Hydrocare HC38 Thoughts???

Here is a link to what I believe is a controlled experiment to see if this thing works:

http://wavehomesolutions.com/content/hydrocare/test-results.cfm

I hate soft water also. Would never consider owning one for the reasons stated above. I do have the lime scale problem though. After reading the pros and cons posted on this blog I decided to give this thing a try. Before I buy, I am going to check on the "1 year satisfaction guaranteed or return it at no cost" warranty to make sure it is legitimate. If it is, I'm willing to give it a try.

The way I look at it, there's nothing to loose except my lime scale problem, I hope!

Nice try. The link is not to a testing agency but rather a data collection agency. A data collection agency that receives its primary revenues from those companies using their services. By all means try it for a year and then tell us what a great job it did though you can not actually prove any of the results.

here's a better link - read carefully


http://www.onspex.com/about/index.htm

Well, I have a long history of working with electrical fields of all kinds, and of course anyone who has experience with electrical fields knows that there is also a magnetic component, so I found this little gem http://www.nmsr.org/magnetic.htm to instill some sense into those who doubt the efficacy of the "simple home experiment." My drinking buddies think that this is just hilarious, but sad to see so many people not believing their grade school science...

Nice link thanks. Here is another you might find interesting

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/magscams.html

Wally Hays said:

Nice link thanks. Here is another you might find interesting

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/magscams.html

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Hi Wally... I found this link to a U.S. Army Corps of Engineers report, check out page 34... http://www.cecer.army.mil/techreports/Hock_MagneticDescalers/Hock_MagneticDescalers.pdf

Oh that one is a beauty. Thanks for the link. Most thorough test yet with predictable results.

Ok I am new to this board too - and not a plant from Hydrocare - In fact I am still skeptical myself.
I found this just like many others - by googling Hyrdrocare reviews - because I like to research something before I buy it.
I have NOT purchased one and I am still researching but this site appears to NOT be of much use because:

After reading many many pages of this thread I conclude the following:

1 - the oldtimers on this site discount and attack anyone else that is new like myself that found this site the same way I did - especially if they want to add a positive review of the Hydrocare
2 - the oldtimers continue to rip on this product based on no personal data - not one has actually spent the $600 to test it and make an educated opinion or conclusion

This thread appears to be run by a bunch of water softener salesmen that refuse to test the product and refuse to give credibility to anyone but themselves....

I did read the reviews from some newbies that tested it and I will search online for more "ACTUAL" tests - as this appears to be a dead end site of biased "opinions"

If you have no data to support your "opinion" - then don't post anything....

Back on the near dead horse again we go.

I have know people in the area that have used and like along with those that do not like or say that it works and those that say it does not work.

From my reading over the years it looks to work on the large scale and with flow rates that are in the 100's of gallons per minute 24/7... the home does not do this.

The other is that the Water Quality Association has yet to run any test on said items because the many makers will not do what is needed for them to run the tests.. read up on that.

Will it work? I truly do not know, but I do know that people come to me for an answer and a fix to what is going on with their water, not a maybe..
So till I see 100% prof that it does what it says it will do for both hardness and the Iron that I deal with , I will stay with what has worked for my 20 years and those before me.

One of the earlier posts referenced a US Army COE test...the ones they tested didn't do much of anything. Until someone can show me the science as to how and why it works, I discount any claims.

Old timers? Jeeez, I may be middle aged but and old timer. Excuse me I have a bingo game to go to.

Look, this thread is 17 going on 18 pages long. There's some good information here and some biased crap also. I believe that If you go through it more thoroughly you will find plenty of supporting evidence and even a few guys ( like me ) that have spent the money and tested the thing ( or similar ones ) Hit the posted links and make the decision for yourself. Personally, if you can read through them and still want to spend the 600 bucks than by all means go right ahead. It's your money.

CADIYER said:

After reading many many pages of this thread I conclude the following:

2 - the oldtimers continue to rip on this product based on no personal data - not one has actually spent the $600 to test it and make an educated opinion or conclusion

If you have no data to support your "opinion" - then don't post anything....

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Well, I don't think I would need $600 to throw away. Beside, I have the perfect test results: removing them from customers' houses where they didn't work, customers were unhappy and recommendations never came. Laboratory results are helpful but not always the only way to tell if something works.

"No data to support opinions" That is a valid statement and I believe what most people ask of those selling these is where are certifications and documentation from leading research facilities and not just 'testimonials' paid for the the manufacturer in the advertising.

No, from what I see, most members here don't routinely bash those new members simply because there is a disagreement. But this piece of equipment commonly appears on forums and no brick and mortor dealers sell these because they would have to stand behind them. I have replaced many of these (or rather left them on) with great results by employing sound water treatment tested by time and proven by customer reactions and recommendations.

