Plumbing a cistern

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grover

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I started a thread last Fall and got some good advice on how to plumb and wire my new cistern. Well it's spring and I'm getting ready to do it.

Here's the thread https://terrylove.com/forums/showth...plumb-and-wire-Can-you-help&highlight=cistern

As I said in the thread the 2nd drawing by valveman with the submersible pump is how I think I'm going to go the only difference is I don't have a well. The cistern water will have to be hauled in or collected from the roof. I don't know if the rainwater collecting will complicate things as far as purification, filters, etc.

First of all the cistern sits about 25 ft from the cabin and the cabin is kind of small with approx 700 sq ft so it only has 1 bath with a shower and a sink. The lift from the bottom of the cistern to my fixtures will be approx 15 feet. The water fixtures will be shower, bath sink, kitchen sink, clothes washer, an outside spigot, and I'm thinking about an outside shower also. The water demand will probably not be too high so I figure a 1/2 hp 10 GPM Flint & Walling pump will supply plenty of water. It is a part time residence for now so it will set unused for weeks at a time.

Questions
1-Which F & W pump, 115 or 230 volt? I've got my eye on the 4" stainless Commander series (4F10S05). Is that a good choice and what price should I have to pay?
2-Should I lay it on it's side as in a picture I've seen on this site (again by valveman)? Will that shorten the pumps life significantly?
3-What kind of pipe should I use in the cistern, to the house, in the house? PVC, CPVC, galvanized, or other?
4-The cistern has a fitting on the side and I think it is a 1 inch fitting. Should I just come from the house to this fitting, do a 90 down, another 90 at the bottom of the cistern with the pump?
5-I do plan on some sort of pump shroud...not sure if it will be homemade from a piece of pipe or a purchased "kit". Suggestions?
6-How far off the bottom should the pump be. Valveman's picture I mentioned shows the pump zip tied to 2 sections of 4 inch pipe. I assume that will be high enough?
7-No pump house planned so should the pressure tank go in the house or will the crawl space be a bad option? I'm thinking about the using the cycle stop valve so that should save some space.
8-Do I need foot valves, check valves, etc?
9-Where do the electrical wires enter the cistern?

I guess that's enough questions for now but fair warning...there may be more. All ideas welcomed.
 
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Valveman

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1-Which F & W pump, 115 or 230 volt? I've got my eye on the 4" stainless Commander series (4F10S05). Is that a good choice and what price should I have to pay?
I always prefer 230V, and FW is a good pump. 1/2 HP 10’s should be about $300.

2-Should I lay it on it's side as in a picture I've seen on this site (again by valveman)? Will that shorten the pumps life significantly?
Laying on its side will let you utilize the bottom portion of the tank, and it doesn’t hurt the pump.

3-What kind of pipe should I use in the cistern, to the house, in the house? PVC, CPVC, galvanized, or other?
Sch 40 PVC or 160# poly. I would not use CPVC or galv.

4-The cistern has a fitting on the side and I think it is a 1 inch fitting. Should I just come from the house to this fitting, do a 90 down, another 90 at the bottom of the cistern with the pump?
I would cut a notch in the big screw on lid for the pipe and wire coming from the submersible. With an attached union, you can easily pull it out if needed.

5-I do plan on some sort of pump shroud...not sure if it will be homemade from a piece of pipe or a purchased "kit". Suggestions?
I have always just made my own by cutting pie shaped wedges, clamping, and sealing it with electric tape. But a 4X1 well seal works well also.

6-How far off the bottom should the pump be. Valveman's picture I mentioned shows the pump zip tied to 2 sections of 4 inch pipe. I assume that will be high enough?
4” or so off the bottom should be fine.

7-No pump house planned so should the pressure tank go in the house or will the crawl space be a bad option? I'm thinking about the using the cycle stop valve so that should save some space.
The little Pside-Kick kit is so small you can put it anywhere. It will work fine in the crawl space or just where the pipe enters the house.

8-Do I need foot valves, check valves, etc?
The check valve on the submersible is the only check you need.

9-Where do the electrical wires enter the cistern?
Through the same notch in the lid as the 1” pipe.
 

grover

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Thanks, that all sounds pretty good except for the part about where the pipe and wire enters the cistern. I think it would be great to be able to unscrew a union and pull the pump out if/when it needs replacing but what about the line freezing where exposed? The top of the cistern is about even with the ground level.

Another question about the pump and the cooling shroud. Is the bottom half of the pump the part that needs the cooling? The reason I ask is all the pics I've seen of the homemade shrouds have the top part of the shroud sealed with tape or other. This would mean the water only comes in the bottom of the shroud and cools the bottom half of the pump.
Another question, what protects the pump from running if the cistern goes dry? I don't want to burn it up.
 

Valveman

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Anyway you get the pipe and wire through the cistern is fine. You can bring the wire above ground, as it won’t freeze. Then you could use a tank adapter to bring the pipe through the tank wall anywhere you want. I am just not sure you can screw into both sides of a tank adapter, but probably can.

And yes the motor is on the bottom and that is what needs the cooling.

You can do a low tank level with a float switch, but my favorite way is to use a Cycle Sensor
 
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