Complete noob with a new softener…please help!

[Jaymackin773]

I will simply start off with stating that i am a complete beginner when it comes to anything related to water treatment. I just moved into a new construction home snd had a local water treatment company install a softener for me. All i know of the unit is that it is a Pentair model with a fleck 5800 valve. I dont even know what grain capacity it is. My city hardness is 22, and thats what he set the softener at. My concern is that after two weeks of use, and multiple manual regens, my water feels no different than my kitchen tap that is un-softened. I tried reached back out to the installer to see if he could come out and test the water again or even make some changes, but i have been ghosted by said company. Is there any setting i can adjust/tweak to get that slippery water feeling or to even make sure this thing is working correctly?!?

 

[MaxBlack]

You'd do well to get a Hach test kit and compare the hard water at the kitchen faucet to a tap that is supposed to be soft. They DID place the softener where both cold and hot lines throughout the house are soft, yes? Mixing doesn't work at all.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Jaymackin773]

You'd do well to get a Hach test kit and compare the hard water at the kitchen faucet to a tap that is supposed to be soft. They DID place the softener where both cold and hot lines throughout the house are soft, yes? Mixing doesn't work at all.

I do have a kit coming. And yes, it is placed correctly. I’ve read online that from the factory these valves are set up very salt efficient, and I’m wondering if tweaking it to use more salt will give me a better/softer feel to the water?

 

[Reach4]

What are the dimensions of your tank? 54 inch by 10 inch diameter? 52 inch by 12?

Also, what injector do you have? #2, or what. What BLFC do you have? [corrected] 0.125 gpm maybe? lift the cover and look for labels.

 

[Bannerman]

How did you determine the city water hardness is 22 gpg? If a Hach 5B result actually indicates 22 at your specific location, recommend programming the softener for 24 gpg to anticipate occasion when hardness maybe higher than usual.

I’ve read online that from the factory these valves are set up very salt efficient,

Not true. The 5800 maybe utilized with a wide variety of softener capacities. This then requires the installer to correctly program the controller for each specific application, including programming the appropriate Capacity and salt settings to achieve the desired salt efficiency.

Suggest defining each setting currently programmed. We can then offer guidance on which settings to modify.

What DLFC do you have? 0.125 gpm maybe?

R4 is actually asking about the BLFC (brine line flow control) flow rate. This is the flow rate for water that will enter the brine tank while Brine Fill is occuring. Possible flow rates include 0.125, 0.25, 0.5 or 1.0 GPM. This data will be typically specified on a label located nearby to the brine line connection. BLFC flow rate X Brine Fill setting minutes, = the amount of water to enter the brine tank each cycle. That amount X 3 lbs salt per gallon, = the total quantity of salt to be consumed each cycle.

Using the 5B kit, determine the hardness of the untreated water before the softener, comparing the hardness of water exiting from the softener.

 

[MaxBlack]

I do have a kit coming. And yes, it is placed correctly. I’ve read online that from the factory these valves are set up very salt efficient, and I’m wondering if tweaking it to use more salt will give me a better/softer feel to the water?

FWIW I have learned that "slippery water" is not always a given. We have two homes with two different softeners using the same Morton salt, and one house feels slippery and the other notsomuch. I have surfed like crazy on this, and tt'ed Customer Service about it, and as far as I can tell the most likely reason is "acidic vs. alkaline water".

 

[Jaymackin773]

What are the dimensions of your tank? 54 inch by 10 inch diameter? 52 inch by 12?

Also, what injector do you have? #2, or what. What DLFC do you have? 0.125 gpm maybe? lift the cover and look for labels.

My tank I believe is 8x40. And injector is #1 BLFC is .25 and DLFC is 2.0 according to the sticker.

 

[Jaymackin773]

How did you determine the city water hardness is 22 gpg? If a Hach 5B result actually indicates 22 at your specific location, recommend programming the softener for 24 gpg to anticipate occasion when hardness maybe higher than usual.


Not true. The 5800 maybe utilized with a wide variety of softener capacities. This then requires the installer to correctly program the controller for each specific application, including programming the appropriate Capacity and salt settings to achieve the desired salt efficiency.

