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Thread: Kilz2 Primer

  1. #1
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    Default Kilz2 Primer

    Damn I love this stuff. Im painting this space all bright white and I was even considering leaving the primer as is.
    The resident paint expert at HD told me not to. Which of course makes me want to do it anyway. Any thoughts on primer as your finished color?

    Or is it just to absorbant and it's just asking for trouble?

  2. #2

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    When I moved into my current house I repainted the entire thing(ceilings, walls, and trim). I primed and did two tops coats. Took forever, well not really forever, but painting is so boring. anyway you can imagine since the trim was the last to get top coat I thought about leaving it just primed. It looks a thousand times better with paint on it. Also the kilz has a kind of rough finish to it where paint ends up being more smooth. I would paint it myself. If you want really bright white,I used Behr ultra bright white for my trim and it is really white, will definitely brighten the space up. I also found that after time color starts to bleed through the primer, but disappear when top coated. Just my thoughts.
    Last edited by doughboy63; 08-03-2006 at 07:08 AM.

  3. #3
    Engineer chassis's Avatar
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    I've used Kilz primer to paint unfinished basement walls, left it as is. It is a rough looking finish though. If it was going to be a finished space, I would put a color coat on top.

  4. #4
    Plumber jimbo's Avatar
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    There is nothing wrong per se with Kilz ..or any primer...being left as the finish coat. Now, will it perform like you want? first it is flat...very flat. If that's what you want, then OK. second, though, it does not have the "scrubbable" properties of a good flat finish latex. third, it will probably not cover any better in one coat than anything else, so 2 coats would be necessary. Unless the surface is so bad that it needs 2 coats of primer, why not do one primer coat and 1 finish coat?

  5. #5
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo
    There is nothing wrong per se with Kilz ..or any primer...being left as the finish coat. Now, will it perform like you want? first it is flat...very flat. If that's what you want, then OK. second, though, it does not have the "scrubbable" properties of a good flat finish latex. third, it will probably not cover any better in one coat than anything else, so 2 coats would be necessary. Unless the surface is so bad that it needs 2 coats of primer, why not do one primer coat and 1 finish coat?
    Right. And I've decided that makes the best sense. Currently searching for the whitest high quality white available. Everyone seems to think they know the "whitest white". I want a major label brand because I'll eventually do the whole house interior with it.
    Maybe it's our dry intense heat out here--but these walls are drinking up this primer like a sponge. Should have bought economy size.

    Kilz Premium primer is better than Kilz2 for bathrooms I'm told as it has anti-mildew properties FWIW.

    Going all white is especially great for the average DIY doing prep and touch up work.
    It hides all the the wall imperfections.
    Especially if you have delusions of magnificence reagarding your sanding and putty knife skills--then discovering the next morning you're a hack.
    Last edited by Mike50; 08-03-2006 at 12:41 PM.

  6. #6

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    Seriously, check out Behr ultra bright white. I had to repaint the bathroom with a duller/less bright white because it made my "white" tile look quite gray.

  7. #7
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by doughboy63
    Seriously, check out Behr ultra bright white. I had to repaint the bathroom with a duller/less bright white because it made my "white" tile look quite gray.
    I will.

    Look-heres the deal. 95% of the time you ask for "white" you won't get it. It's not popular.
    Most shades of white contain other colors in small quantities.
    Then they come up with dumb ass names for it like Ivory or Sawyer or Pearl etc. which all have a hazy yellow hue.


    I did read on another board that Benjamin More had highest % of titanium dioxide which is the premium ingredient in quality paint. I'm looking into it.
    Last edited by Mike50; 08-03-2006 at 05:53 PM.

  8. #8

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    More important than the color in hiding imperfections is the sheen. The shinier, the easier to clean. But, the flatter, the better it hides. My advice: unless you have kids, go with a flat.

    Benjamin Moore makes a Matte finish that's slightly more 'scrubbable' than reg flat. I thought people who prefered BenjMoore to Behr or American Tradition were snobs who don't read Consumer Reports (which gave AT and B the highest value ratings). But in my experience, BenjMoore looks and applies the best.

    I also suggest you go with "White" no matter what brand you pick. Every mfg will make a simple "White" which will match every other simple "White" on the market. "Decorators White" or "Ultra White" are not standard.
    (important note: I'm not a pro)

  9. #9
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    As stated earlier I want an ultra white. Why are you suggesting basic "white"?
    There may be a snob factor with Benjamin Moore.
    I've read it doesnt leave any brush strokes and so on.
    I may just try it out.
    Never used Behr-but AT is a very high quality thick usually one coat paint.

    AT is what I would use to paint entire house. BM is expensive paint.

    I'm looking for highest amount of titanium dioxide to decide if higher price is warrated in the case of BM. So far I cannot find a comparision table on the web, but Im looking.
    Paint formulas are very proprietary. Im not sure that highest amount of TD
    equates to the superior paint but it just might.

