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Thread: New house came with a Rainsoft Water Softener and....

  1. #46
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate81 View Post
    I feel that this water softening shit is just a huge hype...i mean I'm sure it REALLY does something, but i think 90% of people have hard water and don't even realize it or care....i'm getting dirt/grime coming out of my faucets, i need it to stop, its ruining our clothes and dirtying our skinks/showers/dishwasher. Other than that I dont care what we have in our water.
    It's not hype, but it can sure be complicated. You're probably right about the 90%, but once you've experienced properly treated and softened water, you REALLY notice the difference when you go somewhere where it isn't. The water coming out of our well is hard and stinks. I have a very basic treatment system (chlorination, carbon filtration, softening), and will put my water up against any bottled water out there for consumption, and really like that I get soapsuds when I shower, the dishes comeout of the dishwasher clean, and there's no stain in the toilets. Believe me, it's worth the small amount of trouble it takes to get to that point.

  2. #47
    DIY Senior Member Reach4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate81 View Post
    I feel that this water softening shit is just a huge hype...i mean I'm sure it REALLY does something, but i think 90% of people have hard water and don't even realize it or care....i'm getting dirt/grime coming out of my faucets, i need it to stop, its ruining our clothes and dirtying our skinks/showers/dishwasher. Other than that I dont care what we have in our water.
    What color is it staining your sinks, shower, dishwasher and toilets? Are you getting smells?

    If it were me, I would ask for a discount, but I would want to get this system working. Think about the monthly water and sewer bills that you are not paying by not having city sewer and water, and spend your savings toward the maintenance.

    It sounds like your filter was effective until it wasn't.

  3. #48
    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    Its leaving brown stuff...if you fill a large clear container with our water...its got a very noticeable brown tinge. I seriously do not think its iron...its just dirt, we have a shallow bored well.

  4. #49
    DIY Senior Member Reach4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate81 View Post
    Its leaving brown stuff...if you fill a large clear container with our water...its got a very noticeable brown tinge. I seriously do not think its iron...its just dirt, we have a shallow bored well.
    I suggest you add a couple big blue 20 x 4 inch filters. The first would be a sediment filter (50 or 100 micron). The second would be a finer filter. One would help, but it is not much more to put in two while you are at it. Put that for the whole house (except outside spigots) before the softener, if you use one. Search around. Not expensive.

  5. #50
    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    My well and filtration system is all setup outdoors actually AT the well head...so if i were to install a paper filter like you said it would filter everything in my house including outside spigots...is there a reason to exclude them? Or just because its not really needed on a outdoor water hose?

    Also, how long do this paper filters last before needing replacement? We have ollllld 5+gallon flush toilets and a five year old lol...needless to say our toilets get flushed a lot

  6. #51
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate81 View Post
    We have ollllld 5+gallon flush toilets and a five year old lol...needless to say our toilets get flushed a lot
    I'd replace the toilets. If you're flushing those antiques 15 times a day, replacing them with even 1.6gpf models would save over 18,000 gallons of water per year, both in (from the well) and out (to the septic field, which I'm assuming). And you really don't need to treat water going to hose spigots, unless the water is REALLY bad.

  7. #52
    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    My well and filtration system is all setup outdoors actually AT the well head...so if i were to install a paper filter like you said it would filter everything in my house including outside spigots...is there a reason to exclude them? Or just because its not really needed on a outdoor water hose?

    Also, how long do this paper filters last before needing replacement? We have ollllld 5+gallon flush toilets and a five year old lol...needless to say our toilets get flushed a lot

  8. #53
    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    So the water guy just left.....i have very little iron, he found 12 for a water hardness, where mine showed around 8....and my ph was around 5 or so.

    He said i do not need the chemfeed system or retention tank anymore. He's going to replace the carbon bed with some sort of acid bed which will filter out the brown water and turn my water softener back on.

  9. #54
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nate81 View Post
    So the water guy just left.....i have very little iron, he found 12 for a water hardness, where mine showed around 8....and my ph was around 5 or so.

    He's going to replace the carbon bed with some sort of acid bed which will filter out the brown water and turn my water softener back on.
    You really need to get better information than that.

  10. #55
    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey View Post
    You really need to get better information than that.
    Like what? He explained exactly what my current setup does and why i no longer need it. He is coming back tomorrow at noon.

  11. #56
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    OK; enjoy.

  12. #57
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    He is suggesting a new acid neutralizer filter (for a pH of 5!, that will require a mixed bed filter) when you already have a system to treat the very acidic water....

    Unless you want to get rid of the one solution feeder I say he is a crook. The other solution feeder was for bacteria and bacteria comes and goes and he is not doing you any favor tearing that and the retention tank out. He'll probably end up selling it to someone else, so charge him a few hundred for it. That company's dealers and their sale people are famous for doing people this way. You should find an independent dealer.
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  13. #58
    DIY Senior Member lifespeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    He is suggesting a new acid neutralizer filter (for a pH of 5!, that will require a mixed bed filter) when you already have a system to treat the very acidic water....

    Unless you want to get rid of the one solution feeder I say he is a crook. The other solution feeder was for bacteria and bacteria comes and goes and he is not doing you any favor tearing that and the retention tank out. He'll probably end up selling it to someone else, so charge him a few hundred for it. That company's dealers and their sale people are famous for doing people this way. You should find an independent dealer.
    Nate: read what Gary wrote and think about it a minute. Why is there a chemical feeder followed by contact tank? Is this to neutralize your acid water? What about the other feeder? Is this for bacteria? Did "your guy" even test for E. Coli (pretty sure he could not have done so on the spot)? And Gary is right that bacteria comes and goes.