A Few Patents for all to Read

For those who believe they're on to something new and revolutionary, kept out of the limelight by the bad old regular water softener companies, please note that a quick search of the U.S. Patent database (you can patent just about anything without proving that it works) at freepatentsonline.com disclosed the following patents from 1926 to nearly the present day. Note that all of these (a quick smattering, there are many more "patents" along the same vein) imply or state that there is some kind of electromagnetic way (not involving gigantic MRI type power consumption) to affect lime scale (non magnetic material).

Try the "simple home experiment" described in an earlier post by me, but here are some representative U.S. Patent numbers so you can make your own decisions about whether you want to buy in (I know most have a lot more money than me!) to this "technology."

U.S. Patents

1773275 (1926), at http://www.freepatentsonline.com/1773275.html
2596743 (1946), at http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2596743.html
2652925 (1949), at http://www.freepatentsonline.com/2652925.html
5074998 (1991), at http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5074998.html
and 5776334 (1998) at http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5776334.html

are indicative of the stuff you can find (and it has been going on for a long time!) if you start digging.

If this "technology" actually works, ever wonder why all the big wholesale/hardware/retail chain stores are not selling it and the government/military won't use it? Of course, I do understand that there is a lot of money to be made in this business, so no amount of evidence will convince many people that they have been "had" by some smooth talking sales pitch, complete with psuedo-scientific sounding gibberish. That (being "had") even happens with some of the "free home water tests" and inflated claims of performance (with commensurate inflated prices) for some equipment that actually works. The best way to treat hard water and combat scale is by doing your own very careful research, do not let anyone hard sell you on ideas that are not provable through modern chemistry and physics. You likely have a reliable local plumbing company or even a big box store that can steer you in the correct direction to solve your specific problem.

The science that sent people to the Moon and in the future perhaps Mars, actually really does understand water treatment, conditioning, and softening systems and the technology that makes them work effectively and reproducibly... well 97% anyway...

That's it for my way more than $0.02 worth, everyone will have to do their own research and reach their own conclusions, but there are a lot of people out there who want your money, and don't particularly care how they get it...

OOOPPS! ... Those were "filing dates" so I guess I'm one of those "Bad Boys"...

Hope you all do your research well, but remember that predictable and reproducible results are what you learned in grade school...

Lots of research, too much cash.

I have been looking in to this thing for a while. I am no expert but here's what I found.......

1. It uses patented tech. that has been proven enough that British Gas recommended it for their customers.

2. The tech was developed by Hydro Path in the UK. It has been widely used in Europe, and Australia for almost a decade.

3. In my opinion the price is too high right now to be viable in this country.

4. The people distributing the product seem unsavory, and use high pressure. I called once for a price, and they kept pestering me for weeks.

5. Do not lump the product in with magnetic type units. If it does what it says, it is not that different from the radio waves used to break up kidney and gallstones. Be aware that the junk is still in the water, it just isn't sticking together, or to your pipes. Once it comes out it could still leave a film depending on how bad the water is. The use of the product seems to be for protecting plumbing, not exactly for softening water.

6. Some communities in California have already banned salt water systems because of the ecological damage. If this spreads, the tech may be the only answer.

If you try to buy it from another country, you may find a better price. The distributors here seem to act like hucksters, and that give it a bad name. I was quoted $500 for the small model, in England you can find it for about $150 US, but I 'm not sure if they can sell in the US because they would be stepping on the American distributors toes. Hydropath, Hydroflow, Hydrocare, Same.

I have to agree with Gary and others that have written in, this product will lighten your wallet, but little else. And I'm speaking as a customer who purchased one of these little boxes. I spent weeks researching this product and could find countless comments about it's wonders. I also found many skeptics, but no one that had actually used the product and reported dissatisfaction.
Well, I'm here to tell you. I used the product and I'm very dissatisifed. I received the product June 7th. It was difficult to get the company to give me any receipts or even tracking information on the product once shipped. Still only received a generic shipping label sent by HQ Hometek, Inc. We installed the product that weekend. Well it is now August 30th and the water pressure is so bad I just paid my plumber $285 to replace several valves and unclog all of my fixtures. What a piece of junk. Don't buy this product. If someone offers it to you...run away!

lsmith8305 said:

I have to agree with Gary and others that have written in, this product will lighten your wallet, but little else. And I'm speaking as a customer who purchased one of these little boxes. I spent weeks researching this product and could find countless comments about it's wonders. I also found many skeptics, but no one that had actually used the product and reported dissatisfaction.
Well, I'm here to tell you. I used the product and I'm very dissatisifed. I received the product June 7th. It was difficult to get the company to give me any receipts or even tracking information on the product once shipped. Still only received a generic shipping label sent by HQ Hometek, Inc. We installed the product that weekend. Well it is now August 30th and the water pressure is so bad I just paid my plumber $285 to replace several valves and unclog all of my fixtures. What a piece of junk. Don't buy this product. If someone offers it to you...run away!

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I can't believe our state/provincial governments (yours and mine) still allow this kind of stuff to be sold to consumers, we might as well get in the business ourselves, at least we'd make some money!... just kidding... You would think that for something that is pretty well proven not to work, that someone, anyone (in government) would step in and put a stop to it, but I guess it is not killing anyone, just a financial embarassment to all those who buy it and discover that it is like a sugar pill... a placebo. And as human beings, it is hard to admit that you've been had, especially when you try to do all the due diligence and still get bamboozled by all the double speak the sellers of these devices give you.

