2 PUMPS FED FROM SAME CITY WATER PIPE !!!

[Reach4]

Actually the pump I have produce 5 bar on its own add to that the city pressure at night which can reach more than 1.5 bar so the total pressure can reach 7 bar which is too much for the piping system

7 bar is only 102 psi, and that is no problem for piping itself. It is too much for fixtures, however.

If you use a pump controlled by a pressure switch, with or without a CSV, the pressure at the fixtures would not rise higher than the pressure switch cut-off pressure. With a CSV, if the pressure rose to 150 or more before the CSV, that would not hurt the pipes or the CSV.

Without a CSV, you need a bigger pressure tank. With no CSV, if the flow from the pump is X liters/minute, then the pressure tank should be 4*X liters or bigger.

 

[Bob1000]

7 bar is only 102 psi, and that is no problem for piping itself. It is too much for fixtures, however.

If you use a pump controlled by a pressure switch, with or without a CSV, the pressure at the fixtures would not rise higher than the pressure switch cut-off pressure. With a CSV, if the pressure rose to 150 or more before the CSV, that would not hurt the pipes or the CSV.

Without a CSV, you need a bigger pressure tank. With no CSV, if the flow from the pump is X liters/minute, then the pressure tank should be 4*X liters or bigger.

The main problem caused by cycling is the hot / cold water blasts during shower , that is why i prefer the pump to be continuously running to maintain the right water temperature during shower

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Valveman]

Well it won't do anything to stop the pump cycling or make it last longer but you can use a regular pressure reducing valve to hold the pressure constant. Using a pressure switch to control the pump turning on at 5 bar and off at 7 bar, set the PRV to 5 bar and the pressure to the shower will stay at a constant 5 bar, even though your pump is still cycling on and off.

Still blows my mind that the rest of the world is prevented from purchasing stuff made in the USA. Looks like every other country in the world protects manufacturers from their own country except the USA? Go figure!

 

[Reach4]

The main problem caused by cycling is the hot / cold water blasts during shower

There are pressure compensating and temperature compensating shower valves.

It may be that the temperature variations you are getting are less to do with the water pressure out of the pump, and more due to people in the other units drawing water.

Do you have a single pipe feeding all of the water for your unit, and have your own water heater? OR does the cold and hot for your unit come in via different pipes?

 

[Bob1000]

There are pressure compensating and temperature compensating shower valves.

It may be that the temperature variations you are getting are less to do with the water pressure out of the pump, and more due to people in the other units drawing water.

Do you have a single pipe feeding all of the water for your unit, and have your own water heater? OR does the cold and hot for your unit come in via different pipes?

It is one independent house with its own water heater, no body uses water if somebody having shower so the only reason of the problem is cycling

 

[Valveman]

It is one independent house with its own water heater, no body uses water if somebody having shower so the only reason of the problem is cycling

"Cycling" is the cause of nearly every problem with a pump system.

 

[Reach4]

It is one independent house with its own water heater, no body uses water if somebody having shower so the only reason of the problem is cycling

It's not clear to me why the difference in pressure would cause actual temperature changes. But flow changes, yes. Maybe a showerhead with a flow regulator would improve temperature control. There are adapters that can go between a shower arm and an existing showerhead.

If it helps, great. If not, it is a small expense.

 

[Bob1000]

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It's not clear to me why the difference in pressure would cause actual temperature changes. But flow changes, yes. Maybe a showerhead with a flow regulator would improve temperature control. There are adapters that can go between a shower arm and an existing showerhead.

If it helps, great. If not, it is a small expense.

change in pressure causes immediately change in flow which by its turn cause change in water temperature in my system

I NEED THE PUMP TO BE RUNNING CONTINUOUSLY DURING SHOWER .

 

[Valveman]

Those "electronic pump controllers" do not shut off at high pressure. They have a flow switch that shuts the pump off when flow is lees than about 1/5th a GPM.

If your pump has a max pressure of 80 or 100 PSI, then you will see 80 or 100 PSI as the pump shuts off. Remove that pump controller. Install a regular 60/80 pressure switch and pressure tank. Set a pressure reducing valve after the tank at 60 PSI, and you will have 60 PSI constant in the shower. Your pump will be cycling on and off, but the house lines will always be 60 PSI, and the pressure tank will take thermal expansion from the water heater as well.

