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Thread: Semi-recessed vessel sink - with overflow? Milforde Semi-Recessed Porcelain Sink

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    DIY Junior Member blecrone's Avatar
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    Default Semi-recessed vessel sink - with overflow? Milforde Semi-Recessed Porcelain Sink

    Recently purchased this vessel type sink: http://www.signaturehardware.com/product14433
    It is described as having an overflow hole, which it appears to have. The overflow hole leads to a "channel" within the wall of the sink which leads down to the drain hole in the bottom of the sink. However, on the very bottom of the sink there are two dime-sized hole (1 on either side of the drain hole) which allow any water entering the overflow hole to exit the overflow channel before reaching the drain. Am I supposed to plug these two holes with something and if so what? If I don't plug them, the overflow does not function as such. Or is the whole system only supposed to function as a venting system? Thanks in advance for any help.

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    DIY Junior Member blecrone's Avatar
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    Thanks. I think I'm not being clear enough. I understand how an overflow is supposed to work. However, in this case any water that enters the overflow won't ever reach the pop-up drain because there are two holes in the bottom of the sink where the water will exit before reaching the pop-up drain. I am supposed to plug these holes in order to have a functioning overflow, or is the overflow hole really just a vent hole only?

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    Forum Admin, Expert Plumber Terry's Avatar
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    I am supposed to plug these holes in order to have a functioning overflow, or is the overflow hole really just a vent hole only?
    If the lower part of the sink doesn't work with a pop-up, and they just daylight, (something I haven't seen yet) then they may in fact be vents.
    Sounds like a risky solution to the poor vessel draining issues.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    Are you sure the two holes are not just "vents" from the casting process. If they are in fact the outlet of the overflow opening, take the sink back and get one that is not defective. There is no way that any reputable manufacturer would create a sink where the overflow water drains out of those two holes into the sink cabinet, UNLESS, they also make some "proprietary" fitting that covers those two openings and directs the water into the central drain opening, in which case it should have come with the sink. One disturbing item is that NEITHER of the drains they show with the sink seems to have overflow openings, and in fact are specified as "ideal" for homemade sinks which would not have overflow passages.
    Last edited by hj; 11-26-2012 at 06:47 AM.
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    DIY Junior Member blecrone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hj View Post
    Are you sure the two holes are not just "vents" from the casting process.
    This was in fact my first thought when I unpackaged the sink, and I didn't really look at them that closely. It seems odd that they just happen to match up with the overflow channel, though.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    quote; It seems odd that they just happen to match up with the overflow channel, though

    Well, they may have needed them to 'shape" the overflow passages, then sealed them afterwards. Pour water through the overflows and see where it comes out, or blow into one of the holes and check where it goes.

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    DIY Junior Member blecrone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hj View Post
    Pour water through the overflows and see where it comes out...
    Yeah did that - it comes right out those two holes.

    The drain assembly I have is a pop-up without overflow holes. I could swap this out for one with overflow holes, and try to plug the two holes in the bottom of the sink, but I think I won't bother. Trying to find the right way to get a good seal could be tricky. I don't want to fuss with trying to get a new sink either. Too much hassle. I'll just live with it. Worst that could happen, I'll be toweling some water off the floor. It's all tile anyway.

    Thanks for your thoughts.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    quote; I don't want to fuss with trying to get a new sink either. Too much hassle. I'll just live with it.

    You are a Home Depot "perfect customer". That attitude is what they hope everyone would have when they sell them "defective" merchandise. Rather than discard it during inspection, they sell it and hope the customer will "live with it". That way they have made a profit on it. IF the customer doesn't want to live with it, then they throw it away, but haven't lost anything because they would have had to do it anyway. The customer is the one who loses because he has to make the extra trips and maybe "uninstall" the item then reinstall the new one.
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    Forum Admin, Expert Plumber Terry's Avatar
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    You are a Home Depot "perfect customer". That attitude is what they hope everyone would have when they sell them "defective" merchandise. Rather than discard it during inspection, they sell it and hope the customer will "live with it". That way they have made a profit on it. IF the customer doesn't want to live with it, then they throw it away, but haven't lost anything because they would have had to do it anyway. The customer is the one who loses because he has to make the extra trips and maybe "uninstall" the item then reinstall the new one.
    And this is what I hear so many times. "I might get a good one, and if it isn't, I can live with it."
    If a plumbing contractor were to install something deemed defective, it would be up to use to replace it, labor included. That's why we're very gun shy of product that may waste our time and money. We expect a certain quality in our work to prevent those "surprises".

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    Plumber jimbo's Avatar
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    The spec you posted says " with overflow" but I don't know the brand to look up install instructions. Do you have them??

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    DIY Junior Member blecrone's Avatar
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    Sorry to strike a cord there hj. I can appreciate ones right to ramble a bit, but for the record my attitude is not what you describe. I specifically did not purchase any of the items for this bathroom project at Home Depot because their products are generally lower quality.

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    You did not purchase it at HD, and they probably would not have had THAT sink if you tried, but the principle is the same. ANY sink that was designed so that overflow water drained into the cabinet iS DEFECTIVE. AND, if the drain opening DOES have provision for the overflows to connect to it, then water WILL also come out of them into the cabinet when you use the faucet. The openings may have been for overflow cores which should have been sealed. IF you keep it without checking with the manufacturer to see WHY it is that way then you have given them the profit for a fixture that otherwise would have been useless and thrown away.
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    Plumber jimbo's Avatar
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    I found the mfg website....no technical info provided.....not a good sign

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    Moderator & Master Plumber hj's Avatar
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    There would not be "technical information" about this situation any way. What would it say? Something like, "After the sink is installed always keep a pan under the sink to catch any "overflow water", or if the sink is installed on top of a countertop, be sure to seal around the drain hole and around the sink so any water exiting the overflow opening is trapped under the sink"? This "situation" needs a phone call to the company's customer service department.
    Last edited by hj; 11-29-2012 at 06:01 AM.
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    Forum Admin, Expert Plumber Terry's Avatar
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    I can't imagine that the holes are from the overflow though. I think water needs to be poured down the overflow to test that theory.
    Like mentioned above, it may be casting holes to let the heated air out while it's in the kiln.

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