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Thread: Faucet hose extension, Chicago

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  1. #1
    DIY Junior Member PixieFix's Avatar
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    Default Faucet hose extension, Chicago

    While my condo's maintenance head was looking under my kitchen sink (on a different matter), he pointed out that my faucet hose was not connected directly to the valve. He said it's illegal but he did add later that he wasn't sure.

    My faucet hose-extension tube-valve looks like this:


    I live in Chicago, in a high-rise condo. My question is, does it violate a particular Chicago building/plumbing code for a kitchen faucet hose to be connected to a valve via an extension tube?

    I would like to know which particular item in the Chicago/Illinois plumbing code states how a faucet hose should or should not be connected to a valve. Please pardon my silly question. I find navigating through the Chicago/Illinois plumbing code quite confusing.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    it appears that the "hose" you are referring to is the supply line to the faucet, in which case you can "extend" it as far as necessary to reach the valve. He is wrong. I would be more concerned about the "clear" hose behind it, because that material may NOT be suitable for "full system pressures".
    Last edited by hj; 03-07-2013 at 06:26 AM.
    Licensed residential and commercial plumber

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    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    If the T's are brass or bronze, they're okay, but if galvanized, I'd be worried about them in the long-term.
    Jim DeBruycker
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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    IN Chicago, galvanized tees are common in older structures. We were using them into the 60s.
    Licensed residential and commercial plumber

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    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    Brass or bronze will outlast the structure! Galvanized can live long, but it WILL start to rust out after awhile. While redoing things, I'd get rid of them.
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

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    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    In High Rise buildings in Chicago, flexible, and plastic faucet supplies are against code. It must be done with copper supply lines. (can be chrome plated copper)

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    DIY Junior Member PixieFix's Avatar
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    Sorry. I didn't get to see the replies until now. I thought I'd be getting instant e-mail notification when replies are posted.


    Quote Originally Posted by hj View Post
    it appears that the "hose" you are referring to is the supply line to the faucet, in which case you can "extend" it as far as necessary to reach the valve. He is wrong. I would be more concerned about the "clear" hose behind it, because that material may NOT be suitable for "full system pressures".
    The clear hose behind it is 3/8" PE and goes from one cold water valve to the water filter (to the water heater-hot water dispenser).



    Quote Originally Posted by jadnashua View Post
    Brass or bronze will outlast the structure! Galvanized can live long, but it WILL start to rust out after awhile. While redoing things, I'd get rid of them.
    One galvanized tee developed a leak so when I called in a plumber, I had him replace all the water supply lines (under the kitchen sink) with soldered copper and chrome-plated brass valves. The valves were also raised so that the faucet supply lines didn't need to have extensions.



    Quote Originally Posted by SewerRatz View Post
    In High Rise buildings in Chicago, flexible, and plastic faucet supplies are against code. It must be done with copper supply lines. (can be chrome plated copper)
    That's "flexible plastic" right? Not flexible "any material" (e.g., the flexible braided water supply lines that come with faucets)?


    --------------------------------

    More on plastic faucet supplies in high rise buildings in Chicago:

    Under-the-sink water filters usually come with PE tubing - one connected to the water supply valve and one to the water dispenser (or ice maker, or coffeemaker/brewer). Hot/cold water dispenser faucets usually come with a silicone/norprene hot water outlet tubing. Are the PE and silicone/norprene tubings included or not included in the "plastic faucet supplies" that are against code?

    Could anyone post a link to the Illinois/Chicago code and also quote the specific statement "verbatim" in the code that refers to extensions and material (plastic, flexible) in high rise condos?

    Is there a section (which section number?) that deals with tubings/connections for water dispensers/coffeemakers/ice makers (in high rise condos in Chicago)? Can tubings coming FROM a water filter be plastic (PE)? In all the set-ups I've seen, tubings from the water filter going to water heater-hot & cold water faucet/coffee brewer/ice maker were PE tubings.

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    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    The braided hoses are in most cases just a plastic outer weave over a rubber hose, there are some that use a stainless steal weave over a rubber hose, again those do not meet the plumbing code. The poly lines used on water filters, ice makers and instant hot taps need to be changed out to copper lines. There is soft copper that comes in rolls at the size needed for these filters and taps. I do not have my Chicago Code book here in my home, so I can not quote you the title, and section. You can call the City Plumbing department and ask them. Or you can buy the code book, the link to the Chicago Municipal codes that you linked to in the other post is incomplete and of course does not list the section you want me to point you to.

