I am confused on the best toilet to buy

[rubyredvette]

My wife wants a new toilet. Her toilet was leaking and then got broken. It is an old as dirt 10 gallon American Standard, maybe not 10 gallon, but is a 1960 era toilet. So she does deserve a new toilet.
Her criteria is that it be trouble free; be a 1.6 gallon toilet; High MaP rating. Be cheap to purchase and come in a brown/tan. A toilet is not a piece of furniture to us and I honestly have never looked a toilet and said "now that is a nice looking toilet !!!". It is a utility device, so the shapely lines do not matter.
I keep reading that the Drake is the best, now there is the Drake II, the ECO Drake. Different fill valves inside the Toto. Some of the Toto fill valves leak. The Toto models are constantly changing their name. American Standard Quality is low. Kohler has quality issues. MaP ratings are not available on all toilet models.
I looked at the Toto because this forum has information that seems to say Toto is the only real choice.... but then I get overwhelmed with the toilets.
Carusoe ... starting at $224 with gravity flushing
no name .... starting at $272 with gravity jet flushing
Drake starting at $370 with G max flushing (forum says that leaks)
Eco Drake starting at $370 with E max flushing (leaks?)
Aquia starting at $490 with Dual max flushing
Wife says a one piece would be nice...
Ultimate ... starting at $543 with power gravity flushing
Supreme starting at $567 with power gravity flushing
Ultramax starting at $620 with G max flushing
I just want to buy the best trouble free Toilet at the cheapest price. If I bought an ultimate now, in the future can I/should I replace the flushing with the troublesome G/E max flushing.

 

[carnation]

I am getting a Toto Drake installed soon. I never in my wildest dreams thought I'd do so much toilet research. Just in the last few days since my Drake was ordered, I've learned more about the Drake II and it does look "prettier" to me (I'm a woman). But my Drake is already at the plumber's and I'm not gonna ask him to take it back to Denver and get a Drake II instead. But if I had it to do over, maybe...

Welcome to the world of the potty perplexed.

P.S. The number one factor I considered was cloggability. I got the impression that the Drake was the "workhorse" of the Toto line. But as a layperson, what do I know? Decisions, decisions...

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Jadnashua]

Color on any toilet adds a fair amount of money, so keep that in mind.

As to leaks...all toilets have parts that leak eventually. The nice thing about most Toto models is that they use readily available, and inexpensive parts unlike (for example) some of the Kohler stuff. On a two-piece toilet, people tend to be queasy about tightening the tank to the bowl. On any toilet, the porcelain inside the tank can be a little rough...if you take a piece of sandpaper and 10-seconds, you can smooth the area where the gasket goes before you attach the tank.

The Drake comes in a few choices...normal height, ADA height, round, elongated, 1.6g, 1.28g, and then there are the choices of CEFIONTECT or traditional glaze. They've complicated things by changing names, too.

One-piece toilets are easier to keep clean, but are more expensive to make...have a defect on say a tank, and you don't have to throw away the whole thing as if it is a one-piece. Since you can't cast the whole thing as one piece, there's the hand work of joining them together and more opportunities for defects. Toto has probably the lowest defect rate in the industry.

MAP ratings flush plastic sausages...I don't know anyone who actually has those coming out of them! Their smooth surface makes them go through traps that would clog or slow down and not fully flush with the real stuff. The people that actually run the tests say anything over 500g is overkill and that the test does not test for tendency to clog if you have a big dump or use a lot of paper. Take a pound of butter and string the four quarters in a row...that's a big dump! A pound is 454g.

Personally, I have a Vespin and a Carlyle and I put in two Drakes (all elongated) at my mother's house. I liked the skirted design - essentially no nooks and crannies to accumulate crud (on the outside). I haven't used a plunger in 8-years now. Maybe one double-flush needed per year.

Toto's dual cyclone design cleans the bowl better. Personally, I don't have a problem with streaking...maybe a diet thing or good aim! But it is an issue with some people on some toilets. Many of the Totos have a decent sized water spot (the dual-flush ones tend to be smaller), so that isn't an issue.

Most people prefer an elongated toilet. It may not be any deeper than an old one, since the tank is likely thinner. If you'll use it, you'll like it.

 

[hankski]

My vote is for Drake or Drake II

I never in my wildest dreams thought I'd do so much toilet research.

Welcome to the world of the potty perplexed.

