage with Pex.

 

[Reach4]

Reach4: I, too, will be replumbing with Pex B, and had no idea that plastic elbows can reduce flow more than brass. So, technically, you're advising plumbing Pex with the F1807 fittings for better flow. Are these brass fittings easy to install, and will they work with Sharkbite Pex clamps?

Equally easy to install brass F1807 as plastic. OD is the same.

Yes, you can use the various rings and clamps on both the plastic F2159 fittings, and the F1807. https://www.pexuniverse.com/types-of-pex-fittings trys to show the compatiblity, and the brand column, but do not list the Sharkbite clamps.

 

[Jeff H Young]

I see a lot more type A here than type b after a little or fair amount of study I'm leaning toward Type A I did connect a bunch of type A to propress copper for months on a big job few years ago I've never crimped. The joining process was very smooth and little problems. but just doing one house, tools are an expense. Run bigger on certain lines would be an option too .
But if you have a 3/4 copper line and need to run 15 foot of PEX with a few 90s and you feel you're pushing it you can go with one inch