    For 85 bucks you can have a nice handy reference guide to the Chicago Plumbing codes. https://www.lawbulletin.com/real-est...-plumbing-code

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    DIY Junior Member PixieFix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SewerRatz View Post
    The braided hoses are in most cases just a plastic outer weave over a rubber hose, there are some that use a stainless steal weave over a rubber hose, again those do not meet the plumbing code. The poly lines used on water filters, ice makers and instant hot taps need to be changed out to copper lines. There is soft copper that comes in rolls at the size needed for these filters and taps. I do not have my Chicago Code book here in my home, so I can not quote you the title, and section. You can call the City Plumbing department and ask them. Or you can buy the code book, the link to the Chicago Municipal codes that you linked to in the other post is incomplete and of course does not list the section you want me to point you to.

    For 85 bucks you can have a nice handy reference guide to the Chicago Plumbing codes. https://www.lawbulletin.com/real-est...-plumbing-code

    What are the supply lines that come attached to most faucets, sold in hardware stores, generally made of? Are they just rubber hoses with a braided SS weave?

    Interesting. How is a consumer supposed to know what the supply line material is without cutting the line itself to look at the cross section? That kind of info is usually not included in a faucet's product description. Does the city/government expect a consumer to know and to proactively find out the material of a new faucet's supply line and change it if it's not entirely metal? A consumer is supposed to know that he should discard the silicone/norprene tubing that comes with a hot water dispenser tank and replace it with a metal tubing?

    I'm not attacking you with my questions. I am just in awe of the many plumbing rules that a person is supposed to know without having ready access to the written rules that he's supposed to know and have to rely on hearsay (most of the time). I say hearsay because if a city official were to ask me why XYZ was done, I would have to say, 'because plumber ABC said it was the thing to be done." I can't say "because the city code says "<state the rule verbatim>". Even during the few times when I did contact the city regarding codes/rules, they would also say something but not state where that rule is/what the specific rule is verbatim. In this world, written still counts more (especially in courts) vs just oral. I usually feel like Yentl singing "Where is it written...?"

    The usual setup, in residential homes, for ice makers/fridge water dispensers would be copper tubing in the wall but PE from the icemaker/water valve to the filling tube. Even the manufacturer's authorized service dealers use PE when they do the installation. Do plumbers actually change those PE tubings to copper when they're called in to service a home?

    If copper tubings are connected to each other by a plastic fitting (e.g., John Guest union connector), would that be not up to code then because there's a plastic fitting involved? What about the water filter that the copper tubings are connected to? They're plastic too.

    I suppose the government makes up codes/rules but doesn't actually expect people to follow or actually has government agencies enforce (until such time when a significant accident/disaster occurs). How else do we explain all the hundreds of ice makers and water dispensers that come with PE tubings by default? Or that some instant water heaters (for dispensers) use vinyl tubing inside? The current model of Insinkerator water heater leaks after a year or two because they used a vinyl tubing inside which degrades with all that heat.

    Anyway, got to go. This was fun. I think I'll read the plumbing code from front to back by making it my to-read-before-falling-asleep book.

  10. #10
    Illinois Licensed Plumber SewerRatz's Avatar
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    As a plumber and when I am called in to install and hook up an ice maker, its all copper. Did you know most ice maker kits that come with the saddle valve does not meet the Illinois code? Illinois Plumbing code states saddle valves are not allowed. As for faucets, there each major manufacture does have faucets were you have to hook up a supply from the angle stop to the faucet itself, no supplied supply lines. Also a home owner in Illinois is not required to know all the codes for the state, or the amendments for counties, cities, and townships. It is a plumber that needs to know the all the codes.

    I can tell you I do not know all the codes for every city, township or county in the state of Illinois. But what I do is I contact the city, township county, and ask what code do they follow, and what amendments they have. As for unlicensed persons doing plumbing. Illinois does allow a home owner to do their own plumbing on their own home, not rental properties not a relatives home, just their own home they live in. Also they are (homeowners) are required to get a permit (this is when you ask the inspector what the codes allows and disallows). , and have all the work inspected.

    Also about your blanket explanation of manufactures by default supplying PE, (more likely pex since most places have a ban on PE), is they are not required to sell you a product that meets the plumbing code in your area. Heck the big box stores sell AAV's (Air Admittance Valve) which are against Illinois Plumbing code, but yet they sell it and home owners buy them. But when they go to sell their home and an inspection is done, and they catch the AAV installed, they will make you hire a plumber to properly vent the fixture the AAV was installed on. There is a lot of things sold to the consumers that do not meet codes, electrical, plumbing, hvac, and so on. It is up to the DIY to ensure they products they are using meet their local codes. If they do not want to go through the trouble of finding out what is allowed or not, they can always hire a licensed professional.

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