Kinetico 60: Repair, Rebuild, or Replace?
- Thread starter Frugal-Mike
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Frugal-Mike
New Member
The old filter currently has a activated charcoal filter in it, but I don't think it adds any value. I was thinking about leaving it empty like you described in a previous post. I would have thought that it would be better to have the softener remove the iron before it gets to that filter.
Yep. I had thought to save a few bucks but had changed my mind and just hadn't switched them back to ball valves in the diagram.
I haven't seen them at big box stores or the local hardware store though I can get them online.
Sorry, I should have labeled that. The top is the line coming in from the pump. The bottom of that line is the pressure tank.
That bumps up the price a bit. I may just skip them since the Rusco has a clear housing to see when it needs to be cleaned and the old filter will probably be empty.
Oops. I purchased a new 3/4 x 3/4 version of one of these with pulse output on Epay for $30 including shipping a while back. Should I expect to lose accuracy because of the larger size? Oh well, I suspect it will be better than nothing, which is what we've always had.
I installed a new shower valve last year using sweat fittings so I've had a little practice. I'll have a lot more practice by the time this is done.
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If you need to have a carbon block for some smell, then the larger housing and head would be better, better flow through the filter less psi drop and yes the carbon should be after the softener so all that the carbon has to deal with is smell..
Save now, pay later... you will thank yourself if you spend the few extra dollars now as there will not be the replacement of the gates later and when you close the ball valve it is Closed, no need of trying 2 or 3 times to get the gate closed..
as a extra if the need should come up that you need to turn the water off where ever, that ball valve is closed with in 1 second,,,, not the turn turn turn turn and turn some more to stop the water flow..
The long turn elbows are found at the Plumping shops or at some places on line, most DIY do not use them, not to say that you can't , they do take up a little more space, but do lower the psi drop..
It would be good to have one or two in that stream some place to help track what is going on, but the shower is a very good spot to learn the psi from a plugging filter as it goes from hitting the face to hitting the chest... time to change some thing. How old is the one on the pressure tank and how good is it?
So you are going to have a really big brass TEE? in front of the pressure tank? ceiling to floor and about 4' off the floor go to the treatment system? and a plug on the other side of the pressure tank TEE? that will work..
3/4 meter should work, for what you are looking at doing , should do it,,, normally when I am putting a meter in for turning on a chem pump I size down just a little on the meter.. making sure that the meter sees the water... one of the things that I learned from a man that does meters, pumps , chem feed for 35 years.. and that is all that he does.
Good to hear that you have already had a run at the cleaning and fluxing the copper,,, that will come in handy and what a challenge it is if there is water in the line that you are working on ...
Save now, pay later... you will thank yourself if you spend the few extra dollars now as there will not be the replacement of the gates later and when you close the ball valve it is Closed, no need of trying 2 or 3 times to get the gate closed..
as a extra if the need should come up that you need to turn the water off where ever, that ball valve is closed with in 1 second,,,, not the turn turn turn turn and turn some more to stop the water flow..
The long turn elbows are found at the Plumping shops or at some places on line, most DIY do not use them, not to say that you can't , they do take up a little more space, but do lower the psi drop..
It would be good to have one or two in that stream some place to help track what is going on, but the shower is a very good spot to learn the psi from a plugging filter as it goes from hitting the face to hitting the chest... time to change some thing. How old is the one on the pressure tank and how good is it?
So you are going to have a really big brass TEE? in front of the pressure tank? ceiling to floor and about 4' off the floor go to the treatment system? and a plug on the other side of the pressure tank TEE? that will work..
3/4 meter should work, for what you are looking at doing , should do it,,, normally when I am putting a meter in for turning on a chem pump I size down just a little on the meter.. making sure that the meter sees the water... one of the things that I learned from a man that does meters, pumps , chem feed for 35 years.. and that is all that he does.
Good to hear that you have already had a run at the cleaning and fluxing the copper,,, that will come in handy and what a challenge it is if there is water in the line that you are working on ...
Frugal-Mike
New Member
I think I'll leave it where it is then.
There are ball valves at both ends so turning off the water quickly is not an issue. The gate valves for the bypass have worked OK for many years, but I'll look them over carefully when I have everything apart and won't hesitate to replace them with ball valves if they don't look good on the inside.
