Volts leaking to ground rod

Users who are viewing this thread

Houptee

Member
Messages
286
Reaction score
9
Points
18
Location
Monmouth County, NJ
Homeownerinburb:
Did you check all the outlets/receptacles in the house with one of those LED plug in testers to see if any show the hot and neutral are reversed, and if grounded?

I used to be a technician for a packaging machinery company and one customer kept calling us that his machine was acting erratic.
Another tech had replaced the control box twice under warranty and it was still erratic. The customer was pissed and wanted his $14k refunded for the machine.

I went out there and noticed they had it plugged into a heavy gauge extension cord that had a replacement female end which tested bad with my plug in tester, they reversed the hot and neutral on the cord. The wall outlet tested good.

So it could be something simple that will not require vector math and o-scopes.
 

DonL

Jack of all trades Master of one
Messages
5,205
Reaction score
72
Points
48
Location
Houston, TX
Quote Originally Posted by DonL "How much current is on the Neutral wire that feeds the breaker panel when you turn the breakers off ?"

Well, that would vary depending on the draw in the house and which legs are being pulled harder, eh?


Why would it depend on the draw in the house if the main breaker is turned off ?
 

Reach4

Well-Known Member
Messages
38,798
Reaction score
4,412
Points
113
Location
IL
My scope has four channels. Connect the ground to a circuit board and the channels to four different places on the board and I can see four different signals
Yes! Voltage is always measures with respect to somewhere. That may be an implied reference point (typically ground) or a stated reference point.
but I suppose although that board is supplied by 24 volts that it must somehow get everything twisted around so there is four different phases in that board. But then again it could be that I am just comparing four different meters so to speak at the same time.
If that was 24 VAC, and you have resistors, capacitors, and inductors, there can indeed be different phases at 4 points, even if you were to use the same reference for each. Also, if we measure V[sub]A[/sub] with respect to V[sub]B[/sub], we will get a voltage that has a phase 180 degrees different from V[sub]B[/sub] with respect to V[sub]A[/sub].
 

BobL43

DIY Senior Member
Messages
1,802
Reaction score
8
Points
38
Location
Long Island, NY
Quote Originally Posted by DonL "How much current is on the Neutral wire that feeds the breaker panel when you turn the breakers off ?"




Why would it depend on the draw in the house if the main breaker is turned off ?
EGGsellent question Don
 

BobL43

DIY Senior Member
Messages
1,802
Reaction score
8
Points
38
Location
Long Island, NY
Yes! Voltage is always measures with respect to somewhere. That may be an implied reference point (typically ground) or a stated reference point. If that was 24 VAC, and you have resistors, capacitors, and inductors, there can indeed be different phases at 4 points, even if you were to use the same reference for each. Also, if we measure V[SUB]A[/SUB] with respect to V[SUB]B[/SUB], we will get a voltage that has a phase 180 degrees different from V[SUB]B[/SUB] with respect to V[SUB]A[/SUB].
Being that this is a plumbing website, the Toto is used as the Sink signal for the scope?
 

BobL43

DIY Senior Member
Messages
1,802
Reaction score
8
Points
38
Location
Long Island, NY
Homeownerinburb:
Did you check all the outlets/receptacles in the house with one of those LED plug in testers to see if any show the hot and neutral are reversed, and if grounded?

I used to be a technician for a packaging machinery company and one customer kept calling us that his machine was acting erratic.
Another tech had replaced the control box twice under warranty and it was still erratic. The customer was pissed and wanted his $14k refunded for the machine.

I went out there and noticed they had it plugged into a heavy gauge extension cord that had a replacement female end which tested bad with my plug in tester, they reversed the hot and neutral on the cord. The wall outlet tested good.

So it could be something simple that will not require vector math and o-scopes.
Many moons ago, I myself was on a service call on a printing press that had problems with the diameter calculator on the rewinder. Analyzing the problem required the use of a laptop PC to look into the calculator and view, make changes etc., to certain values, conditions and gear ratios, etc. The press I was working on did not have a 115 volt conveinience outlet for me to plug my (own, personal) laptop into, so I plugged it into the outlet on the adjacent press. This customer had six 3 million dollar presses in a row. My laptop's Com Port was fried by a potential difference and some sort of ground current. My company did not have company laptops, and did not want to reimburse me for the repair. Ground currents can be expensive to life and limb. No vector math was needed to figure out what happened.:mad:
 

DonL

Jack of all trades Master of one
Messages
5,205
Reaction score
72
Points
48
Location
Houston, TX
Many moons ago, I myself was on a service call on a printing press that had problems with the diameter calculator on the rewinder. Analyzing the problem required the use of a laptop PC to look into the calculator and view, make changes etc., to certain values, conditions and gear ratios, etc. The press I was working on did not have a 115 volt conveinience outlet for me to plug my (own, personal) laptop into, so I plugged it into the outlet on the adjacent press. This customer had six 3 million dollar presses in a row. My laptop's Com Port was fried by a potential difference and some sort of ground current. My company did not have company laptops, and did not want to reimburse me for the repair. Ground currents can be expensive to life and limb. No vector math was needed to figure out what happened.:mad:


lol

That is funny Bob, but again it is not.

I have a isolation transformer for when I want to connect my scopes or any test gear ground lead, to anything that is not DC grounded.

Once a person blows the ground lead off of their scope or test PC they remember for a long time about the importance of true isolation.


Live and learn. I am to old too learn, so I just live.
 

Bluebinky

Member
Messages
588
Reaction score
16
Points
18
Location
Des Moines, WA
Well I must sit back and think about that for a minute. I must say it took me off guard for a second. I thank you for the comment although I think it is stretched just a little.
I think you are certainly one of the top contributors to one of the top forums of its kind.

I do wish you would be willing to learn some standardized terminology for just a few things... I'm giving up.
 
Top
Hey, wait a minute.

This is awkward, but...

It looks like you're using an ad blocker. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads.

If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. We might be able to do something about it. Thanks.
I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks