Geniescience
Homeowner
is a shower head installed in the wall above the tub? That would make this a tub-shower, not a tub. The vapor barrier question relates to this. Is this a tub-shower?
New tool: Make a roll of paper that you use to probe under the tub instead of the slim ruler. This will give you clearer information about the height of space under the tub, and whether or not the space is even everywhere. The ruler might tell you that too, if you can slide it back and forth on the floor under the tub. You can make a second tube of paper whose diameter is so large it may touch both tub bottom and the floor below. All of this effort is just background information, which you may not wish to share with the Monday morning team, at least not initially.
Retiling the wall, straight: When the bottom row of tiles is removed, they will pry them off the backer. You will have kept the backerboard intact. Those tiles will be thrown out; new tiles will be laid. I'm not sure if I can see in any one of the pictures clearly why the tiles had to angle out at the bottom. Perhaps one more picture would help answer this. Using a grinder, one can reduce the backer by a 1/8"th so that its thickness doesn't push the tile out -- this is information, not a recommendation to do this. Much depends on little distances that the photos don't show. If the tiling flange of the tub is not inside, underneath and inside, the backerboard's outside edge, then you have another big problem. If the tiling flange is indeed inside, then the tiles didn't need to angle out for this reason but for some other reason. If the tiling flange is up against the studs, and the backerboard overlaps and that overlap causes it to stick out at the bottom, then you have a couple options. One is to notch the studs beforehand; too late now. Another is to cut the backerboard. Another is to grind down the backerboard.
AFAIK, Fact: If mortar ever shrank, then brick wall cladding would drop a few inches as the mason moved up a building's side. FYI, mortar is mostly sand. The cement is a glue, holding sand grains together. When cracks in mortar happen, that is not a shrinkage.
Dumbing down; perhaps to get "out": It is a complete lie, and a total fabrication of reality, to blame "shrinking mortar". My gut feeling is that this contractor is of the type who believes that the most far-fetched fabrication (a form of lying) is the best, since it gives him several ways out later, and it blasts the client into submission in a subtle psychological way, non-violently and without expressing any threat. One of the "ways out" is for him to become more and more apparently incompetent, so that you begin to believe that he just doesn't have the mental wherewithal to grasp the complexities. Some people dumb down because of intense stress; some people dumb down as a self-protective mechanism; some people use this process consciously after they have received most of your money.
Golly gee: Crane or any other company may very well fob off the installation "complexities" onto a "Your contractor knows" approach. This is what lee joseph 0 mentioned in different words. This is a common practice. At some point, after selling you something, any firm wants to get away from ever more post-sales questions. Telling you that the professional is the one who knows what is right depending on your circumstances is true, not false, but it ain't helpful. I am going through a similar situation with finding a little "flush elbow" to connect to a faucet's popup drain under a bathroom sink. All I get is "your plumber knows" instead of more information. FWIW, the Kohler web site describes how to set their tubs in mortar, so you can search there, and maybe even find a link to it from one of the threads here. So, in summary, the "golly gee, i don't know what you ought to do" approach after they get your money occurs in big companies too, as well as in small contractors.
Cautious approach: Probably a good idea not to educate the team or explain any more to them. Tell them they are the professionals. If you express any emotion other than respect, they can (or will) use it against you. You may be a fraction of an inch away from an ugly confrontation or a "sabotage" situation where they keep asking you to guide them while using your words to do something not quite right or even the opposite...
Editorial: If Consumer Reports looked at products that get attached to a part of the building (with bolts, screws, nails, cement or glue) they would have twice as much scope to their mandate. I would give them ten times as much credibility. CR only looks at things that once out of the box sit on a floor, countertop, shelf or clothes' pocket
David
New tool: Make a roll of paper that you use to probe under the tub instead of the slim ruler. This will give you clearer information about the height of space under the tub, and whether or not the space is even everywhere. The ruler might tell you that too, if you can slide it back and forth on the floor under the tub. You can make a second tube of paper whose diameter is so large it may touch both tub bottom and the floor below. All of this effort is just background information, which you may not wish to share with the Monday morning team, at least not initially.
Retiling the wall, straight: When the bottom row of tiles is removed, they will pry them off the backer. You will have kept the backerboard intact. Those tiles will be thrown out; new tiles will be laid. I'm not sure if I can see in any one of the pictures clearly why the tiles had to angle out at the bottom. Perhaps one more picture would help answer this. Using a grinder, one can reduce the backer by a 1/8"th so that its thickness doesn't push the tile out -- this is information, not a recommendation to do this. Much depends on little distances that the photos don't show. If the tiling flange of the tub is not inside, underneath and inside, the backerboard's outside edge, then you have another big problem. If the tiling flange is indeed inside, then the tiles didn't need to angle out for this reason but for some other reason. If the tiling flange is up against the studs, and the backerboard overlaps and that overlap causes it to stick out at the bottom, then you have a couple options. One is to notch the studs beforehand; too late now. Another is to cut the backerboard. Another is to grind down the backerboard.
AFAIK, Fact: If mortar ever shrank, then brick wall cladding would drop a few inches as the mason moved up a building's side. FYI, mortar is mostly sand. The cement is a glue, holding sand grains together. When cracks in mortar happen, that is not a shrinkage.
Dumbing down; perhaps to get "out": It is a complete lie, and a total fabrication of reality, to blame "shrinking mortar". My gut feeling is that this contractor is of the type who believes that the most far-fetched fabrication (a form of lying) is the best, since it gives him several ways out later, and it blasts the client into submission in a subtle psychological way, non-violently and without expressing any threat. One of the "ways out" is for him to become more and more apparently incompetent, so that you begin to believe that he just doesn't have the mental wherewithal to grasp the complexities. Some people dumb down because of intense stress; some people dumb down as a self-protective mechanism; some people use this process consciously after they have received most of your money.
Golly gee: Crane or any other company may very well fob off the installation "complexities" onto a "Your contractor knows" approach. This is what lee joseph 0 mentioned in different words. This is a common practice. At some point, after selling you something, any firm wants to get away from ever more post-sales questions. Telling you that the professional is the one who knows what is right depending on your circumstances is true, not false, but it ain't helpful. I am going through a similar situation with finding a little "flush elbow" to connect to a faucet's popup drain under a bathroom sink. All I get is "your plumber knows" instead of more information. FWIW, the Kohler web site describes how to set their tubs in mortar, so you can search there, and maybe even find a link to it from one of the threads here. So, in summary, the "golly gee, i don't know what you ought to do" approach after they get your money occurs in big companies too, as well as in small contractors.
Cautious approach: Probably a good idea not to educate the team or explain any more to them. Tell them they are the professionals. If you express any emotion other than respect, they can (or will) use it against you. You may be a fraction of an inch away from an ugly confrontation or a "sabotage" situation where they keep asking you to guide them while using your words to do something not quite right or even the opposite...
Editorial: If Consumer Reports looked at products that get attached to a part of the building (with bolts, screws, nails, cement or glue) they would have twice as much scope to their mandate. I would give them ten times as much credibility. CR only looks at things that once out of the box sit on a floor, countertop, shelf or clothes' pocket
David
Tub_Amuck said:There could be ... clearance under there for all we know. All we have to check it with is a thin metal ruler. If I could get my fingers under there .... .
...different tub ... so if bailing on this product is what needs to happen, we can do so.
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