Troubleshooting two 3-way switch setups
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Trouble with 3way Switch!
Yep, Both lights should go on and off together.
and Ill give that a shot Billy Bob. another problem is that I cant change the wiring to Light #1 as the wall was completely finished by the previous owner, will this make a difference?
Yep, Both lights should go on and off together.
and Ill give that a shot Billy Bob. another problem is that I cant change the wiring to Light #1 as the wall was completely finished by the previous owner, will this make a difference?
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Billy_Bob
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You would just need access to the wire going to that light.
And of course be able to wire everything else like in the diagram above. This is an illegal and very dangerous wiring method and should never be undertaken
Or wire it in the traditional manner. Many ways to do this...
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Do you then say you have 3 travelers instead of 2?Yes, that's called a California or coast 3 way...
Issue Resolved
Thanks for your help everybody... the california circuit was the way to go
should something go wrong your little a$$ will be in a very tight situation.
This is an illegal and very dangerous wiring method and should never be undertaken
Thanks for your help everybody... the california circuit was the way to go
should something go wrong your little a$$ will be in a very tight situation.
This is an illegal and very dangerous wiring method and should never be undertaken
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timmer62
New Member
3-way switch troubleshooting
S1 down, s2 down, light off
S1 up, s2 down, light off
S1 down, s2 up, light off
S1 up, s2 up, light on
any ideas how to resolve?
thanks
S1 down, s2 down, light off
S1 up, s2 down, light off
S1 down, s2 up, light off
S1 up, s2 up, light on
any ideas how to resolve?
thanks
mgabbard
New Member
Another 3-way case for you
Hi there,
I have a relatively new home (10 years old) and am replacing the standard rocker switches / receptacles in my house with decorator models room by room. Everything has been easy so far (3-ways, 4-ways, 2-ways, etc) , but am having trouble figuring out what's up with one 3-way in one of my rooms. The old switches I marked the common and the travellers, and on the new decorator switches I connected the commons to the common pole and the 2 travellers to the traveller poles. But the switches are behaving strange.
#1 down, #2 down - lights are on
#1 up, #2 down - lights are on
#1 down, #2 up - lights are off
#1 up, #2 up - lights are on
So when #1 is up - no matter what #2 is (up or down) it still completes the circuit. And when #2 is down, no matter what #1 is (up or down) it still completes the circuit as well. Very strange. It's like they are wired in parallel.
These are brand new switches and I have jiggled the wiring to make sure there are no shorts in the wires.
Any guidance you can give you be most helpful. I've been looking at this one too long and need a fresh set of eyes.
Thanks!
...M
Hi there,
I have a relatively new home (10 years old) and am replacing the standard rocker switches / receptacles in my house with decorator models room by room. Everything has been easy so far (3-ways, 4-ways, 2-ways, etc) , but am having trouble figuring out what's up with one 3-way in one of my rooms. The old switches I marked the common and the travellers, and on the new decorator switches I connected the commons to the common pole and the 2 travellers to the traveller poles. But the switches are behaving strange.
#1 down, #2 down - lights are on
#1 up, #2 down - lights are on
#1 down, #2 up - lights are off
#1 up, #2 up - lights are on
So when #1 is up - no matter what #2 is (up or down) it still completes the circuit. And when #2 is down, no matter what #1 is (up or down) it still completes the circuit as well. Very strange. It's like they are wired in parallel.
These are brand new switches and I have jiggled the wiring to make sure there are no shorts in the wires.
Any guidance you can give you be most helpful. I've been looking at this one too long and need a fresh set of eyes.
Thanks!
...M
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Jim Port
Electrical Contractor
Regardless of UP or DOWN a 3 way will reverse the current condition of OFF or ON. Your setup is working properly.
Jim Port
Electrical Contractor
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[So much for freedom of speech!
I guess this comes under freedom of listening or not. . .]
I found it is much easier to predict the results given the schematic instead of the other way around, but I can't resist a good puzzle.
An "impossible outcome" means that we are assuming something that is not true.
What's good about these is that we will probably learn something new. Plus, nobody else wants these budget-busters.
To find out what it is I'd say check #1 switch with an ohmmeter. If it checks good something has changed inside the walls and that's a separate troubleshooting procedure involving a voltmeter and incand. bulbs.
There are many different wiring diagrams for this, but I can only find two schematics. In any case it's a source in series with a load in series with an SPST switch made up of two 3-way and zero or more 4-way switches.
Electrical Contractor
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[So much for freedom of speech!
