Change pressure switch from 20-35 to 40-60?

[Larry Schwarcz]

Hi Everyone,

I just installed an Acquaer CJE050-1 (Leo Pumps) and the pressure switch that it came with is a 20-35 PSI switch.

I didn't realize this until I was trying to troubleshoot why the pressure is so much lower than my old pump.

Can I replace the stock pressure switch with something like this Square D FSG2J24CP 40-60 PSI switch without causing any damage to the pump?

Thanks in advance!
Larry.

 

[Chucky_ott]

I'm not a pro but probably not. A quick search for the technical specs shows that the max head this pump can produce is 115ft. That translates to 50psi. So your cutoff needs to be lower than that. How much lower, I don't know.

 

[Sponsor]

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

I'm not a pro but probably not. A quick search for the technical specs shows that the max head this pump can produce is 115ft. That translates to 50psi. So your cutoff needs to be lower than that. How much lower, I don't know.

Hi Chucky,

Thanks for your quick reply! Not exactly the answer I wanted but informative nonetheless.

I do have some additional information that may be useful. The water depth is roughly 14' and I have 20' of pipe. So the distance to lift the water isn't very high.

And, the brochure and manual for the pump say the pressure switch is a 30-50 even though a 20-35 came installed on it.

Here's the performance curve for the pump. I have the UDPm50-1 on this curve (1/2 hp).

Given the that it's a pretty shallow well and that it seems the correct pressure switch should be a 30-50, does this change your answer? I was going to buy a new switch but I still have the 40-60 off of my old pump. Do you think I could cause any harm by installing it just to try it out?

Thanks again!
Larry.

 

[Chucky_ott]

Pressure switches are adjustable so they probably use the same switch for all their pumps. They just adjust the nuts inside the switch to lower the cut-on/cut-off pressure (small nut to change the range, i.e from 20-40 to 25-40; large nut to shift the cut-off/cut-on without changing the range, i.e. from 20-40 to 30-50). Looks like both nuts were used in your case.

Before I knew what I know now, I too increased the pressure of my jet pump from 30-50 to 40-60. It worked for a while until it didn't. When it eventually failed, I did more research and found out that my pump can only build about 58 psi. Having the cutoff at 60psi worked for a while but eventually, for whatever reason, the 58-psi pump was no longer able to reach the 60-psi cut-off. So the pump did not shut off. And with no call for water, the pump overheated, the water inside the pump turned to steam, and eventually one of the PVC fittings melted. Water everywhere in my pump house.

So no, I don't think you should increase it. Maybe 25-45 would be safe but 45 is close to your pump's maximum of 50. I don't know what a good safety factor would be. My 58-psi pump came with a 30-50 pressure switch, so that's what I'm using now.

 

[Chucky_ott]

Pressure switches are adjustable so they probably use the same switch for all their pumps. They just adjust the nuts inside the switch to lower the cut-on/cut-off pressure (small nut to change the range, i.e from 20-40 to 25-40; large nut to shift the cut-off/cut-on without changing the range, i.e. from 20-40 to 30-50). Looks like both nuts were used in your case.

Before I knew what I know now, I too increased the pressure of my jet pump from 30-50 to 40-60. It worked for a while until it didn't. When it eventually failed, I did more research and found out that my pump can only build about 58 psi. Having the cutoff at 60psi worked for a while but eventually, for whatever reason, the 58-psi pump was no longer able to reach the 60-psi cut-off. So the pump did not shut off. And with no call for water, the pump overheated, the water inside the pump turned to steam, and eventually one of the PVC fittings melted. Water everywhere in my pump house.

So no, I don't think you should increase it. Maybe 25-45 would be safe but 45 is close to your pump's maximum of 50. I don't know what a good safety factor would be.

And if you do change it, you need to also change the pressure of your pressure tank. For a jet pump, that's about 4psi less than the cut-in pressure. You do that when the tank has no water (system pressure is at zero)

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

And if you do change it, you need to also change the pressure of your pressure tank. For a jet pump, that's about 4psi less than the cut-in pressure. You do that when the tank has no water (system pressure is at zero)

What would happen if the pressure tank was too high? It was set to 38 PSI on my old pump with the 40-60 pressure switch and I haven't changed it. Would that have an impact on the pressure coming out of the pump?

Thanks again!
Larry.

 

[Chucky_ott]

I think it would not hold a lot of water and your pump would likely cycle a lot when there is a call for water.

 

[Reach4]

What would happen if the pressure tank was too high? It was set to 38 PSI on my old pump with the 40-60 pressure switch and I haven't changed it. Would that have an impact on the pressure coming out of the pump?

