Flecktones
New Member
I'm sorry, I did not quite understand...
Help with selecting a water filtration/softener system for house
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Flecktones
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Would you have any suggestions based on the picture, on how to proceed? thanks!
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You have a valve and a PRV (pressure reducing valve) in your access box. Flow is up I think.
I would turn of the water, and see if the water turns off for the outside faucets. That will be important to know, since you don't want your lawn watering faucets to be supplying treated water. If the outside faucets turn off, you will want to find a place to connect to your piping downstream of where the pipes outside faucets split off if practical.
Were the houses in your area built about the same time by the same builder? I would see if a neighbor has a softener and how that got plumbed in.
I would turn of the water, and see if the water turns off for the outside faucets. That will be important to know, since you don't want your lawn watering faucets to be supplying treated water. If the outside faucets turn off, you will want to find a place to connect to your piping downstream of where the pipes outside faucets split off if practical.
Were the houses in your area built about the same time by the same builder? I would see if a neighbor has a softener and how that got plumbed in.
Bannerman
Well-Known Member
Ditttohead suggested Falcon Flex stainless steel flexible lines for connecting the softener and backwashing filter directly to your existing plumbing. There is quick connection ends offered (John Guest) which only need to be slipped over the cut ends of existing PEX plumbing. Those may eliminate the need for complicated fittings or soldering.
Water hardness should be measured at your home. As it appears you are planning to install and maintain the equipment yourself, obtaining a Hach 5B Total Hardness Test Kit is recommended. Although the city water report indicates hardness as 157 mg/L (157 / 17.1 = 9.24 Grains/gallon), that is likely the average hardness from all water sources. As there are often multiple water sources supplying a municipal distribution system, hardness can vary throughout so it is always recommended to measure hardness where the equipment is to be located. It is further recommended to add 2 or 3 additional grains when programming the softener, to anticipate some hardness variance due to water demand and distribution system maintenance.
Consumption is often estimated as 60 gals/day per person so with your 4 person household, 240 gallons/day. At 12 grains hardness (10 + 2 additional), the anticipated hardness load can be estimated as 2,880 grains per day or 20,160 grains/week. Although a smaller softener (ie: containing 1 cuft resin) could deliver that load while only needing 1X per week regeneration, a substantially larger softener would be recommended due to the flow rate capacity for 5.5 bathrooms. As the water source is municipal and contains no iron, regeneration frequency could be as little as 1X per month while using an efficient salt setting.
Example: 2 cuft softener will support up to 13 gpm SFR (service flow rate)
40,000 grains capacity when regenerated with 12 lbs salt = 3,333 grains/lb salt efficiency
40K / 2,880 = 13.9 (13) days estimated regeneration frequency
48K grains capacity when regenerated with 16 lbs salt = 3,000 grains/lb efficiency
48K / 2,880 = 16.6 (16) days frequency
Example: 2.5 cuft softener will support up to 18 gpm SFR
50K grains capacity when regenerated with 15 lbs (3,333 grains/lb)
50K / 2.880 = 17.3 (17) days
60K grains with 20 lbs (3,000 grains/lb)
60K / 2,880 = 20.8 (20) days
Example: 3 cuft softener will support 20 gpm SFR
60K grains capacity when regenerated with 18 lbs (3,333 grains/lb)
60K / 2.880 = 20.8 (20) days
72K grains with 24 lbs (3,000 grains/lb)
72K / 2,880 = 25 days
Water hardness should be measured at your home. As it appears you are planning to install and maintain the equipment yourself, obtaining a Hach 5B Total Hardness Test Kit is recommended. Although the city water report indicates hardness as 157 mg/L (157 / 17.1 = 9.24 Grains/gallon), that is likely the average hardness from all water sources. As there are often multiple water sources supplying a municipal distribution system, hardness can vary throughout so it is always recommended to measure hardness where the equipment is to be located. It is further recommended to add 2 or 3 additional grains when programming the softener, to anticipate some hardness variance due to water demand and distribution system maintenance.