I guess this comes under freedom of listening or not. . .]I found it is much easier to predict the results given the schematic instead of the other way around, but I can't resist a good puzzle.
Taking only the case shown above, if you step through on a piece of paper all 3 ways of hooking up the 3 terminals of a working #1 switch to 3 wires and with switch #1 in both positions [6 diagrams in all] I don't see how this outcome is possible unless you have #22 wiring with 3 travelers.
An "impossible outcome" means that we are assuming something that is not true.
What's good about these is that we will probably learn something new. Plus, nobody else wants these budget-busters.
To find out what it is I'd say check #1 switch with an ohmmeter. If it checks good something has changed inside the walls and that's a separate troubleshooting procedure involving a voltmeter and incand. bulbs.
There are many different wiring diagrams for this, but I can only find two schematics. In any case it's a source in series with a load in series with an SPST switch made up of two 3-way and zero or more 4-way switches.
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Jim Port
Electrical Contractor
How would something have changed within the walls? All the wiring should be in accessible junction boxes. If the box was buried there would be no way to make a change to it.
The example posted is the way that 3 ways work. There is nothing to troubleshoot.
The example posted is the way that 3 ways work. There is nothing to troubleshoot.
roncarter
New Member
1 dn 2 dn = off
1 up 2 dn = off
1 dn 2 up = on
1 up 2 up = on
I replaced porceline sockets (working properly) with can lights and found that I MUST have made an error, and now I seem to be missing the nuetral for 4 of the new lights. If I hook up a jumper wire from the nuetral at sw#1(where feed comes from) the 4 lights work but trips the breaker in one of the variations of switch configurations as follows:
1 dn 2 dn = off
1 up 2 dn = trip
1 dn 2 up = on
1 up 2 up = trip
hj
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Switch 3 is probably, but not necessarily, the miswired one, and there are several ways it could be miswired. One problem is that you would have to test switches 1 and 2 under ALL possible configurations to ensure that 3 is actually the misfit.
roncarter
New Member
3 way switch troubles
I now have all 3 switches working so they can turn the lights all off and on, BUT... the bulbs (all same wattage) are dim. and if I remove any bulb, the rest of the lamps go off.
I now have all 3 switches working so they can turn the lights all off and on, BUT... the bulbs (all same wattage) are dim. and if I remove any bulb, the rest of the lamps go off.
DonL
Jack of all trades Master of one
Ron,
That will save you electricity, being wired in series.
Nice Job.
Have a Great evening.
DonL
That will save you electricity, being wired in series.
Nice Job.
Have a Great evening.
DonL
roncarter
New Member
Thanks DonL, but they aren't wired in series. At least not in what might be considered the "normal" series circuit.
It seems that one or more of them are 'hung' on travelers, rather than the neutral and hots. I have 4 boxes to go check to see where I hooked up wrong! All of the boxes are attached to the original ceiling joists 14" above the new 5/8FC ceiling, which obviously makes it very difficult to get to for troubleshooting purposes. I posted here to pick ya'lls brains about where I might start looking to possibly save some aggravation.
It seems that one or more of them are 'hung' on travelers, rather than the neutral and hots. I have 4 boxes to go check to see where I hooked up wrong! All of the boxes are attached to the original ceiling joists 14" above the new 5/8FC ceiling, which obviously makes it very difficult to get to for troubleshooting purposes. I posted here to pick ya'lls brains about where I might start looking to possibly save some aggravation.
Assign each switch a number.
With switch #1 & switch #2 down, light is on or off?
With #1 up & #2 down, light is on or off?
With #1 down and #2 up, light is on or off?
With #1 & #2 up, light is on or off?
off
on
on
on
The weird thing is, if the downstairs switch is on, then the upstairs switch can't turn off. Both on and off keep the light on.
This one has been baffling a friend and I for weeks. Any help would be appreciated.
With switch #1 & switch #2 down, light is on or off?
With #1 up & #2 down, light is on or off?
With #1 down and #2 up, light is on or off?
With #1 & #2 up, light is on or off?
off
on
on
on
The weird thing is, if the downstairs switch is on, then the upstairs switch can't turn off. Both on and off keep the light on.
This one has been baffling a friend and I for weeks. Any help would be appreciated.
ActionDave
Electrician
It would be my bet that the upstairs switch is not functional due to miswiring, bad switch or it just plain never worked.
The downstairs switch does the same thing though. Turn on the upstairs switch and you can't turn it off downstairs.
This all worked until we took down a wall and one of the other light switches
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