Building a better tile shampoo shower niche - a how to guide

[johnfrwhipple]

There are many ways to build a shower niche and I have used just about every method under the sun to make one. First off these shower niches for the most part fall outside of Industry Guidelines. Where they usually stray are at the back side of the niche where they are either part of the opposite rooms drywall or worse part of an exterior wall.

I'd like to showcase this particular shower niche's build because it showcases a lot of basics that people should understand when building one from scratch.

One of my rules when building a shower niche is to oversize them somewhat so I can fine tune the final tile position once more of the tile setting has been completed. When you oversize a niche you will in the end need to fill in this void or space with something. Using regular thin-set is not going to cut it since it is allowed to be used up to 1/4" thick. And this is not so thick.

Here is a play by play of this shower's niche. I build the walls out of Denshield, the framing is a combo of steel studs and 1/2" plywood strapping. The waterproofing product is Ardex 8+9 (a cementitious waterproofing product).

Rule number one: The Layout

The layout should be perfect. After all it is a custom niche so it should be custom. We charge a pretty penny for building these and we deliver exactly what looks best or exactly what the client has requested.


A tile niche should be centered on grout joints or centered on a wall. They should align with the other joints joints and when possible the tile should seamlessly fold in and out of the shower niche. This niche is centered on the short wall above the Tub's waste and overflow. Many times a tubs waste and overflow is used as a fixed reference point. If you have not installed the tub as yet and need to get framing done. Consider oversizing the studs against this back wall - it is easier to infill later than move things around after.

This niche will measure 30cm x 30cm exactly (+/- 1 mm) - The tile is 30cm x 60cm (1'x2' roughly).



Here is a peak at step one in action.



After the layout on day one we set the back tile and the two vertical side pieces. These sides where set a hair lower since the niche will have a sloped bottom to allow water to drain away.


JW


Heading to work.... Will add the remaining pictures and posts this week as the niche takes shape.

[johnfrwhipple]

The client on this project wanted the most room possible inside the shower niche. To achieve this we simply installed backer board onto the back side of the opposite rooms drywall (in the kitchen). This of course is outside any industry recommendation but done all the time building a shampoo niche.

To set the Denshield to the drywall back I used nothing but a little thin-set and then braced it overnight. After the shower walls where boarded and waterproofed we set the back tile tight, tight, tight.

I had some left over 8+9 Waterproofing and wondered if I could set a tile with it - so I tried!!! Worked like a champ and the tile is set perfectly 4mm above the desired grout joint.



Here you can see the 8+9 slurried on my tile back.



The laser is set to the bottom of the tile for easy reading. A few shims and the tile was good to be left alone.



The next step was installing the face tiles and the two sides. To have something to support the tile I screwed in a few scrap pieces of wood. It is very important to patch these holes later. The Ardex 8+9 waterproofing allows me to do two coats in the same day (half day really).



You can see by the measurement on my Chubby (Pencil ruler) that the thin set is a good inch. Very few thin sets can achieve this. Make sure if you are using a regular thin-set that the thickness does not exceed 1/4" in total.





JW

[johnfrwhipple]

We finally fine tuned the plumbing layout and set the two tiles below the niche.





I used my laser when doing layout to ensure that the plumbing fixtures lined up with the tubs drain location.

There is little room for error in a mitered tile install like this. The tile is slightly out of wack because it is a hair thicker than the other tile. I'll use some emery cloth to fine tune the tile on the right and even out the look at center.



This niche is looking good and went in smoothly. That said I did it over multiple days and not all in one go.

Slow and steady wins the race.



JW

[johnfrwhipple]

Shower Niche Layout 101

The niche top and bottom could have been tiled like this...




But my client preferred this layout



Personally I like the look of the first option but the second is easier to clean.

Deciding on how these niches will be finished is key step in the tile layout. These topics should be reviewed from the start so the job can be priced properly.

Asking an installer to pull off a look like this at $5.00 square foot is an unfair request when so much work goes into making them this way.

We are loving the Ardex X32 thin-set. And the Ardex 8+9 waterproofing. Next week we will be doing an entire wet-room with Ardex 8+9 and tying it into a pre-installed Kerdi Drain.

JW

[johnfrwhipple]

We often show up to a job to find Denshield installed in the shower project. The first thing we do is check that the right fasteners where used and check the Denshield for any bows or tips.

If a shower niche is not installed we ask if one is needed. It is very easy to build a shower niche with Denshield and once built it needs to be waterproofed. Now Denshield by itself can pass inspection with no extra waterproofing measures installed but this is not good enough for me or my clients. All seams, screw heads and niches get thin-set and reinforcing mesh (stucco mesh) to make the assembly stronger. A self curing fast setting thin-set is best if you want to waterproof the next day.