According to this site, long radius 3/4 elbows are equivalent to 2.3 ft of straight pipe and regular radius are 4.4. For the 5 elbows in the main flow, the total difference adds up to equal to 10.5 ft of pipe. For this house, that's probably not significant.
The business with the gate valves and elbows is less about cost and more about wanting to reuse existing parts if they're in good shape. There's a good chance that I'll find that these parts are not usable or are too much work to desolder and clean up for reuse. If so, I'll go with new ball valves and long radius elbows.
The existing pressure tank gauge is probably 15 years old and seems to still work fine. It's not fluid filled and is marked "made in Taiwan". I've seen regular 60 psi gauges on Epay for 4.50 and fluid filled versions of the same gauges at the same seller for 12.50. Since they'll be easy to replace, I may just go with regular and buy a couple of extras or I may buy the fluid filled.
I'm not sure what the problem is. Water can't flow through the pressure tank. The tank has to be on a branch of the main line coming in so I think it has to be on a tee. I suspect that typically, the main line goes straight through the tee with the pressure tank on the branch. I could change it to do that but I would then need to add an elbow below the tee to turn the flow to the horizontal area required for the filters and softener. According to the numbers on the site linked to above, that would be slightly worse than having the main flow come out the branch of the tee like it does now.
If the problem is that the pressure tank is fighting the weight of the water in the lines above it, I really don't have the option to move all of this out of the basement to a higher level.
According to the specs for the meter, the accuracy of the 3/4x3/4 version starts to drop below 1/2 gpm. For the 5/8x3/4 version, it starts to drop below 1/4 gpm so the smaller meter is more accurate on lower flows. I'm not sure how often we use flows that low though.
What the diagram doesn't show is that the ball valves on each end have compression fittings rather than sweat so that the entire assembly can be installed and removed with wrenches. Other than desoldering a tee on the input line and soldering a coupler on the output line, everything can be done on a workbench. I will be careful to make sure the lines are empty and as dry as possible when using the torch.
My my,, the list today..
The main reason that I talk about replacing them, when there is sand or lots of iron in the water those two items have habit of laying down in the slot that the gate goes into to stop the water, thus making one close, open, close, open, close til the water finally stops.
Re-using parts when one can is a good idea, but keep in mind that if part of a pipe or fitting gets way to hot, it might not hold right when you get it back together. The long elbows are more for larger places when every psi counts, not that it does not count in a house like yours it does, but not to the same level as a Bed and Breakfast or lodge...
If there is only the single line acting as supply and return off the pressure tank there is nothing wrong with that, seen that a lot... I just call that the really big Tee....
Pressure gauges around here have a short life, but the water is the killer, if yours is that old and still working great,,, then stay with what is working.
Low flow... if there is an ice maker or cold water dispenser on the Referig... or an RO under the sink, then no biggie.. the meter will do what you are looking for it to do.. often times today I am working with people that have some things that only use about .25-.50gpm so I have to take that into account when doing the equipment..
I was putting things on the table to be thought of, It is the way I like to work, making sure that different ideas are out there. Some ideas go some place, others go no where and others change into other ideas..
The Universe is my box.... not just the planet..
The main reason that I talk about replacing them, when there is sand or lots of iron in the water those two items have habit of laying down in the slot that the gate goes into to stop the water, thus making one close, open, close, open, close til the water finally stops.
Re-using parts when one can is a good idea, but keep in mind that if part of a pipe or fitting gets way to hot, it might not hold right when you get it back together. The long elbows are more for larger places when every psi counts, not that it does not count in a house like yours it does, but not to the same level as a Bed and Breakfast or lodge...
If there is only the single line acting as supply and return off the pressure tank there is nothing wrong with that, seen that a lot... I just call that the really big Tee....
Pressure gauges around here have a short life, but the water is the killer, if yours is that old and still working great,,, then stay with what is working.
Low flow... if there is an ice maker or cold water dispenser on the Referig... or an RO under the sink, then no biggie.. the meter will do what you are looking for it to do.. often times today I am working with people that have some things that only use about .25-.50gpm so I have to take that into account when doing the equipment..
I was putting things on the table to be thought of, It is the way I like to work, making sure that different ideas are out there. Some ideas go some place, others go no where and others change into other ideas..
The Universe is my box.... not just the planet..
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