Suggest defining each setting currently programmed. We can then offer guidance on which settings to modify.


R4 is actually asking about the BLFC (brine line flow control) flow rate. This is the flow rate for water that will enter the brine tank while Brine Fill is occuring. Possible flow rates include 0.125, 0.25, 0.5 or 1.0 GPM. This data will be typically specified on a label located nearby to the brine line connection. BLFC flow rate X Brine Fill setting minutes, = the amount of water to enter the brine tank each cycle. That amount X 3 lbs salt per gallon, = the total quantity of salt to be consumed each cycle.

Using the 5B kit, determine the hardness of the untreated water before the softener, comparing the hardness of water exiting from the softener.

My installer tested the water and said that is what it should be at.
Here are my current settings in the master programming menu:

Fleck 5800SXT Settings:
DF = Gal
VT = 5800.0
RF = dF1b
CT = Fd
C = 19
H = 22
RS =RC
RC = 100
DO = 21
RT = 2:00
Bw= 10
Bd = 60
RR = 10
BF = 15
FM = T0.7

my injector is #1 BFLC IS.25 and DLFC IS 2.0. My tank I believe is 8x40

 

[Jaymackin773]

Just got my hach 5b kit. Hardness before softener was exactly 22 like the installer said. Hardness after softener was somewhere in between 7-8 drops (2 tests were done). So it seems as if it’s not softening all the way.

 

[Reach4]

2 gpm DLFC is usually used on a 9 inch tank. So you may have 1 cuft of media in a 9x40. To measure the tank diameter, measure the circumference, and divide by pi (3.14). Then round down.

With a 1 cuft resin and a 0.25 gpm BLFC and BF=15, that would be about 11.25 lbs of salt per cuft of resin

I see no reason for your softening to not be better. While I would raise your H to 25 to compensate for high hardness, I would also raise your C.

I was wondering if your BLFC was not 0.125 gpm. That would reduce the capacity and give more hardness leakage, especially as it gets later after the regen.

 

[Jaymackin773]

2 gpm DLFC is usually used on a 9 inch tank. So you may have 1 cuft of media in a 9x40. To measure the tank diameter, measure the circumference, and divide by pi (3.14). Then round down.

With a 1 cuft resin and a 0.25 gpm BLFC and BF=15, that would be about 11.25 lbs of salt per cuft of resin

I see no reason for your softening to not be better. While I would raise your H to 25 to compensate for high hardness, I would also raise your C.

I was wondering if your BLFC was not 0.125 gpm. That would reduce the capacity and give more hardness leakage, especially as it gets later after the regen.

Well according to the sticker on the side of the valve, BLFC is .25 and DLFC says 2.0. What would you suggest I raise my C parameter to based on what you notice?

 

[Reach4]

Revised based on number from https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/help-for-programming-fleck-5810.82673/#post-595983

The less salt per cubic ft, the more salt efficient, but more hardness breakthrough.
BLFC: 0.25
cubic ft resin: 1


This table is based on 1 cuft of resin. Based on your hardness leakage, you may have less resin. 8 lb/cuft of salt is usually good giving good softening with good salt usage. But you are using a lot more salt than that. I could re-do this table presuming 3/4 cuft of resin. I suggest that you check softness in your cold water the day after regen, and then later into the count-down on the display.

lb/cuft​	C=​	BF=​	grains/pound of salt​
4.5​	18.0​	6​	2666​
5.3​	19.6​	7​	2491​
6.0​	21.0​	8​	2335​
6.8​	22.2​	9​	2197​
7.5​	23.3​	10​	2073​
8.3​	24.3​	11​	1963​
9.0​	25.2​	12​	1863​
9.8​	25.9​	13​	1773​
10.5​	26.6​	14​	1691​
11.3​	27.3​	15​	1617​
12.0​	27.9​	16​	1548​

Maybe the media is not 1 cuft, and is maybe something less, based on your hardness leakage.
This table presumes 1 cuft of media.