More like... welcome to the potty obsessed. I too just entered the toilet market for the first time in my life. I found this forum and have spent the past two weeks reading all the posts. My spouse laughs at me when she looks over my shoulder and sees Terry Love's face on the upper left corner of my laptop screen.

Bottom line is that we finally bought a ADA Drake with E-Max for the powder/ laundry room and am ADA Drake II with E-Max flush and CEFIONTECT for upstairs in the main bath. I cannot provide feedback on how good they are at this point as they are sitting in their boxes awaiting installation of a new floor.

My rationale for buying the Drakes is quality. If you get one thing out of this forum it is that Toto has good quality control and with the other manufacturers it is a crap shoot. Frankly, with new floors going down I don't want to risk a toilet leak.

 

[Terry]

Any of the Toto toilets listed, with the exception of the Carusoe would be fine.

If you have read a comment about fill valves, it's because this is a toilet forum.
We discuss repairs to all brands.
With most no-name brands, homeowners don't even bother looking up the repairs for them. They just run down and buy a new replacement fill valve. Which by the way, is pretty much a generic part for any toilet, with the exception of Kohler one-piece toilets.

As an installer, I find that the Toto has had the fewer problems of any brand. It would be rare to go back and do a service call on one.

I sell a few thousand toilets a year, and all brands.
We remove a lot of toilets too.
Toilets being replaced are Mansfield, Kohler, American Standard, Norris, Briggs, Crane.

 

[Davebutch]

Thanks!

Color on any toilet adds a fair amount of money, so keep that in mind.

As to leaks...all toilets have parts that leak eventually. The nice thing about most Toto models is that they use readily available, and inexpensive parts unlike (for example) some of the Kohler stuff. On a two-piece toilet, people tend to be queasy about tightening the tank to the bowl. On any toilet, the porcelain inside the tank can be a little rough...if you take a piece of sandpaper and 10-seconds, you can smooth the area where the gasket goes before you attach the tank.

The Drake comes in a few choices...normal height, ADA height, round, elongated, 1.6g, 1.28g, and then there are the choices of CEFIONTECT or traditional glaze. They've complicated things by changing names, too.

One-piece toilets are easier to keep clean, but are more expensive to make...have a defect on say a tank, and you don't have to throw away the whole thing as if it is a one-piece. Since you can't cast the whole thing as one piece, there's the hand work of joining them together and more opportunities for defects. Toto has probably the lowest defect rate in the industry.

MAP ratings flush plastic sausages...I don't know anyone who actually has those coming out of them! Their smooth surface makes them go through traps that would clog or slow down and not fully flush with the real stuff. The people that actually run the tests say anything over 500g is overkill and that the test does not test for tendency to clog if you have a big dump or use a lot of paper. Take a pound of butter and string the four quarters in a row...that's a big dump! A pound is 454g.

Personally, I have a Vespin and a Carlyle and I put in two Drakes (all elongated) at my mother's house. I liked the skirted design - essentially no nooks and crannies to accumulate crud (on the outside). I haven't used a plunger in 8-years now. Maybe one double-flush needed per year.

Toto's dual cyclone design cleans the bowl better. Personally, I don't have a problem with streaking...maybe a diet thing or good aim! But it is an issue with some people on some toilets. Many of the Totos have a decent sized water spot (the dual-flush ones tend to be smaller), so that isn't an issue.

Most people prefer an elongated toilet. It may not be any deeper than an old one, since the tank is likely thinner. If you'll use it, you'll like it.

Great, useful info, Jim. Thanks from all us lurkers!

 

[floydt1911]

Like others here, I never thought there was so much to choosing a toilet. I was happy in my ignorance and about to purchase a couple of Kohlers when I found this website. That put an end to that, so thank you. Now I feel buried under the mountain of choice and my builder would like me to dig myself out pretty quick so he can continue work on our house. I need some help....

How do the Clayton and the Promenade measure up against the Drake? They have G-Max but Terry lists his favorites as the Drake and the UltraMax, so is there something not quite up to par with these two models?

Are 1.28 GpF toilets as good as 1.6?

Is the Double Cyclone better than G-max?

As long as I buy a Toto (except for the Carusoe) maybe I just can't go wrong.

 

[Terry]

As long as I buy a Toto (except for the Carusoe) maybe I just can't go wrong.

That's kind a how I feel about it.

The new Promenade, Clayton and the Dartmouth are like a Drake, but with style.