well pump noise

I bought my house 2 yrs ago, at that time whenever the well turns on we get a vibration in the pipes and noise. The house is 20 yrs old, the original owner ran 1 1/4" black poly to the house and then inside went to 1 1/2'' galvinized to the pressure tank which is on the other side of the house. From the tank the supply line is 3/4" copper. The noise hasn't gotten any worse but is always there when the pump runs. The 1 1/2" pipe runs above the sheetrock ceiling so I am not sure how they suspended it. Any advise on this problem would be greatly appreciated.
Bob

I would guess that the pipe is actually laying on the trusses, rather than suspended. I doubt that vibration would be an issue if the pipe was suspended properly.
You may be able to put some dampening material under the pipe and then restrap it back down and see if that helps.
Ron

I've have had this problem several times. Sometimes suspending like Ron suggested works and sometimes nothing seemed to work because the pump just for some reason had a bad vibration and can't be dampaned out.

I replaced a submersible years ago that didn't vibrate until I got done. Since the water level in this area was subject to dropping, I also added a length of pipe ofter pumping the well off. The vibration completely disappeared. Go figure!

bob...

Speed,
When I worked for Johnston Pump, we had a lineshaft turbine pump that vibrated like crazy. We checked the balance on the impellers and couplings, checked the shaft for straightness, checked all the bearings in pump and motor, and still it vibrated so bad we couldn't run it. Finally we got what we called a "black box", which was a vibration analyzer. We used this box to take readings at various places on the motor and pump discharge head. This box would tell you at what frequency the vibration was occuring, as well as the frequency that the pump ran at. What we found out was that the pump run freq. and the vibration freq. were exactly the same, which caused a resonant vibration. To control a resonant vibration, you have to change the physical structure of the pump. We did this by welding a stiffener between the supports on the discharge head. This changed the structure enough and the vibration ceased.
I suspect you accomplished the same thing by adding an extra lemgth of pipe to your problem pump.
Ron

Thanks for the info guys, one question I didn't ask, why did the original installer use 1 1/2" galvinzed pipe in the house. Before posting the original message I had decided to reroute the water line in the house, instead of tearing down the basement ceiling to try and find out what they had done. I plan on using 1" copper to the pressure tank, off the 1" I plan on feeding the existing 3/4" for all of the house and also take a 1" off the main feed for a new underground sprinkler system that will be put in this spring. What would you think of this plan, and just abandon the existing 1 1/2" galvonized in favor of the 1" copper (type L)?
Thanks
Bob

Sounds good to me Bob. Of coarse it will depend on how much the sprinklers need and how much the pump produces. I assume this is a normal residential installation.

I am not sure why he ran the 1-1/2" in the first place. 1" or 1-1/4" would have been plenty big enough.

I think the 1" copper will work fine for your needs.

Ron,

Around 15 years ago, a driller friend of mine had replaced a submersible 1hp 25 gpm sub with a Goulds with the same specs. He got me involved with the vibrating problem. This well was at least 50 feet from the house and the vibration in and around the house was terrible. Someone at Goulds told him it was harmonics and by teeing into the pressure pipe from the pump to the house with a 20' long piece of 1" pvc pipe capped on the opposite end would fix the problem. It sounded fishy to me and for good reason. After he and his boys got done installing this magic pipe the vibration persisted just like before. Changing the pump did make the noise go away however.

bob...

On the 1" copper for the sprinkler system, just be sure you know how much flow that line will carry, and plan the system using that info. Plan your zones accordingly.
Speed - I'd say the Goulds guy was refusing to consider that his pump may have had a problem. Changing the structure of the pump will only cure a resonant vibration. If the pump unit itself has a problem, ain't no amount of structural changing gonna fix that.
Ron

Since I only sold Goulds for a short while, I don't know what kind of a problem they had. I heard a rumor that they make a change in their diffuser and that caused the vibration. I guess whatever it was, they must have addressed it quickly. I never heard of it again after that one instance.

bob...

well pump noise one more time

Hi Guys; While getting ready to put in the new pipe I questioned about earlier I tore out some of the basement ceiling to expose the old pipe, and as pumpman sugested the pipe may not have been suspended properly was the case, it was laying on one 2x4 brace between the floor joists for a run of about 16 feet and not clamped down. Also what I had expected to be 1 1/2" galvinized was actualy 1 1/4". I added extra braces and it took care of about half the noise. Yesterday I visited with the local pump man about the noise and he sugested the problem might be the torsion arrestor in the well casing, he also said not to downsize to 1 inch pipe. His reasoning was I would not have enough volume at the 1 ". The pump is a 3/4 hp and puts out 25 gpm. with a run time of 2 minutes, it has a well x trol wx-252 86 gal. pressure tank. I talked with the underground sprinkler man and he says the 1" supply I will be feeding him will be great. What would be your take on the downsizing issues and the torsion arestor (if in fact thas what it is called). Thanks for your help.
Bob

For 25 GPM I would not decrease the pipe size.

The poly pipe substantially isolates your house from what happens in the well. A torsion arrester in the well, or lack of one, is not going to significantly affect the vibration in the house.

You will further reduce the noise transmitted to the house structure if you put a soft pad of some kind between the steel pipe and supports. Almost any kind of foam rubber or other material that prevents hard contact will help.

In my opinion torque arrestors should be sold only at Home Depot. I can't think of any reason to sell one other than to make money.

bob...