Consumption is often estimated as 60 gals/day per person so with your 4 person household, 240 gallons/day. At 12 grains hardness (10 + 2 additional), the anticipated hardness load can be estimated as 2,880 grains per day or 20,160 grains/week. Although a smaller softener (ie: containing 1 cuft resin) could deliver that load while only needing 1X per week regeneration, a substantially larger softener would be recommended due to the flow rate capacity for 5.5 bathrooms. As the water source is municipal and contains no iron, regeneration frequency could be as little as 1X per month while using an efficient salt setting.
Example: 2 cuft softener will support up to 13 gpm SFR (service flow rate)
40,000 grains capacity when regenerated with 12 lbs salt = 3,333 grains/lb salt efficiency
40K / 2,880 = 13.9 (13) days estimated regeneration frequency
48K grains capacity when regenerated with 16 lbs salt = 3,000 grains/lb efficiency
48K / 2,880 = 16.6 (16) days frequency
Example: 2.5 cuft softener will support up to 18 gpm SFR
50K grains capacity when regenerated with 15 lbs (3,333 grains/lb)
50K / 2.880 = 17.3 (17) days
60K grains with 20 lbs (3,000 grains/lb)
60K / 2,880 = 20.8 (20) days
Example: 3 cuft softener will support 20 gpm SFR
60K grains capacity when regenerated with 18 lbs (3,333 grains/lb)
60K / 2.880 = 20.8 (20) days
72K grains with 24 lbs (3,000 grains/lb)
72K / 2,880 = 25 days
Flecktones
New Member
You are correct, when I shutoff the valve in the garage, exterior hose bibs also turn off. So in that case, i can't use that point of entry for adding the softener and have to search for probably another place from the main shutoff near the road coming into the house - somewhere there... I will check my neighbor's situation too once he returns , because he has it installed the same way as mine - but I am not sure if he is aware of the exterior faucets connected to the same. or if it is different. Actually will try a few other neighbors too. Will reply back once I find out later this week. Thank you!
Flecktones
New Member
Thanks for explaining that. From the reps from Culligan and EcoWater (had them come out for kicks, I learnt a few things that way), my water hardness level came out for both as 8 grains/gallon (measured at the kitchen faucet), and 237 ppm as particles in the water. From my 2 years history of water usage, it goes from 80 gallons/day to around 210 gallons/day, and average for the 12 months over 2 years is around 150-160 gallons/day. But you maybe spot on, because right now they are kids and it will go up in the next few years.
Just to clarify, I will be hiring a good plumber or water softener install company to get this installed. I know my limitations, I will not be able to do this on my own
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Flecktones
New Member
I asked the new builder (old builder who did my home is gone, 2 years ago) who said that is how the water is installed. The shutoff valve in the garage controls the interior faucets and the exterior hose bib, but separate from the yard sprinkler system. Once the neighbor comes back this week , I plan to test his setup and reply back.
Flecktones
New Member
Talked to 2 neighbors, and both have the same - they have the softener connected right after the shutoff valve, so it controls the interior and the exterior hose. Not the sprinkler system. That is pretty much how the builder has it installed in our houses then.
ditttohead
Water systems designer, R&D
Sound simple, glad to hear you were able to confirm this with such ease.
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Flecktones
New Member
Based on this, what configuration and system would you suggest?
Summary: 1o grain hardness city water. 4 people.
For that, softener with 1.5 cubic of 10% crosslinked resin should be sufficient. An upgrade to that would be to first remove the chloromine or chlorine with a similar tank and backwashing controller before the softener. Ask your water district if they use chloromine.
Lawn watering is done by sprinkler system with untreated water, but existing outside hose bibs will be softened. That is a wildcard. During significant flower watering and driveway washing, you could put the softener in bypass. Even better is to install a new hard water hose bib during the install. Just poke through the wall, and add a spigot.
Probably 1 inch Aquapex PEX incoming service.