 

[Bob1000]

Those "electronic pump controllers" do not shut off at high pressure. They have a flow switch that shuts the pump off when flow is lees than about 1/5th a GPM.
View attachment 70784

If your pump has a max pressure of 80 or 100 PSI, then you will see 80 or 100 PSI as the pump shuts off. Remove that pump controller. Install a regular 60/80 pressure switch and pressure tank. Set a pressure reducing valve after the tank at 60 PSI, and you will have 60 PSI constant in the shower. Your pump will be cycling on and off, but the house lines will always be 60 PSI, and the pressure tank will take thermal expansion from the water heater as well.

Unfortunately I can not buy such controller in Egypt , all controllers here shut the pump when flow is zero or at its max pressure the pump can produce

Valveman , is it possible to buy your CSV on Amazon USA? Are you the inventor of that CSV kind of valve?

 

[LLigetfa]

Unfortunately I can not buy such controller in Egypt

Valveman is alternately suggesting you use a pressure regulating valve which would be available locally. The CSV is also pressure regulating to a degree but different. It deliberately leaks around 1 GPM when closed unlike a standard PRV that shuts off at the preset PSI.

 

[Valveman]

Unfortunately I can not buy such controller in Egypt , all controllers here shut the pump when flow is zero or at its max pressure the pump can produce

Valveman , is it possible to buy your CSV on Amazon USA? Are you the inventor of that CSV kind of valve?

You should be able to just get a regular pressure tank, pressure switch, and pressure reducing valve?

I no longer support Bezos/Amazon making 22+ % of everything for doing absolutely nothing. There are others who sell CSV's on Amazon, but at an increased price. I find if I deal with the manufacturers direct they will give me a better price anyway, and lots better service than Amazon. We ship CSV's all over the world. But unfortunately you have to deal with your local import/export people and usually pay more for graft than for the actual product. But still usually better than dealing with Amazon.

 

[Bob1000]

Is it possible to build up a plumbing system using Pressure Regulating Valves , Pressure Tank , Non Return Valve, Bypass Valve and Pressure Switch in a way to give the same effect of the CSV Valve ?

 

[Valveman]

There are five patents on the Cycle Stop Valve registered with the US Patent and Trademark office. You can look up these patents and figure out how to make your own. People think patents are to protect the inventor, but they are not. Patents supposedly give the inventor 20 years of protection, but it doesn't really work out that well. Patents are designed to get the inventor to draw and describe how to build the product, so that everyone else can benefit from the unique idea after the 20 years protection is up.

However, that is a lot of trouble to make a valve you could purchase for $69US or $179US.

 

[Bob1000]

There are five patents on the Cycle Stop Valve registered with the US Patent and Trademark office. You can look up these patents and figure out how to make your own. People think patents are to protect the inventor, but they are not. Patents supposedly give the inventor 20 years of protection, but it doesn't really work out that well. Patents are designed to get the inventor to draw and describe how to build the product, so that everyone else can benefit from the unique idea after the 20 years protection is up.

However, that is a lot of trouble to make a valve you could purchase for $69US or $179US.

The main problem is that the CSV is NOT available in Egypt so I am asking if other components combination can give same effect of CSV

 

[Valveman]

The main problem is that the CSV is NOT available in Egypt so I am asking if other components combination can give same effect of CSV

Then no. Unless you make the changes mentioned in the patents nothing works like a CSV. Have you tried to order one? We can ship to you if your import/export people will let you have it.

 

[Bob1000]

Then no. Unless you make the changes mentioned in the patents nothing works like a CSV. Have you tried to order one? We can ship to you if your import/export people will let you have it.

This is the main problem , I have no idea about the shipping cost plus the customs cost , so after I pay you $179 plus shipping to Egypt plus customs in Egypt I have no idea how much would be the total cost but am sure it would be very very expensive

 

[Valveman]

I understand. I can figure shipping and get it there. But in one case the customs agent sat on it until the guy showed up with cash and applied the lubricant. Sorry. Sure makes it hard for American companies to compete anywhere else in the world.