Want to add shutoff valve

The pipe that goes to my outside faucet for the garden hose doesn't have a shutoff valve. I traced it in the basement back to the pipes that feed the kitchen sink. I had heard you can get a cover for the faucet to keep it from freezing in the winter. I asked about it at the local hardware store and the guy recommended I install a shutoff valve myself. He showed me a quarter-turn compression valve and said all I'd need is a hacksaw to cut the pipe, with no soldering needed.

So, a few questions from a plumbing novice:
1. Is it as easy as he makes it out to be? Are there any gotchas installing these? Will it work if my cuts aren't perfectly perpendicular to the pipe?
2. Is there a requirement for placement of the valve? (i.e., needs to be within X feet of the outside wall, or X feet away from the outside wall, etc.) I'm in Massachusetts.
3. Any recommendations on brand or type of compression valve?
4. It's copper pipe and says 1/2 on it, although holding a ruler up next to it it looks like it's 5/8". Does that mean the inside diameter is 1/2"? Just curious on this one.

Thanks for any advice/info.

-cb

Pipe is measured by the inside diameter, so 5/8" is right. Tubing is measured by the outside diameter, go figure .

I MA, I don't think you are supposed to do any plumbing on your own! But, given that, it is pretty easy IF there is a little slop in the piping to do what you want. See, unless you can move the pipe a little, you won't be able to insert the shutoff, since part of the pipe goes inside of it. Suggest that you get a tubing cutter instead of a hacksaw. You'll get a nice clean cut, and not have copper chips all over the place potentially contaminating the seals of the faucets! You'll probably have to cut out maybe an inch of pipe, so you really need to make two cuts. Also, if you do use a tubing cutter, use the pointed reamer that's usually recessed on one end to flatten the inside of the pipe back out to the normal diameter.

Yes, it really is easy. You'll need the means to cut a section of pipe out and a couple of wrenches (and enough room under the sink!). Cut the section out, slide a nut one each end, then the crimp ring, then insert the shutoff. Using one wrench to hold the shutoff, and another, tighten the nut on each end. Double check this (instructions usually on the box), usually it is finger tight, then 1.5-2 more turns. Do this on each end, and your done (well, turn the water back on - you did turn it off first ).

As an alternative, they make something called a frost-free sillcock that also could be used. This looks like a normal faucet on the outside, but the actual guts of the faucet are on the inside of the house. When you shut it off, the water that is in the faucet from the actual valve portion runs out the end, so the shutoff is really inside and there is no water in the pipe through the wall or in the part outside.

tubing

plumbing tubing is measured on the inside just like pipe. Air conditioning installers measure their tubing by the outside diameter.

jadnashua said:

In MA, I don't think you are supposed to do any plumbing on your own! But, given that, it is pretty easy IF there is a little slop in the piping to do what you want. See, unless you can move the pipe a little, you won't be able to insert the shutoff, since part of the pipe goes inside of it. Suggest that you get a tubing cutter instead of a hacksaw. You'll get a nice clean cut, and not have copper chips all over the place potentially contaminating the seals of the faucets! You'll probably have to cut out maybe an inch of pipe, so you really need to make two cuts. Also, if you do use a tubing cutter, use the pointed reamer that's usually recessed on one end to flatten the inside of the pipe back out to the normal diameter.

Click to expand...

I've heard mixed things about your first statement. Some people agree with it, and others say it's ok as long as you have it inspected after. One person who claimed the latter went on to say that regardless of who does it, you're supposed to pull a permit for any plumbing work.

In this case there's a little bit of play in the pipe. I'm doing this in the basement somewhere along a roughly 12 foot run between where it branches to go up to the sink and where it goes out the wall to the faucet. The best spot, space-wise, seems to be about 4 feet from the outside wall, and I'll put it there unless I hear there's a minimum or maximum distance I need to worry about.

Good idea on the tubing cutter; I'll look into that. I did realize I'd have to cut out an inch or two. I figured I'd start by cutting a gap on the small side because it's much easier to make a small gap bigger than to make a big one smaller.

Yes, it really is easy. You'll need the means to cut a section of pipe out and a couple of wrenches (and enough room under the sink!). Cut the section out, slide a nut one each end, then the crimp ring, then insert the shutoff. Using one wrench to hold the shutoff, and another, tighten the nut on each end. Double check this (instructions usually on the box), usually it is finger tight, then 1.5-2 more turns. Do this on each end, and your done (well, turn the water back on - you did turn it off first ).

Click to expand...

That's exactly how I figured it should go. Thanks.

As an alternative, they make something called a frost-free sillcock that also could be used. This looks like a normal faucet on the outside, but the actual guts of the faucet are on the inside of the house. When you shut it off, the water that is in the faucet from the actual valve portion runs out the end, so the shutoff is really inside and there is no water in the pipe through the wall or in the part outside.

Click to expand...

Interesting, I never heard of that. I just looked at a few on the web and unfortunately I don't think I can fit one in. The basement is finished and from the outside faucet the pipe comes in through the exterior wall, turns immediately up and then turns again to go over a drop ceiling and across the basement. I've pulled down several ceiling tiles to look for a shutoff (obviously not finding one) and I have enough room to add one above one of the tiles.

Thanks for the info.

-cb

Follow-up question

Ok, so I've got the valve and a friend has a spare tube cutter he's going to give me. I think I'm all set. Here's the thing: suppose I screw this up and cut out too much pipe or something like that. If that happens, is there a way for me to cap the pipe without soldering so we can have running water without having to wait for a plumber?

Just trying to have a backup plan.

-cb

You could attach the shutoff to the wet side, and make sure the valve is off.

You can get a good idea of how much to cut off by simple measuring the valve. There is a lip inside that you are supposed to push the pipe up to, so the amount you cut off will be less than the length of the shutoff; that is why you need some slack, the shutoff is longer than the piece you cut out. There's enough leway to have it a little too big an opening, but it really should be pretty close.