When using water, you would get a momentary drop in pressure when the pump turns on, but is not yet delivering enough water to keep up. The higher the flow, the bigger the pressure gap. No injury, but it could be irritating in a shower.

 

[Chucky_ott]

When using water, you would get a momentary drop in pressure when the pump turns on, but is not yet delivering enough water to keep up. The higher the flow, the bigger the pressure gap. No injury, but it could be irritating in a shower.

Would that not be the case if the tank pre-charge was set too low? He has it set too high.

Never mind. If it's too low, you would have no water until the pump turns on and starts pumping

 

[Reach4]

Would that not be the case if the tank pre-charge was set too low? He has it set too high.

Too-low precharge symptom is that the diaphragm gets stretched more, so tank life would be reduced. Also, if the tank has "multi-dome", as some better tanks do, the pump could shut off prematurely as the expanded diaphragm gets stopped by the dome. The extra dome is to prevent over-stretching in the case of too-low precharge. Multi-dome is a premium feature. Goulds hydropro offers "steel inner shell", which is their name for multi-dome.

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

BTW, I've tried to contact the manufacture but so far have not any any luck. The only US phone number just rings and then asks for an access code and no reply to my e-mails (the e-mail address on their Facebook page is an invalid address!).

It's looking like this pump won't be able to handle the higher pressure switch.

Any recommendations on a new pump that would work well here? Maybe something under $400?

Thanks again for all of the great information here!
Larry.

 

[Valveman]

That pump has a max head of 125'. Minus the 16' to water that leaves 109'. 109 divided by 2.31 is 47 PSI. Working anywhere close to that will cause the pump to get hot. I like a pump that can build 10 PSI more than the pressure switch shut off. This one says it has a mx pressure of 70 PSI, so it will work with a 40/60 switch. Might want to turn it down to 35/55 with the 16' to water. https://www.homedepot.com/p/K2-PRO-...n6JIJsrYkDTpZnsNacvfA-9bHjAj4nK2MX8fC5o&gQT=1

Was just a quick search. there are many to choose from and some build 80+ PSI like the J5SH. The trick to making even cheap pumps last is to prevent the on/off cycling.

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

That pump has a max head of 125'. Minus the 16' to water that leaves 109'. 109 divided by 2.31 is 47 PSI. Working anywhere close to that will cause the pump to get hot. I like a pump that can build 10 PSI more than the pressure switch shut off. This one says it has a mx pressure of 70 PSI, so it will work with a 40/60 switch. Might want to turn it down to 35/55 with the 16' to water. https://www.homedepot.com/p/K2-PRO-...n6JIJsrYkDTpZnsNacvfA-9bHjAj4nK2MX8fC5o&gQT=1

Was just a quick search. there are many to choose from and some build 80+ PSI like the J5SH. The trick to making even cheap pumps last is to prevent the on/off cycling.

Hi Valveman,

Thanks for all of the great info! I've been only looking at deep well pumps since that's what was there when I bought my house. I don't know if the water level ever changes but given the pipe length of 20' I suppose a shallow well pump should work fine.

I checked out the Goulds J5SH. It looks like a great pump but they are not cheap! And, I tried to find their website but the only Goulds pump website I could find doesn't show any pumps in the smaller class like I would need.

Industrial Pumps Manufacturer | ITT Goulds Pumps | Goulds Pumps

Industrial Pumps Manufacturer for a wide range of markets — including chemical, mining, oil & gas, power generation, pulp and paper, and general industry. Its global reputation for innovation and quality spans more than 160 years.

www.gouldspumps.com

Are these made under license from some other company?

Are there any other brand/models you'd suggest but at a lower cost? This pump is only used for irrigation of my yard so it's not as though it's running all day and night.

Thanks again,
Larry.

 

[Fitter30]

Hi Valveman,

Thanks for all of the great info! I've been only looking at deep well pumps since that's what was there when I bought my house. I don't know if the water level ever changes but given the pipe length of 20' I suppose a shallow well pump should work fine.

I checked out the Goulds J5SH. It looks like a great pump but they are not cheap! And, I tried to find their website but the only Goulds pump website I could find doesn't show any pumps in the smaller class like I would need.

Industrial Pumps Manufacturer | ITT Goulds Pumps | Goulds Pumps

Industrial Pumps Manufacturer for a wide range of markets — including chemical, mining, oil & gas, power generation, pulp and paper, and general industry. Its global reputation for innovation and quality spans more than 160 years.

www.gouldspumps.com

Are these made under license from some other company?

Are there any other brand/models you'd suggest but at a lower cost? This pump is only used for irrigation of my yard so it's not as though it's running all day and night.

Thanks again,
Larry.

