Reactivating well/new pump/no water.

I have been re-activating a well which we haven't used since purchasing the property 14 years ago (the well we do use is not producing enough water). The plumber/well man got the existing pump started but said it would have to be replaced. I ran off water to test that it would run consistently, which it did and had it tested. It came back with high coliforms & e-coli, so we disinfected the well. While running off the bleached water, the pump stopped drawing water. Since the pump was going to have to be replaced, I had this done. I started to run off water again and, after about 3/4 of an hour it stopped drawing water. I am going to have to call the plumber back but thought I'd check the internet and see what I could find out for myself. I see references to priming and pressure but the pump does not seem to have a 'plug' and the tank does have pressure. It is a Schaeffer jet pump - shallow well, I assume, since there is one pipe. Can anybody advise me on what's happening here. Thanks.

They symptoms you report suggest that you are running out of water. If the water is so low that your first well is running low, then it is possible that your second one is in the same aquifer.

A 3/4 HP pump will pump as much water in 3/4 hour as you usually use in a day. It would not be unusual to run out of water.

You could have an air leak but the fact that you are able to prime and start the pump suggests that it is not an air leak.

If the well was 'dry', the pump would suck air and there would be no pressure on the guage.

The pumps are probably sucking something up against the inlet of the foot valve (screen) or into the jet which will prevent water movement.

After the plumber first got it up and running again, he told me to leave it running for a couple of hours to ensure that there was enough water. There was no problem. When, after testing and then disinfecting, I turned it on again to run off the bleached water, it was fine. It was about 1/2 to 3/4 of an hour into this that it stopped drawing. And, as I said, after the new pump was installed and I turned it on, at the plumber's suggestion to run it a bit, and it started with no problem, then, again, stopped drawing water after 3/4 hour. Perhaps I misunderstood and should not, judging by your comment, have run it so long. The tap was never turned fully on at any of these times, by the way, and the water is just running from the pump, not through the rest of the system. If the problem is caused by not enough water, why did it run perfectly well for two hours the first time?
My problem now is that I would like to get it started again and can't figure out how to prime it - I keep reading that there is a plug which should be removed and water poured into the pump, but there is no plug. A pipe comes out of the part of the pump where I imagine the water must go and runs straight up into the pressure tank on top of it.
The objective is to have the two pumps running so that between them there is enough water. I would like to get the water running again so that I can get a clean test before I have the plumber back to get the two of them synchonised. I don't want to have to call him back just to prime it if I can do it myself.

Looks as if we were writing at the same time, Garry. What does that mean exactly? Is there anything I can do or do I need to get the plumber again?

You would pull the foot valve/drop pipe and clean the screen if simply raising it didn't clean it. Then clean the sediment out of the well by air lift or surging or bailing it. Well drillers do that.

If you're just wanting to try to prime the pump... call your plumber and ask him to tell you how to do it over the phone.. If he's a decent business person he will tell you. If he's just after a buck he'll insist on coming out and charging you for a service call.

How To Prime A Shallow Well Pump:
(Shallow Well = 25' or less)
There is a pump head that the motor is attached to. It has a suction side (well) and discharge side (house) coming out of it. Around here we usually have 1.25" suction lines, with smaller discharge lines. The pump head should have a plug on top (3/4") to prime it and a 1/4" plug at the bottom to drain (winterize) it.
A. You need a gallon of drinking water, a roll of teflon tape and a pipe wrench to prime it.
B. Unplug or turn off the power to the pump.
C. Remove the 3/4" plug and wrap 2-3 flat wraps of teflon tape around the threads clockwise only as the threaded end faces you.
D. Fill the pump head with water from the jug, turn on/plug the pump in and quickly begin hand-tightening the plug back in. It will spew and sputter around the plug while the pump is trying to prime, but that's normal. Keep hand-tightening it until it picks up prime, then tighten it on up with the wrench. Let it run until cut-off. It's primed.
E. If it doesn't pick up prime the first time, just repeat the steps until it does (including replacing the teflon tape each time).

Another, even easier priming method if you have another water source (second well or public water) tied into the same supply lines:
A. Turn off/unplug the pump that you want to prime.
B. Open any shut valves, etc. between both water sources (if any) and allow the second source to backfill the pump that you're trying to prime and voila!, it's primed. Turn the second source off or let it run until it cuts off, and turn on and let your newly primed pump run until it cuts off. Then turn the second one back on.

As far as your running out of water, you may need to clean or replace the point, or do a deeper well.

Good Luck!
Mike

Thank you for all the input.
I have opened the well and jiggled the pipe - the joint between the pipe running to the house and the one running down into the well is pretty far down and I had to use an extendible window cleaning handle to reach it so, perhaps, I wasn't lifting it enough. It hasn't made any difference.
I should have realised that I could prime the pump from the primary pump - it's kind of obvious now that I think about it. Anyway, I can get the pressure tank filled and the pump and running now, so must assume there's nothing wrong there, but still can't get it to draw water from the well. You say, Mike, to turn the other pump back on after getting the newly primed one going, but I have to close the valve between them because I don't want to get possibly contaminated water into the rest of the system. Perhaps the problem is that I should have them both turned on until it draws?