    I know you are frustrated with the situation, and don't yet understand the whole water treatment thing. The best thing you can do is get a handle on why you have what you have, how it works, and how to maintain it. Once working it won't be much trouble and your water will be clean, clear and SAFE. And you may not need much, if any, new equipment.

    A few people have attempted to help you here, some more experienced than others (I don't count myself among the experienced, BTW). Your, shall we say, frustration and lack of test data to examine have not helped you get good advice from those here who would help you. I suggest you think long and hard before tossing equipment and try and understand why it is there. Yes, there is a small possibility something is not needed, but you should be darn sure before removing something expensive that you may well need in the future.
    Lifespeed

  14. #59
    In the Trades Tom Sawyer's Avatar
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    I tend to side with slusser here too. Unfortunately there are a whole lot of crooks in the water treatment game and there always have been. It's because most folks don't understand water filtration and treatment and most aren't willing to find out about it so it's pretty easy to talk people into buying stuff they don't need.
    [B]No, plumbing ain't rocket science. Unlike rocket science, plumbing requires a license[B]

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    DIY Junior Member nate81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey View Post
    OK; enjoy.
    You are useless to me, thank for participating but you're free to go now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    He is suggesting a new acid neutralizer filter (for a pH of 5!, that will require a mixed bed filter) when you already have a system to treat the very acidic water....

    Unless you want to get rid of the one solution feeder I say he is a crook. The other solution feeder was for bacteria and bacteria comes and goes and he is not doing you any favor tearing that and the retention tank out. He'll probably end up selling it to someone else, so charge him a few hundred for it. That company's dealers and their sale people are famous for doing people this way. You should find an independent dealer.
    So I was told that the caustic soda and aluminum sulfate were injected into the water and left to sit in the retention tank long enough for the iron to fall out ...then the water was to pass through the carbon bed and removed the caustic soda/aluminum sulfate...and then the water passes through the softener...and then to my home. He said there is no longer a need to use the chemicals because I barely have any iron in the water. He suggested disconnecting the two injection tanks and the retention tank and setting them aside in case i need them in the future.

    He also suggested to remove the brown/yellow color in the water, which i'm assuming is just dirt/silt/mud because i DO in fact have a very shallow well, we replace the carbon bed with some other medium...i'm assuming citrate possibly, i did not ask at the time....but it would help neutralize the water AND remove the gunk. He would disconnect the above tanks and replace the carbon bed with the citrate? for $200. He mentioned that it needed to be done probably once a year after that.

    Quote Originally Posted by lifespeed View Post
    Nate: read what Gary wrote and think about it a minute. Why is there a chemical feeder followed by contact tank? Is this to neutralize your acid water? What about the other feeder? Is this for bacteria? Did "your guy" even test for E. Coli (pretty sure he could not have done so on the spot)? And Gary is right that bacteria comes and goes.

    I know you are frustrated with the situation, and don't yet understand the whole water treatment thing. The best thing you can do is get a handle on why you have what you have, how it works, and how to maintain it. Once working it won't be much trouble and your water will be clean, clear and SAFE. And you may not need much, if any, new equipment.

    A few people have attempted to help you here, some more experienced than others (I don't count myself among the experienced, BTW). Your, shall we say, frustration and lack of test data to examine have not helped you get good advice from those here who would help you. I suggest you think long and hard before tossing equipment and try and understand why it is there. Yes, there is a small possibility something is not needed, but you should be darn sure before removing something expensive that you may well need in the future.
    My initial question in this thread was...what are these tanks and what do they do...and how do i turn on a water softener. You have contributed several times to this thread but not once have I found a bit of useable information amidst your rambling. The only frustration i'm receiving is from getting replies to this thread that amount to nothing, like the one i'm replying against now. You have suggested I get a full comprehensive lab water test done several times and I've already mentioned its not allowable in my budget at this time, mainly why i'm even here. We have been surviving just fine on our bottled water for well over a year now and as far as breathing in vapors of bacteria and E.coli, well...thats just a chance we're taking right now isn't it? You could conduct a survey across the US of people with well water and I can bet you anything that not even a small percentage have their water tested annually...or even at all.

    I have gone as far as purchasing several test kits and showed, at several peoples request, the bare minimum of testing results, pH, iron, and hardness...i returned with this results and was still given nothing but a 'get a full test/ have a pro come out'....i had a pro come out and now you're telling me that what he's told me is bullshit. You don't count yourself among the experienced? Don't reply then.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Sawyer View Post
    I tend to side with slusser here too. Unfortunately there are a whole lot of crooks in the water treatment game and there always have been. It's because most folks don't understand water filtration and treatment and most aren't willing to find out about it so it's pretty easy to talk people into buying stuff they don't need.


    I really would like to get away from using these chemicals if i could, they are costly and its a burden to keep checking them and replacing them. If changing chemicals for an acid-neutralizing bed is going to give me the same results with less cost in the long run and less maintenance on my part, its worth it. I will always have the tanks in my possession should I decide to use them again, they're not taking them from me. I guess at this point it looks like I was going to do what i wanted/what 'my guy' suggested anyways...maybe I was here looking for validation? who knows... I couldn't even get help setting up a timer on my water softener control valve here....that alone was worth me paying this guy $200.

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