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Thread: Dead Culligan Estate 2 - How to remove & what's next?

  1. #16
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    I decided we've lived with hard water long enough, so I'm about ready to order a new softener. My situation is as listed below

    > People in Home: 3
    > Number of Full Bathrooms: 2
    > Hardness Value: 15
    > Hardness Unit: gpg
    > Iron Value: 0
    > Iron Unit: ppm
    > pH Value: 7.0
    > Flow Rate: 7
    > Raw Water Color: no
    > Raw Water Odor: no
    > Raw Water Clear: yes
    > Raw Water Is Clear but turns color overnight: no
    > Odor is gone overnight: yes
    > Sediment present overnight: no
    > Slimy buildup in tank: no
    > Iron stains on fixtures: no
    > Water Line Size: 3/4

    Based on this, one of the online suppliers has suggested the following softener. Comments?

    Fleck 5600SXT Electronic 3/4 Inch Meter On Demand Control Valve Water Softener 40000 Grain Capacity
    10x44 Resin tank
    1.25 cubic feet of NSF Approved High Capacity Cation 8% Crosslink Softening Resin
    10 gpm service flow rate
    2.5 gpm backwash flow rate
    Selected options:
    Fleck Valve Connection: 3/4 Inch Noryl Yoke with Noryl Bypass Valve
    Tank Color Option: Almond
    Brine Tank Size: 15x17x36 Rect Brine Tank

  2. #17
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    Still hoping for some input here

    For example, I am wondering if 40K grain capacity is a bit much for my situation?

  3. #18
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Why do you think 40K may be too much?
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  4. #19
    DIY Senior Member mialynette2003's Avatar
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    I've always used this forumal: 1 CF = 30,000 @ 15 lbs of salt or 20,000 @ 6 lbs of salt. In your case 30k*1.25=37500 @ 18.75 or 20k*1.25=25000 @ 7.5. Look at your requirements: 3 people*65 usage per person*15 hardness=2925 hardness removed per day. 25000-2925=22075/65/3/15=7.5 days between regens. So I think the system that was recommended is proper.

  5. #20
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice and comments (and Gary's calculator). I ordered the 40,000 grain 5600SXT unit today from OPWC

  6. #21
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    Got the softener installed today...Question - Does a new softener need a regeneration cycle up front? Or does the resin provide softening out of the box?

  7. #22
    Aspiring Old Fart, EE, computer & networking geek Mikey's Avatar
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    I think most of the pro's recommend at least one up-front regen. One on-line startup guide that is otherwise pretty thorough doesn't mention it, but the outfit I use explicitly says to go through a regeneration. Another says "Once reassembled you should backwash your new resins for 10 minutes using your control valve (All control valves have some way to manually advance the valve to backwash.). You can allow the valve to run a complete regeneration cycle, but it is not needed. The resins come fully charged." So flip a coin, I guess. I'd go through one cycle anyway just to verify everything is working properly.
    Last edited by Mikey; 09-29-2013 at 05:31 AM.

  8. #23
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    The reason many online dealers say to do a regeneration is because they don't have their customer put the valve into backwash when their instructions tell them to turn on the water slowly until they have a full drain line flow and then to turn the water on full open until the water flows clear. Not doing that traps air and any debris caused during installation. Then the person should step the valve through each cycle position until the brine refill position and stop and let the valve finish the cycle. Some do not mention adding water to the salt tank either.

    New resin does not have to be regenerated, it is fully regenerated right out of the bag.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  9. #24
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    OK, thanks.

    Now, how to set up the 5600SXT for maximum salt efficiency? I have the 0.5 gal/1.5 lb brine connection. Total system capacity is 40000.

    EDIT: Let me see if I can figure this out:

    6lbs of salt with 1.25cuft gives 25K capacity. To get 7.5 lbs (6 lbs/cuft with 1.25cuft), I need 5 minutes of backflow. SO, setting the Capacity to 25K and BF to 4 minutes should do it? Any of the other settings (backwash time, brine draw, rapid rinse) need to change?

    Capacity: 25K
    Hardness: 15
    RS: SF
    SF: 20%
    DO: 10
    RT: 2:00 AM
    BW: 10
    RR: 10
    BF: 5
    Last edited by hiperco; 09-29-2013 at 09:51 AM. Reason: added analysis, corrected salt dose

  10. #25
    DIY Senior Member lifespeed's Avatar
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    you need to know your brine line flow rate, it should be marked on the softener as .125 GPM or .25 GPM. That will tell you gallons of brine at 3 lbs salt per gallon. Your BF 5 minutes can't be correct.
    Lifespeed

  11. #26
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    As mentioned above I have a 0.5gal/1.5lb per minute brine flow rate.

  12. #27
    DIY Senior Member lifespeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiperco View Post
    As mentioned above I have a 0.5gal/1.5lb per minute brine flow rate.
    From my very limited experience that is too fast of a brine rate for that size softener. That button controls the rate at which the brine passes over your resin bed during regeneration, and I think it may be too fast.
    Lifespeed

  13. #28
    DIY Member hiperco's Avatar
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    I think the brine fill rate is just that. Its how much water goes into the brine tank. Then the brine is drawn out during the brine draw cycle. But hopefully someone that knows for sure will chime in

  14. #29
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lifespeed View Post
    you need to know your brine line flow rate, it should be marked on the softener as .125 GPM or .25 GPM. That will tell you gallons of brine at 3 lbs salt per gallon. Your BF 5 minutes can't be correct.
    The standard residential softener control valve BLFC has been .5gpm or 1.5lbs per minute for the last few decades until someone thought it would be a good idea to start using .125 or .25 gpm for the 7000. He has a 5600 control valve, not a 7000. If it is available, IMO those with a 7000 should be using a .5 gpm.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  15. #30
    DIY Senior Member lifespeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    The standard residential softener control valve BLFC has been .5gpm or 1.5lbs per minute for the last few decades until someone thought it would be a good idea to start using .125 or .25 gpm for the 7000. He has a 5600 control valve, not a 7000. If it is available, IMO those with a 7000 should be using a .5 gpm.
    Right, because you know more about the design than the manufacturer one should change the time the resin is soaked in brine during regeneration to be shorter than the mfg spec based on your recommend.

    If the 5600 is designed to work with 0.5 GPM BLFC, I won't argue the point. I just observe it is a small softener and the resin will only spend about 5 minutes soaking in brine when it could be easily adjusted to be 2X or 4X that long.
    Lifespeed

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