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Thread: Pressure Drop - whole house filter - Aquapure AP903

  1. #16
    DIYer, not in the trades LLigetfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lordoftheflies View Post
    The first gauge reads the incoming pressure so that should be the same regardless, n'est-ce pas?
    No. When you isolate and remove the filter, both gauges will read zero. Putting the gauges on the opposite side of the isolation valves would have allowed them to read the pressure regardless of the valve being open or closed.

  2. #17
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    Noticeably worse last night my wife complained.

    Snapped a pic without adjust the hose stream this morning with the filter on and off.

    At a wider stream the water was just dribbling out.

    Waiting for my replacement to arrive. Till then I'll leave the bypass on.

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  3. #18
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    I think you've solved the cause of the problem, now what the best solution to it long-term is another story. BTW, what is the rated GPM flow rate and expected pressure drop on that filter? It may handle 100K gallons, but if the flow rate isn't high enough, for this application, it's useless.
    Jim DeBruycker
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    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  4. #19
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    20 from. Operating psi range is 25-125. I can't find any documation on "expected" pressure drop.

    If the new filter doesn't last a year and does the same thing I'm gonna make 3m do something about it.

    If it works fine then it was a defective filter or something may have gummed it up. They want the old filter back so we will see what they find. Although I would like to cut it open myself to see what is happening.

    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    I think solved the cause of the problem, now what the best solution to it long-term is another story. BTW, what is the rated GPM flow rate and expected pressure drop on that filter? It may handle 100K gallons, but if the flow rate isn't high enough, for this application, it's useless.

  5. #20
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    Ps I saw the outgoing gauge show <20 psi yesterday.

  6. #21
    DIYer, not in the trades LLigetfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    BTW, what is the rated GPM flow rate and expected pressure drop on that filter?
    Not very good spec sheet but none the less, they claim "up to" 20 GPM peak flow rate.
    http://www.3mwater.com/media/catalog...3SpecSheet.pdf

    They explicitly say "This product is not designed for potable water with precipitating iron, bacteria or chloramine present" and I'm curious whether it turns out that iron is to blame. With the iron I have, that filter probably wouldn't last a day.

  7. #22
    DIYer, not in the trades LLigetfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lordoftheflies View Post
    If the new filter doesn't last a year and does the same thing I'm gonna make 3m do something about it.
    LOL... like Dr. Phil would say, let me know how that works out for you.

  8. #23
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    Chloramine is not uncommon in municipal water supplies, and that may be what's gumming up the works.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  9. #24
    DIY Junior Member Greenaim's Avatar
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    Hi There,

    It sounds like you are having a very similar problem to ours. I also have the AP903 with AP917HD carbon filter. I have used 2 so far in the past approximately 4 months and water pressure has dropped to very low (i.e., can only use water from 1 source at a time), after about 2 months of use each time. The water pressure started to drop after about 2 weeks, but I just didn't notice. We used the AP917R filter cartridge(no longer available) previously, and the filters lasted about 1 year as they are supposed to. We did have a water softener before, but we decided not to use it anymore. The AP 917HD filter is currently used without any other filtration system. You should definitely contact 3M, and find out what they say. I am in Canada, and 3M said that they did have a problem with a batch of AP917HDS (not the AP917HD), and are so far helpful in trying to resolve this issue. 3M is going to give me a new AP917HD filter and I am sending in a sample of unfiltered water and returning the 2 used filter for analysis via the retailer. They also plan to replace the other filter once they get the water and returned filtered tested.

    AP917HD filters should last about 1 year. From talking to the retailer, it sounds like there are sediments in the water that is clogging up the AP917HD. I am planning to get a pre-filter that back washes automatically (filters about 30microns), and see if that would resolve this issue.

    Contact 3M, and you should at least get your filter replaced at no cost as it did not last the duration that it should have.

  10. #25
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenaim View Post
    Hi There,

    It sounds like you are having a very similar problem to ours. I also have the AP903 with AP917HD carbon filter. I have used 2 so far in the past approximately 4 months and water pressure has dropped to very low (i.e., can only use water from 1 source at a time), after about 2 months of use each time. The water pressure started to drop after about 2 weeks, but I just didn't notice. We used the AP917R filter cartridge(no longer available) previously, and the filters lasted about 1 year as they are supposed to. We did have a water softener before, but we decided not to use it anymore. The AP 917HD filter is currently used without any other filtration system. You should definitely contact 3M, and find out what they say. I am in Canada, and 3M said that they did have a problem with a batch of AP917HDS (not the AP917HD), and are so far helpful in trying to resolve this issue. 3M is going to give me a new AP917HD filter and I am sending in a sample of unfiltered water and returning the 2 used filter for analysis via the retailer. They also plan to replace the other filter once they get the water and returned filtered tested.

    AP917HD filters should last about 1 year. From talking to the retailer, it sounds like there are sediments in the water that is clogging up the AP917HD. I am planning to get a pre-filter that back washes automatically (filters about 30microns), and see if that would resolve this issue.

    Contact 3M, and you should at least get your filter replaced at no cost as it did not last the duration that it should have.
    Thanks a lot for posting that. I did call them and gave been waiting for a replacement filter. Sorry to hear you are having issues as well. I will keep you posted on what happens next...

