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Thread: Why does drywall work in a Kerdi Shower?

  1. #91
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default Spot setting is for hacks - so is drywall in the shower

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    Last edited by johnfrwhipple; 03-15-2014 at 02:52 PM.


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  2. #92
    builder:anti-builder dhagin's Avatar
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    Since no one around here has ever seen or heard of a Kerdi Shower failure, a thread was started over at John Bridges site. All this talk of drywall failure as an academic exercise is all well and good, of course, but unless there are actual failures it's a solution lookin for a problem [that simply doesn't exist].

    Here's a link to the thread at John's site.

    http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/...d.php?t=111300
    dana
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    Note: please don't feed or quote trolls. thank you. :-)

  3. #93
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default Failing Kerdi Shower with Drywall and Spot Set Tile

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    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  4. #94
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    For those that aren't keeping up, the Kerdiboard failure was in a steam shower, likely where a steam line was too close to the board. The manual calls for a max temp around Kerdiboard of about 170-degrees (I'd have to look up the exact number, but that's close). Steam, boiling water, happens at 212-degrees at sea level. And, steam could be hotter than that once it is a gas, there's no practical limit on the temp it can raise. As far as I know, no final outcome on that situation.

    There's no evidence of an actual failure in the stone like shower shown, either. If that area is where the spray hits the wall, a natural stone can become saturated. There's no evidence that there is any leaks to the outside or structural failure.

    A foam Kerdi shower pan, if you read the instructions, says prior to installation, the floor must be level. Because you stand on the thing to embed it into the thinset, it is essentially impossible to try to level it with thinset and get a good bond to the substrate. Trying to level the pan afterwards is a very difficult thing to do, and the time involved and the reliability of the fix afterwards is beyond the scope of most DIY'ers, thus the recommendation to tear it out and start over.

    With the unprotected drywall, no question, that's just dumb. The difference is day and night. Done right, a Kerdi shower doesn't leak. Mold takes three things, eliminate any one, and it does not occur: moisture, food, mold spores. Kerdi, done right, eliminates moisture from anything behind it, and since it isn't food, nor is mortar or tile, mold will only happen if things aren't kept clean, and then on the surface...that can happen on ANY shower, regardless of how it is built.
    Last edited by jadnashua; 02-04-2014 at 01:04 PM.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  5. #95
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default Dry Wall and Kerdi Board - both bad choices for a shower

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    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  6. #96
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default Drywall gets the thumbs down from TileLetter.com

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    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  7. #97
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default John Bridge on why to use drywall in your shower build.

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    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  8. #98
    builder:anti-builder dhagin's Avatar
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    Lots of views over on JB's site, not a lot of talk about any failures....
    dana
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    in my youth, i knew it all and treated folks like they knew nothing. after 3+ decades in the construction business, i came to realize that the more i learn, the less i know. now i treat folks as i want to be treated - with respect, no matter how little i know. :-)

    Note: please don't feed or quote trolls. thank you. :-)

  9. #99
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    More pictures of tile directly on drywall...anyone that knows anything expects them to do nasty things if moisture is involved, but again, once covered with Kerdi, a waterproof material, it's no different than the drywall on your ceiling under your roof, or that on your walls next to the windows or doors. When installed properly as a system, the drywall never gets wet. http://www.schluter.com/media/shower...v=201401311539 I didn't make the recommendation up...Schluter did, and feels strongly enough about it to have had it tested and certified as waterproof by a well-respected testing agency, and backs it up with a decent warranty AND HAS BEEN DOING IT THIS WAY IN THE USA FOR DECADES. In the process, they also built waterproof showers with cbu and a few other materials, all called out in the referenced link, should you not trust yourself. But, if you didn't trust yourself to do it right, or don't want to read and understand their instructions, you may want to use a different material. A conventionally built shower can perform well, but loses the advantage of limiting any moisture to right under the tile like in a Kerdi shower. Lots more conventional showers can be found that have leaked if you look around than Kerdi ones, simply because it is not all that hard to build one that does not leak.

    Schluter is the only company with the long track record of successful showers done per their instructions (over 20-years), and believes enough in their product to safely make use of the less expensive, more easily installed material. The do not tell you you MUST use drywall, but that you can, and have a successful installation. Why spend money on extras when the success rate is identical, it goes up faster, and the end result comes out the same...a waterproof shower. I've said more than once, you do not have to use drywall in your shower when using Kerdi, but that you safely can if you are anywhere near a bit handy and can read and understand the pretty simple instructions and general guidelines on its use.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  10. #100
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default Drywall and a Failing Kerdi Shower

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    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  11. #101
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    A failing shower is one that leaks...there is no evidence that it is leaking. If that area is where the majority of the spray hits, it may just be that that tile is saturated, which is no reliable indication that there is a leak anywhere. Not all tile is equal, especially with natural stone.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  12. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    A failing shower is one that leaks...there is no evidence that it is leaking. If that area is where the majority of the spray hits, it may just be that that tile is saturated, which is no reliable indication that there is a leak anywhere. Not all tile is equal, especially with natural stone.
    Not all waterproofing membranes are created equal , especially a sheet membrane -- Kerdi -- . Different rates of absorption and combine with the unmod mortar -- another thirsty one when dry -- , the drying time is ....like natural stone . Add a sealer on top of it , water will just accumulate .

    If leaks are the only thing that matter in a properly build shower , then I think the mirror is needed...........
    Roberto

  13. #103
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    The Kerdi is waterproof. If that tile is hit by the concentrated shower spray on a regular basis, the tile itself could become saturated. If this were say a conventional shower with cbu behind it, it would wick water more, and a larger area would be wet. Some stone absorbs a fair amount of water, and it can take it weeks to dry out. The choice of the tile may be suspect, but it has nothing to do with whether the shower is defective from a functional viewpoint. All the membrane does is prevent moisture from getting behind it...what you put on top of it can get wet. With a dense porcelain, the tile would not change color. If the showerhead were moved a bit, that one may not get wet. It does not indicate a leak in the shower with the information provided.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  14. #104
    ACO Shower Drain Sales johnfrwhipple's Avatar
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    Default I wonder if this is why spot setting tile is not allowed.

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    Last edited by johnfrwhipple; 03-15-2014 at 02:53 PM.


    jfrwhipple@gmail.com - www-no-curb.com - 604 506 6792

    Always get construction advice double checked by your local city hall. Flood Test Every Shower - Every Time.

  15. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    I ........

    Attachment 23440
    .
    Is sign drywall related?!LOL
    Roberto

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