Grunfos 301 with non SQE

[newtek]

I see in another post you seemingly can NOT use a non sqe pump in a grunfos 301 setup. Well... I have done so doing a new pump replacement and it DOES work. The first of the nine 301 fault indicator lights show working and all is working. However, the ninth connection to pump light (pump connection) is red. I really dont need to see the nice signaling lights moving upward to see the water moving on the front screen. And it does shut down (as in off no pressure on the 301 from time to time turn 301 off and on to fix) but other than that working. Does anyone know if that means... the pump itself is doing something it shouldn't like always on or some other anomaly? Its installed already DIY into existing system. Not really interested in removing pump again. Anyone else done this?? Greatly appreciated any advice (even if this is stupid to do ) Thanks!!

 

[Reach4]

. Does anyone know if that means... the pump itself is doing something it shouldn't like always on or some other anomaly? Its installed already DIY into existing system. Not really interested in removing pump again. Anyone else done this?? Greatly appreciated any advice (even if this is stupid to do ) Thanks!!

I presume it means that the controller is not communicating with the pump. The controller and pressure sensor are turning the pump on and off. You might want to monitor the pressure gauge to see what range of pressures you get.

If the controller ever fails, you will take that out of the circuit, and tee in a conventional pressure switch to turn the pump on and off.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[newtek]

I presume it means that the controller is not communicating with the pump. The controller and pressure sensor are turning the pump on and off. You might want to monitor the pressure gauge to see what range of pressures you get.

If the controller ever fails, you will take that out of the circuit, and tee in a conventional pressure switch to turn the pump on and off.

Yes you are correct no "sensor" connection back from pump but it goes to pump as it works and shuts off at programmed psi correctly- any change of psi on faceplate responds instantly. The only issue I notice is the shutting off of pressure (drops to zero) out of the blue maybe once a day. Turning unit on off one button push restores unit to so called normal.

Rather than replace pump or 301 I think I'll put a timer on off switch like an "Infinite cycle delay timing relay on off switch loop module" $12 amazon wired into on/off switch and turn unit pro actively on off every 12 or 24 hours for 2 seconds. That should reset any issue. Should prove interesting experiment just the same.

 

[Valveman]

What pump do you have? The CU301 was specifically designed to work with the SQE type pump. There is some electronics in the SQ type motor that communicate with the CU301 up top. I am not sure but I think the SQ has a three phase motor and the controller in the motor converts normal single phase house current to three phase to work with the three phase motor. I don't really see how a regular single phase two wire motor will work with the CU301. But I never tried it.

 

[newtek]

What pump do you have? The CU301 was specifically designed to work with the SQE type pump. There is some electronics in the SQ type motor that communicate with the CU301 up top. I am not sure but I think the SQ has a three phase motor and the controller in the motor converts normal single phase house current to three phase to work with the three phase motor. I don't really see how a regular single phase two wire motor will work with the CU301. But I never tried it.

Wow good point about 3 phase possibly off. Hmm. I assume it would fry asap if motor didnt like something.... Yet working great. Perfect really. I would rather blow it at 200 feet than pull it on a guess. Specifically its a home depot 230v everbilt 1hp. All is well except the occasional restart on/off needed on the box when pressure shuts off. Maybe 301 has a time function to shut off as the red mechanic with wrench light is still on yet other than "no power to pump #9 indicator red all other signals show fine. You obviously wouldnt do this for a client but working fine for now. Putting a Jameco Reliapro PDL 50 motor driven actualtor ($6) to push pull on off button every 24 hrs or so and bet I'll never have any issues as wiring into the 301 button itself may be weird being on a computer type strip.

 

[newtek]

I know many seem to dislike the 301 very much saying they dont last. Its over 15 yrs running fine.

 

[Valveman]

I know many seem to dislike the 301 very much saying they dont last. Its over 15 yrs running fine.

Same punp?

 

[newtek]

Same punp?

By same pump I assume you are asking if 301 with same pump is lasting that long yes but different than referenced pump above.

 

[Reach4]

By same pump I assume you are asking if 301 with same pump is lasting that long yes but different than referenced pump above.

I think you are saying that the SQE pump used with the 301 lasted 15 years. Now you are starting year 16 with a new SQ pump.

 

[newtek]

I think you are saying that the SQE pump used with the 301 lasted 15 years. Now you are starting year 16 with a new SQ pump.

Correct. Different pump. Orig sq pump didnt die, wires fried but didnt want to re-drop 15 yr pump. Keep 4 Backup. 301 checks for signal on a timer. That would be why it seems to cut off on a timed sequence. As said above auto off on resolves it in a nice mickey mouse kinda way. But fixed nonetheless.

 

[Valveman]

The SQ pump communicates with the CU301 controller through the wires, the dumb 2 wire pump doesn't have that option. But I am curios how it is working??? Can you check the amps?

 

[newtek]

So a bit of a summary: Can you do this YES. Does it work. YES. Is it a good idea... Well, not really-but I have it working perfect. I can adjust any pressure 10-100 psi instantly. Works perfectly. After a pump change out didnt really want to do much more as I am obviously not a plumber but did redo piping and very deep well pump. Here is the rub as they say....
The grunfos 301 will show a mechanic light...forever as it cant properly see the non-sqe pump, yet all other lights show perfect and green inside control unit. The cute animation with 3 green lights showing water flowing wont light up but so what as the tank (blader and pressure gauge kick in perfect) so don't care. THE CATCH is that the box clearly looks for the sqe in its internal hard wire program because... after about 12-48 hours or so pressure cuts off. If you just turn pump on/off all is perfect for another 12-48 hours or so... sometimes longer but it will eventually cut off pressure so...... I rigged a on/off driver to "push" the button on/off a few times a day for a few seconds......

Jameco Reliapro PDL-50 Motor Driven Actuator, Push/Pull, 12VDC, 3.3 AMPS,40 Watt​

Six bucks.

And trigger it push in (off) push in/out again (on again). All issues solved with the folloing ($10)

DC 5V 12V 24V Digital LED Display Infinite Cycle Delay Timer Switch ON/OFF Relay Module (DC 12V)​

​

Mode 3 will give 2 on/off cycles with a little programming. Any experienced plumber would throw a wrench at me for this but it all works perfect.

 

[newtek]

The SQ pump communicates with the CU301 controller through the wires, the dumb 2 wire pump doesn't have that option. But I am curios how it is working??? Can you check the amps?

Will check amps and get back but works just perfect now. The issues are below. Many thanks for your wise quiry.

 

[Valveman]

Yours is an unusual circumstance. Most of the time the SQ pump is the most robust part of the SQE pump system. The CU301 is usually replaced several times before the pump goes bad. So, it is usually the CU301 that needs replacing not the pump. In cases like that the PK1A is a good replacement for the CU301. The PK1A will also work with the regular 2 wire pump you have now, but I am totally surprised it works with the CU301.

 

[Fitter30]

Here's a book on the cu301. Control has multiple lights on the front and on the board. Pump is two wire? Your pump motor is good up to 280 volts and overvoltage is 320. Do you have the r100 remote?

https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.grundfos.com/content/dam/local/no-no/page-assets/support/techical-support/teknisk-selvhjelp/documents/teknisk-selvhjelp-vannforsyning/sqe-cu301-kontrollboks/cu301-drift-v.pdf&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwis4rLVwb-DAxV_AHkGHUHkD3YQFnoECAIQAg&usg=AOvVaw3mIBsdoAwdvDjgmMlXYg5f

 

[newtek]

Yours is an unusual circumstance. Most of the time the SQ pump is the most robust part of the SQE pump system. The CU301 is usually replaced several times before the pump goes bad. So, it is usually the CU301 that needs replacing not the pump. In cases like that the PK1A is a good replacement for the CU301. The PK1A will also work with the regular 2 wire pump you have now, but I am totally surprised it works with the CU301.

Using a flow thu f118 s tank w/the 301. Thx your suggestion is better but if it aint broke dont fix it right? Same sqe pump can be as high as $2400 so $600 nice. Actually pump still good but (wires fried (150 feet down) due to my hired "pro" last time) time for DIY as said 15 years on shelf as BU.

 

[newtek]

Here's a book on the cu301. Control has multiple lights on the front and on the board. Pump is two wire? Your pump motor is good up to 280 volts and overvoltage is 320. Do you have the r100 remote?

https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.grundfos.com/content/dam/local/no-no/page-assets/support/techical-support/teknisk-selvhjelp/documents/teknisk-selvhjelp-vannforsyning/sqe-cu301-kontrollboks/cu301-drift-v.pdf&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwis4rLVwb-DAxV_AHkGHUHkD3YQFnoECAIQAg&usg=AOvVaw3mIBsdoAwdvDjgmMlXYg5f

No remote but the internal indicators are useful. Thx for confirming voltages ok. Again the on/off trigger switch is needed but @15 bucks an small tinkering no big deal. Just not at all pro looking. Just very functional in a cheapo pinch. I'm pleased. Wrks great.

 

[newtek]

More silly details. The programable trigger unit noted above is capable of running a cycle as programmed on power up. So a simple timer (the rotating timers with plastic pins) on the power supply for the trigger will push-pull unit off push pull unit on when powered up. So the basic timer just cuts power button momentarily twice a day and the unit (301) never has enough time to get confused and shut down pressure ie roughly once a day or so.. Crazy but other than the obvious unpro nature works without incident.