Did I miss something? What is this second pump you mentioned?

If you were able to run this water with a shallow well jet pump for two hours without running out and your running it open discharge from the pump, there is no way you can dry it up in 1/2 hour the next time. In a 6 inch well you only have 1.5 gallons per foot. I the water level was 1 ft. from ground level, you would have run out of water in about 2 minutes if the well didn't produce much water. There is something your not telling us that is important, but I am not sure what it is.

If the plumber installed this pump and the pump only had one discharge port (normally on the top) he should have installed a tee with a plug in the top to allow priming. If not, don't have him back.

bob...

I answered my own last question and left the valve open so that the primary pump continued to backfill the secondary one until it started drawing water from its well. So, success there at last. My problem now is that I now have to run off the bleached water but, when I set everything up to do so, the pump kept turning off and on. What would be causing this? I ran it for half an hour this afternoon and thought I'd better give up again, in case the switching off and on causes yet another problem. Is it all right to run it when it's switching on and off? Could the switching on and off be due to the small tank? The tank is very small because the idea is to run the two pumps together so they don't both need a large tank. Or does the tank need more/less air?
With your help, I seemed to have ruled out too little water, blocked foot valve, bad plumber, etc. Many thanks. Now, if I can just solve the kicking in and off bit, I'll be able to finish running the bleach off and get the water tested and have the plumber back to synchronize the two pumps and stop having to worry about the water supply.

I still don't understand the two pump thing, and yes the tank is too small, or you need to set the switch higher to keep the pump/s running.

bob...

Yeah I wonder too... He has two wells, so I suspect he has them connected with a pump at each; although he certainly doesn't say so and IMO (from my experience), that is not a good idea. He's trying to prevent cross contamination from one well to the other, or at least the water from the other well. I would guess that with both pumps running he has no means other than possibly seeing dirty water from the well that was shocked, as to which well the water is from.

The system was set up by a previous owner of the home and was active when I purchased it 14 years ago. For clarity, I will call one well, pump and large tank the primary and the other well, pump and small tank the secondary. Shortly after we moved in, the secondary pump was leaking and the plumber I called suggested sealing it off as the water from the primary well was adequate. We have not used it since. However, this is a rural area and expansion of a quarry has caused the water level to drop so that the primary well is no long producing enough water and the plumber I called for advice suggested getting the double system going again (apparently it is quite common, I'm not quite sure why you don't understand). He proceeded to get the pump going again and found that the original leakage problem was seals which should have been replaced under warranty all those years ago. That, of course is water under the bridge now (excuse the pun), but the pump would have to be replaced. He did, however get it going for me to check out the consistency of the water supply from this secondary well which is on a spring, I was told originally. All was fine to this point except that the water tested bad. It was after disinfecting the well and starting to run of the bleached water, that the pump stopped drawing water and, thinking the old pump was the cause, I went ahead and had it replaced, although I would have preferred to ensure first that it was the disused well and not the water source itself that had caused the contamination.
Anyway, as I said yesterday, I can now get the water running but the pump kicks off and on all the time and I don't know how safe it is to keep it running this way. The old pump did not do this when I ran it for two hours to test for consistency. If it is okay to let it do this until I have run off the bleach, I will do so as this is the primary concern at the moment so as to get the water tested and have the plumber back in to finish the job. I just need some reassurrance that I won't damage the new pump. Also, maybe somebody can give me some idea of how long it takes to run off the bleach - I let it run for about half an hour yesterday but then was afraid of damaging it and gave up and came back to this forum to see if anybody could advise me.

We need to know what type of pumps. You said the one is a shallow well jet IIRC, what type is the primary?

If I understand you, the old well is the one that is contaminated and now you have a new pump on/in it AND both wells/waters are connected somehow. So what does the plumber have to come back for?

The old pump in the old well worked for two hrs. Then quit, was replaced and now is on/off over'n over, correct?

If so, then I think something is leaking allowing the pressure to fall and then the pump comes on and builds pressure to the shut off and this repeats until you shut off the power.

Are you shutting off power to both pumps?

Why did you have to run the primary well pump to get water from the old well?

If you lost prime on the old well pump and the pimary pump is repriming it, that proves a leak in the old well plumbing or drop pipe or foot valve.

I suggest that you run the old well alone to get rid of the chlorine, with the new well disconnected from the old well. You should have shut off valves to isolate either well from the other.

I called for advice suggested getting the double system going again (apparently it is quite common, I'm not quite sure why you don't understand)

Click to expand...

This is not common. It may be to your plumber, but sure isn't with me. If one well is not producing good because of the quarry dropping the water level, why does the other one produce better? They you said the secondary well was on a spring. Which is it? A well or a spring? Your confusing the hell out of me!

Can you tell us all about these wells? Drilled, springs, depth, water level (you have had the pipe out, so you should know this) diameter, how many pipes from both pumps to wells (one or two) types, brand and horsepower of pumps etc. Anything else you can tell us to make it clearer in our minds what you have there.

The cycling of the pump is not good for the motor. Why it's cycling, who knows, like Gary said, you may have a leak or a bad check/foot valve. We need more info about the equipment.

bob...