Here you can see us installing a niche and tapping the seams of a linear project done with Denshield.





When we install the bottom of the niche I often install three screws at the back side into the framing and leave them a hair high. Then I back butter the backer board with thin-set and squish it into position. The little screws allow the board to sit at a slight angle and this makes for a better built shower niche without the extra time of angling framing studs.

The niche depicted in the picture above has the back side of the Denshield installed to the Kitchen's drywall. Since no screws are possible I use more thinset and nothing else to install the backer board to the drywall. The sides bottom and top then get installed and hold it firmly in place until the thin-set cures.

This practice again is very common but outside industry guidelines. In order to built a shower niche to TCNA or TTMAC specification you would need another 2"x4" wall built to secure the niche's back to. You can see why most people skip this step!

JW

[johnfrwhipple]

Building a shower niche in a steam room or steam shower is different in many ways. The main reason they differ from say a regular shower is that when building a shower niche in a steam room you must remember that steam is more invasive than water.



Here is a picture of a full Noble Seal TS (Noble Company) steam shower.

Installing Noble Seal TS, Kerdi, Wedi and Jaegger membranes are a Bitch in niches. I hate using them. That said they are required so using the ready made corners like Schluter and Noble Company make are a much better approach. You will need four inside corners and four outside corners to achieve a vapour proof shower niche.

Do not let your installers use only a liquid membrane in these niches. Both Custom Building Products and Laticrete all have specifications for the use of a liquid membrane but both companys require you to have a vapour proofing product behind the cement board. You might consider a vapour boot for a pot light or fan as an option in designing a shower niche with a liquid waterproofing product.

Mapei has no steam shower specification that I'm aware of. Ardex as well has no steam shower specification. So when building a steam shower it's best to work with companies that specialize in this field.

At the top of the list is Noble Company. Hands down the best perm rating in North America.

Notice I mentioned concrete board when using Hydro Ban or Red Guard. Not dry wall. Not Denshield. Concrete Board!!!

JW

[Keithett]

John,

I've been reading up on how you create a shower niche and if I understand this correctly, you create an oversize waterproof niche opening so you have the ability to adjust the tile as necessary to match the surrounding tile. I'm going to be tiling a new shower next year and also want my tiled niche to match up exactly with the surrounding tile and like this approach. What I wanted to know is the best way to fill in the approximately 1" (plus or minus) gap behind the tile. Instead of filling this gap with thin set, would it be better to grout in a shim between the niche and the tile? If water behind the tile is a concern, I could make this shim out of a non-porous material.

[dlarrivee]

John that small shower room w/ the toilet in it, does water make it almost to the door or what?

[johnfrwhipple]

John,

I've been reading up on how you create a shower niche and if I understand this correctly, you create an oversize waterproof niche opening so you have the ability to adjust the tile as necessary to match the surrounding tile. I'm going to be tiling a new shower next year and also want my tiled niche to match up exactly with the surrounding tile and like this approach. What I wanted to know is the best way to fill in the approximately 1" (plus or minus) gap behind the tile. Instead of filling this gap with thin set, would it be better to grout in a shim between the niche and the tile? If water behind the tile is a concern, I could make this shim out of a non-porous material.

You can approach the tile instal a few ways.

One is you can use a thick bed thin-set like Ardex X32 or a regular thin-set and mortar mix combination. If you have some scrap tile you could install a double course of tile to build up space if your thin-set allows this.


@ DIARRIVEE - The water does not travel all the way to the door. Overspray from the body lands about 2.5' from the entry. The main shower head hits about 5 feet from the doorway.

[johnfrwhipple]

We tried something new on this project. We tried building a tile niche for toilet paper. Of course my buddy wanted the thing to have lights so we top lit it. The look is more subtle than the side lit niche we build in the shower and a mini version of Hallway Lighting systems we have built in the past with drywall.

Take a look.

The top tile does not go all the way to the back and is keep off a finger width.







JW

[johnfrwhipple]

The main shower niche is really taking shape.

Installed some 3/4" glass and back lit it for some more storage. This glass is keep off the face and is a perfect spot to store a soap dish out of the spray of the shower.

JW

[johnfrwhipple]

For this project I have been given full creative design. I have always thought that it would be fun to hide the shampoo bottles from view. We started the side shelf yesterday and have been working at narrowing the overall niche width. I love the look and the bonus shelf is great extra storage.



This shelf is tucked away out of sight because the wall tile in the shower hides them. Because the larger back lit shelf is not as deep as the total niche depth the overall shower niche allows for multiple sizes of bathing products to be stored.





I'm thinking this is going to be a huge hit with the lady of the house!

JW