  11. #26
    DIY Junior Member Greenaim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lordoftheflies View Post
    Thanks a lot for posting that. I did call them and gave been waiting for a replacement filter. Sorry to hear you are having issues as well. I will keep you posted on what happens next...
    When I first contacted the retailer (a place that specializes various home improvement products), the salesperson told me that they sell a lot of AP917HD filters and haven't received any negative feedback. They had one customer from a moderately populated area with well-derived water who also had a prematurely clogged AP917HD filter. The customer resolved the problem by adding a German made water softener and an expensive pre-filter. I am in a busy urban area with municipally supplied water.

    From talking extensively with the salesperson, it sounds like all of their customers who uses the AP917HD also have other filtration system(s) attached, and that may be why no one else is having issues. Anything from the water supply, such as sediments, rust from old city pipes, dirt from nearby construction/pipe replacement can easily plugged up the filter. Although, according to customer service at 3M, the filter should last one year used alone in a municipal setting as long as there is nothing unusual(such as construction, water pipe replacement) going on. Personally, after spending time, effort on 2 filters, and based on information from the retailer, I think the 3M AP917HD filter is not an appropriate filter to be used by itself for my purpose. It is possible that there is something in the AP917HD design that is causing the premature clogging (3M said that they have no known issue with this particular filter), but I am waiting for 3M to comment after their analysis of the old filters I am sending back.

    Right now the water is on bypass and I can really smell the chlorine at times. At least, the AP917HD was effective in removing the chlorine. I am going to add a pre-filter(as recommended by the retailer and the same one as their other customer who had a similar problem uses) to the AP917HD. My other options are to add a water softener, or use a different type of water filtration system (using resin/beads/sands) instead of disposable carbon filters. These options are considerable more expensive. and not necessarily "better" or "needed" for my purpose for now IMHO.

    One of the old filters was cut open as advised by the retailer. Photos posted below. However, I spoke to 3M afterward, and they don't recommended this. They prefer to do the analysis hemselves and said that an average customer can't really tell want the problem is anyway. The salesperson from the retailer looked at the cut open filter and said that it was very dirty and is equivalent to ones that have been used for 10 months minimum. I would not recommend that you cut open yours as it would likely be a waste of time and effort.

    I will also try to post when I get a reply from the 3M and find out if the pre-filter works out. BTW, your plumber did a really neat job of installing the filter. Unlike the way our retailer installed ours with the filter sort of hanging on by brackets and no bypass. It would also be nice to have those gauges. I hope you get your problem resolved, but it does sound like you might have to consider installing an additional filtration system because of your specific water supply. Glad to have read your posts so that I know this is not an isolated/uncommon issue as I was originally lead to believe.
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  12. #27
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    Thanks for all the info. Fwiw I filled tub yest while still on bypass and the difference was ridiculous. The turbidity alone was cause for concern. I had never realized how cloudy my water is without a filter. Still waiting for my replacement filter.

    I'm not a fan if "oh we've never encountered this problem before - this is the first time..."

    Lame excuse.

  13. #28
    DIY Senior Member Hairyhosebib's Avatar
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    Personally, I am impressed with the pro press fittings. Makes for a nice fast installation. I don't know how they are considered bulky, but they are expensive. I personally use two .5 filters. That is one half micron. One particulate, one carbon. I am on a city water system and have no pressure issues. I change them once a year.
    Perhaps you could remove that 20 inch filter cartridge. Put the bowl back on and try opening the valves one either side of the filter body one side at a time. You never know what might blow out Filtration is your first defense against sand and rocks getting to your faucets and other fixtures. I occasionally remove faucet areators just to see what is being held in them. Most all of the time there is nothing there to wash out of them. I soften my water too.

  14. #29
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    New filter received yesterday. Swapped it out and now I see the expected 1-3psi pressure drop. Spoke to Chad at 3M re: what the expected pressure drop should be.

    After speaking with Chad he said small particles (1-2 micron) might be clogging up the carbon block and also said the phrase "we'll work with you to get it resolved" several times.

    My water test from 3M came back. See below. Seems like I don't have an iron or a chloramine issue.

    Suggested we might go with a AP802 before the Ap903 but heck, I thought the AP903 was supposd to be able to handle everything on its own. Hm.

    Knock on wood and let's see what happens with this filter. Installed Jun-6-2013.

    Would like to see the picture of the filter when they open it up as well.


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  15. #30
    DIY Member lordoftheflies's Avatar
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    Well I am seeing some pressure drop now after 7 days. Haven't heard back from 3M yet on what they saw with my first filter.

    However, I experimented a little with the PRV and cranked it up to the max (75psi) that it allows.....

    Now when I run the tap the dynamic incoming pressure is right there at 75psi..........and the post filter gauge shows 50psi! 33% drop.

    I'm going to have to call 3M tomorrow again to discuss my options. I can live with 50psi........however, I can just guess that it will be showing <20psi sooner rather than later.

    I may end up trying to the filter that comes with the AP902 (no carbon block) and also consider swapping out this unit for the AP802.......with the AP817 filter it filters down to 25 microns instead of 5 and still does 20gpm (40gpm when two filters are used in the AP802 housing I believe).

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