You have to have all the variables to pick a pump. Pump sit right above the well? Gpm you want? Pipe size, material, length of pipe, number of fitting and voltage? Use is irrigation are you going to be drinking any of this water? Heated, dry space for pump expansion tank or going to pull the pump for winter?

 

[Reach4]

Thanks for all of the great info! I've been only looking at deep well pumps since that's what was there when I bought my house. I don't know if the water level ever changes but given the pipe length of 20' I suppose a shallow well pump should work fine.

Is this a 2-inch well?

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

You have to have all the variables to pick a pump. Pump sit right above the well? Gpm you want? Pipe size, material, length of pipe, number of fitting and voltage? Use is irrigation are you going to be drinking any of this water? Heated, dry space for pump expansion tank or going to pull the pump for winter?

I'm really trying to just keep the well working as good as it did before the old pump developed a leak.

The old pump was an Ace ACE5C. I don't know the specs (GPM) but here's the data label:

The pipes are 1-1/4" PVC down and 1" PVC up. The well diameter is 6".

Here's the whole assembly with my new Leo pump:

I have 120 VAC available. I could pull wire to make it 240 VAC but it would be a lot of work.

In the winter (I live in the Portland, OR area) I turn off the pump and blow the water out of all of the lines. The pump stays in place. When I installed this new one I used unions on all of the pipes so I could remove it but I doubt I will .

Water is used exclusively for irrigation. No drinking this water (not even the dogs).

Like I said in an earlier post, I didn't really think about buying a shallow well pump. The old pump was a deep well pump and I just stuck with that style since it seemed to work fine.

Hopefully this answers all of your questions! Any other info I should have given at the start of this thread?

Thanks again everyone!
Larry.

 

[Reach4]

Damn... sorry you are going thru this. It looks like you might have a 4 inch steel-cased well.

A 1/2 HP 10 gpm submersible would do wonders -- more gallons per watt. If that is 4-inch steel, for a submersible I would go to a Grundfos SQ 3-inch submersible with a flow inducer ( flow inducer simple and cheap). https://www.ebay.com/itm/256381627761 is not so cheap.

If that were 4 inch PVC instead of steel, you could use a cheaper submersible.

But cheapest, try adjusting the pressure switch up. Turn the nut on the big spring clockwise (typically 10 psi is 3.5 turns). Make sure pressure can reach cutoff, and then back off the setting by maybe 5 psi from the max it can do.

 

[Larry Schwarcz]

Damn... sorry you are going thru this. It looks like you might have a 4 inch steel-cased well.

A 1/2 HP 10 gpm submersible would do wonders -- more gallons per watt. If that is 4-inch steel, for a submersible I would go to a Grundfos SQ 3-inch submersible with a flow inducer ( flow inducer simple and cheap). https://www.ebay.com/itm/256381627761 is not so cheap.

If that were 4 inch PVC instead of steel, you could use a cheaper submersible.

But cheapest, try adjusting the pressure switch up. Turn the nut on the big spring clockwise (typically 10 psi is 3.5 turns). Make sure pressure can reach cutoff, and then back off the setting by maybe 5 psi from the max it can do.

The well is a 6". I was right there but didn't bother to check the material! UGH! I think it was steel but I should double check before committing to that answer.

Do you think I could instead replace the pressure switch with a 30-50? It's not the 40-60 I'd like but hopefully would be close to what I had and pressure switches are cheap.

Thanks again,
Larry.

 

[Bannerman]

Do you think I could instead replace the pressure switch with a 30-50?

No! See Valveman's reply from post #12 above.

That pump has a max head of 125'. Minus the 16' to water that leaves 109'. 109 divided by 2.31 is 47 PSI. ... I like a pump that can build 10 PSI more than the pressure switch shut off.

A pump that can build to at best, only 47 psi, will never shut off a pressure switch set to 50 psi.

To ensure a 50 psi cut out pressure will always be achieved, the pump should be capable of building to at least 60 psi. For a 40/60 pressure switch setting, the pump should be capable of building to 70 psi or higher.

 

[Reach4]

The well is a 6". I was right there but didn't bother to check the material! UGH! I think it was steel but I should double check before committing to that answer.

That is great news. A 4 inch submersible would be a fine upgrade. Steel is fine as long as the tolerances are not too close.

try adjusting the pressure switch up. Turn the nut on the big spring clockwise (typically 10 psi is 3.5 turns). Make sure pressure can reach cutoff, and then back off the setting by maybe 5 psi from the max it can do.

Why buy a switch before trying to adjust the existing switch? I suggest removing the cover on the switch. See how much pressure you develop if you hold the contacts together with an insulated tool. See how high the pressure goes in maybe 1 minute with no water flow (block it). Adjust the pressure switch to shut off 5 psi lower than that.