    TD is what makes white..."white". To which various dyes and tints are added.
    Kilz2 primer is about as flat as you will see anywhere--thats why I like it.
    For scrubbability I will use a satin or semi-gloss.

    Paint basics
    Paint is primarily a mixture of pigment, resin and a carrier. Titanium dioxide is the main, white pigment; relatively small amounts of other pigments are added by the dealer to tint the color. Resin makes paint adhere to a surface. Carrier is the evaporative liquid added to thin the mixture so you can brush or roll it on--water for latex paints or a solvent such as linseed or soybean oil for oil/alkyd paints. Paint also contains clay or other inert ingredients to adjust the paint's sheen. And it may contain small amounts of secondary solvents that help gloss, drying characteristics and the like.

    The amount and quality of each ingredient determine a paint's performance and price. For example, paint with plenty of titanium dioxide has strong hiding characteristics and, because this is the most expensive ingredient, costs more. Oil/alkyd paints that utilize odorless mineral spirits as a carrier are more expensive than those with regular solvents. With this in mind, price is a good indicator of quality.


    credit: Housetips.com
    Last edited by Mike50; 08-04-2006 at 07:10 AM.

  10. #10
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    I used to be a Benjamin Moore snob. After reading a couple years' CU reports on Behr and getting tired of driving 30 miles or more to a BM store, getting there when they deigned to be open, and paying the high prices, I tried some Behr eggshell latex on the walls and loved it. Tried their High Gloss latex enamel and it covered much better, and left fewer brush strokes than BM. I've had all my old BM stuff color-matched at HD and am a convert.

    TIP: wait until a national holiday to buy your Behr paint. They typically have super sales on Washington's birthday, 4th of July, and maybe others. Often not aggressively advertised.

  11. #11
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey
    I used to be a Benjamin Moore snob. After reading a couple years' CU reports on Behr and getting tired of driving 30 miles or more to a BM store, getting there when they deigned to be open, and paying the high prices, I tried some Behr eggshell latex on the walls and loved it. Tried their High Gloss latex enamel and it covered much better, and left fewer brush strokes than BM. I've had all my old BM stuff color-matched at HD and am a convert.

    TIP: wait until a national holiday to buy your Behr paint. They typically have super sales on Washington's birthday, 4th of July, and maybe others. Often not aggressively advertised.
    Thats really helpful Mikey. I'm going to look for those reports and decide next week. I will try not to buy into the BM hype out there. I need a rest after all that priming. lol
    Painting is truly and literally a PITA.

  12. #12

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    I used to NOT be a BM snob. I am now. I notice the dif in application and finish. Can't explain it; just brushes better and more even (for me). Use your Behr if it works for you. I read the CR reviews of Behr and AT also. But my experience with all 3 tells me different.

    Use Ultrawhite if you think you're going to notice the subtle difs between titanium diox doses in yr paints. I used ultrawhite in one of my rooms, and I don't notice the diff unless I paint reg white right next to it. Unless it's near another shade of white, all whites look like white (to me).

    White requires frequent touching up in my experience. Having the generic white gives you flexibility to select whatever brand of touchup you feel like at the time.
    Last edited by prashster; 08-04-2006 at 12:28 PM.
    (important note: I'm not a pro)

  13. #13
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    Apparently the the Benjamin Moore Eco Spec is considered "super-compliant" with low or no VOC. Low VOC=better paint all the way around. Coverage, Cleanup etc. and not having to breathe in the VOC makes it worth the extra 5 bucks or whatever.
    Eco spec doesn't come in a superwhite BTW.

    There is no generic white prashter. I have no idea what you are referring to.
    Crissake...AT makes around 30 white shades and thats just one company.

    Top 8:

    http://interiordec.about.com/cs/pain..._paintmfgs.htm
    Last edited by Mike50; 08-04-2006 at 05:39 PM.

  14. #14

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    Most manufacturers will sell a color called, simply, "White". Anything else, ("Navajo White" Or "Alabaster" or "Ultrawhite" or "Like White on Rice") is not pure white. "White" by any mfg will be the Pantone standard white. So, perhaps I should have said "standard" not "generic".
    (important note: I'm not a pro)

  15. #15
    DIY Senior Member Mike50's Avatar
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    So Pantone has defined what white is/should look like and the entire industry follows their standard-is that what you are saying prashter?

    Color formulas are proprietary including whites and blacks.
    Popular whites today contain small amounts of reds or yellows primarily.
    Most people have trouble seeing it. I do. I'm a graphic artist and look at this stuff all day. It's so subtle it's difficult at times.

    Pantone doesn't own the color spectrum. Some may use it for precise color matching. I don't see any other value truthfully.

    In the printing/graphics world up until fairly recently your choice of colors numbered in the hundreds. Ink Jets changed all that. Now it's millions.

    We've had discussions here about the difficulty in mixing bathroom suites whites (toilet/sink/bath) from different manufacturers. Some match OK-some don't.
    Luckily most people could care less.
    Last edited by Mike50; 08-05-2006 at 05:05 AM.

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