On a lighter note, my fiancee and I just spent several days down in Kalispell and weather was good, left some tourist dollars, had a terrific time and a great visit but didn't buy any Hydrocare...

Why would you want to take the freedom of choice away from anyone while allowing the government to make our buying decisions by making something illegal?

In this case lsmith said he was told they didn't work, and bought one anyway. That was his decision and he pays the price of not listening. That's as life should be, we should be free to make mistakes because really, that's how we learn, from our mistakes and if we don't, we get to make the same mistake again another day until we do learn.

About Jethro not spelling well... If governments keep up taxing'n spending more than they collect while paying no attention to next year, or the years after, you might be kissin' up to Jethro Bodine and his kind just to survive, literally.

Hi Gary and all...

You know, it is like when I used to work for a large corporation and people were whining about how they could take care of their pension money better than the investments that were made by the corporate pension fund people. Well, they got their wish finally, and now most are whining about why the company could have ever let them do it (they lost big time in the recent crash) when they didn't have the expertise, nada, nada to run their own investments. Sometimes people have to be protected from themselves, because they don't usually only hurt themselves, their families are affected by their decisions also.

Now don't get me wrong here, I am solidly in favour of taking responsibility for your own decisions, but when you are dealing with people who only have one goal and that's to flim flam your money out of you, they unfortunately are much better at it than you are at resisting. Ask any magician about why their magic works and they'll tell you it's all about "misdirection." Very smart people are taken in every day by con artists who know a lot more about human psychology than the average person, especially when selling "no recharge salt required" and "only pennies a month for electricity."

Anyway, yes I agree that too much government is not good, and government spending should be the way we spend, if we get into too much debt our car gets reposessed and so on, while the government just prints more money. I'm just whining that con artists should be taken out to the back forty and given a good thrashing and a big fine, then regulated out of business... in a perfect world anyway... Say, didn't there used to be people called "regulators" before sheriffs and police and stuff?

Thanks Gary and all... a very interesting discussion...

P.S. Don't you think the Clampetts were likely much smarter than they appeared, they kept all their money away from Mr. Drysdale didn't they?

Well as much as I hate to promote the continuation of this thread, I have to add my thoughts on “government regulators”. Misdirection is a good word. Although I think misunderstanding or lack of education on technical subjects is more correct. Either way, “regulating” is less about helping the people as it is about “feathering the regulators nest”. There was a time when government regulators where actually looking out for the best interest of the public. Now with the economy, jobs situation, and everybody thinking they are entitled to life, liberty, and happiness, this is no longer the case. The “regulators” I deal with seem to be more interested in protecting their jobs and an early, cushy retirement than actually helping the people. If they solve the real problems, they would be out of a job. So they use misdirection to make people think they are trying to help, when in reality they are perpetuating the situation to maintain their position and salary. I see this happening from the lowest government official to the commander in chief himself.

One case in point is the lead scare tactics. If you know anything about California Prop 65 you should understand this. Prop 65 requires that all lead be removed from plumbing fixtures, pipe, and fittings. Even though a small percentage of lead is an important part of many metals, and there has never been a problem with lead leaching into water, the government is determined to protect us from this “non-problem”. They get to say they are protecting us from the big, bad corporations that are trying to poison our children with leaded products. They go so far as to say “the 800 million dollars that this will cost California alone, will be more than offset by decreased health problems and better jobs for citizens, since they will be more intelligent from the decreased lead exposure”.

The government used the real scare of kids chewing on Chinese toys coated with lead paint to enact tons of regulations that don’t make our water supplies any safer, but just cost us more for products and justifies billions of dollars spent on government policies and salaries. Now the federal government is determined to follow California, so it will cost the public 800 million per state. BTW, they are “helping” by making us switch from products with less than ½% of lead to Stainless Steel which has 15% Chromium. “Misdirection” at it’s finest.

Another case in point is government mandated or subsidized energy savings programs. Again government knows more about using this to create more government jobs than how to actually save energy. There is a lot of “misdirection” on this subject as well. We should all get out and vote for candidates who are for smaller government. If we could just turn out the lights at these unnecessary government agencies, it would save more energy that all the government programs put together.

Kudo's to Valveman and Mr. Slusser. The whole base of capitolism is selling folks things that they don't need. If the government gets involved in this you can all kiss the home shoppers network and infomercials goodby. As long as the product is not harmful or overtly dangerous then Caviet Emptor should rule the day.

Vote early, vote often, vote Republican

Sorry, I don't agree that capitalism is based on selling products that are not needed.

Also, most products are not sold on TV or advertised in infomercials; they are looked for and purchased in stores etc. where someone has taken a financial risk in stocking and offering the product to people that need and/or want the product. Or they sell online and have their suppliers ship the product to the customer.