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Thread: American Standard Champion toilet Review and comments. Rated #1 by Consumer Reports

  1. #331
    Plumbing Designer FloridaOrange's Avatar
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    I've spec'd Toto on 3 jobs in the last year or so, none have gone in. I'm still much happier with AS than with some of the other brands.
    Matt
    Semi-professional plumbing designer
    Enjoying life in SW Florida

  2. #332
    DIY Junior Member BonnieC's Avatar
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    Default Just wanna say thanks for the explanation.

    I can see on my own toilet that this seems to be working great. I don't totally understand it, but I will keep this in mind. And the toilet works perfectly now, which is the main thing.

  3. #333
    Comments by readers Reader Review's Avatar
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    Default Toilet Review, Champion

    American Standard should be put out of business. I have two of their "Champion" toilets that I had installed three years ago and the only thing they are champions at is clogging and being almost impossible to unclog.

    I managed to get their "customer service" department on the line when I called their 800 # shortly after these pieces of junk were installed and their suggestion was, they really said this, "Take a wire coat hanger, untwist it and go under the rim with the hook of the hanger and stick into the holes to make sure none of them are closed."

    I did this and it didn't help at all, which I expected, since the problem never appeared to be the flow of water out of the tank and into the bowl but inability built into this product to get solid waste down the drain and past whatever impediment was clearly engineered into this health hazard of a toilet.
    A terrible product made by a terrible company with a clear intent, judging from my experience with customer service, to take money and provide nothing of value in return. Right now, I avoid using these two toilets and use a third in our basement. Neither it nor the two toilets I replaced with these pieces of junk ever had this problem.

    The American Standard toilets, when used, clog at least 60 per cent of the time and are so poorly designed that to remove the clog usually requires a minimum of plunging whichever of the toilets has clogged 30 or 40 times and an additional 6 to 10 flushes before the clog can be cleared.

    I will never, never, never again buy anything made by American Standard, will always recommend against there products to anyone mentioning bathroom remodeling (I am a realtor and clients often ask advice about remodeling projects) and hope that anyone reading this would follow suit.
    R. Wood

  4. #334
    DIY Junior Member pmanca's Avatar
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    Default Champion 2002 Elongated

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomw View Post
    I installed a Champion 4 toilet in my house about 6 months ago.

    When I set the toilet on the wax ring, I didn't notice it being particularly difficult, but I am not familiar with many other toilets and their relative weights. I had installed Kohler Wellworth lite 3.5 gal flush toilets about 15 years ago, and it was not much harder. My guess is that the Champion weighs more because of the 2 3/8" trapway - a good tradeoff in my opinion.

    I had read about the recessed screws in the tank and someone posted to use a 1/2" deep socket. I tried this when installing the tank and it was simple and easy. I followed the directions to center the tank on the bowl and tighten the screws evenly and had absolutely no problems. The gasket that goes on it is incredibly thick and compresses a lot. I can see how it would be very difficult with the chintzy wrench they supply with the toilet.

    I have been using the toilet for the last 6 months without a single clog. It has incredible flushing power and it amazes me every time I flush because is uses so little water and yet has so much force. In fact, I have lowered the water level on the Champion as low as it will go to conserve water. The toilet is also very quiet - the whole flush is over in a couple of seconds and the refilling of the tank is pretty quiet.

    The toilet wash function works very good - it is a very shot duration intense whirlpool of water that effectively cleans the bowl. The everclean anti microbial surface probably helps in this regard also - water still beads on the surface after 6 months with no cleaning.

    I installed AS Cadet 3s in my other two bathrooms. They are the one-piece, ADA height, 1.28 gallon, watersense, elongated version. They also have exceeded my expectations. I would rate the Champion as the better of the two models in raw power, but the Cadets have never clogged either. My water bill has been almost halved.

    I have had no problems with the quality or reliability of any of my AS toilets (so far). If I have a flapper problem with the Cadet 3, I will take 5 minutes and replace it, but I honestly don't believe that it will be necessary.

    The flush tower on the Champion 4 has been redesigned, and I am not expecting any problems with it either. It has a 10 year warranty that covers all parts of the toilet including the internal parts.

    I installed a Toto S300 washlet seat on the Champion (it would not fit on the Cadet 3 one-piece toilets that I have.) In order to install this seat, the holes for the seat have to be exactly the right dimension or it will not install. It installed perfectly on my Cadet 3 and Champion toilets. I had to remove it from the Cadet 3 because the base of the seat just barely contacts the bevel in the ceramic that goes up to the tank.

    All in all, I am absolutely thrilled with the performance, price and quality of the 4 American Standard toilets that I have installed, but the Champion 4 is my favorite by a small margin.

    I have a AS Champion 2002 Elongated two piece toilet and I was planning to install a S300/Jasmine (Elongated). The compatibility charts and schematics are not very clear, but you did not seem to have any problems. Did you have to do any custom work? Thx, P.-

  5. #335
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    Default 4260

    Hi Guys,
    Ive got the flush valve for this champion toilet,
    i seen where it was building calcium,
    it was the tower on the left side
    not the flush tower,
    I saw all this calciium under the grey colored tower with the rubber donut on it,
    It seems like the tower worked better,
    and the water didnt go down when all this calcium came out of the fill tower on the left of tank,
    can you get a fill tower on warranty,
    heres my number off toilet, 4260,
    I about give up on this thing,
    I dont know where the water is going?
    theres no bubbling in the tank,and I cant see anything going in the bowl,
    it goes down really slow and then compensates filling up again about every 20 min's,
    K Conway

  6. #336
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer jadnashua's Avatar
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    Put some food coloring in the tank. Shut off the water supply. The tank will empty, and you'll have colored water in the bowl 999 times out of a thousand. Choices are repair or replace...ideally, not with another AS product!
    Jim DeBruycker
    Important note - I'm not a pro
    Retired Defense Industry Engineer; Schluter 2.5-day Workshop Completed 2013, 2014

  7. #337
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    Default American Standard Champion

    We have continually experienced one problem after another with the American Standard Champion toilet that we purchased from Lowes. There are no replacement parts available at Lowes or elsewhere. The problem is the whole flush mechanism. We could tolerate the noise if the end result was a good, clean flush with no leaking. However, the valve does not reseat after a flush, causing leaking and constantly running water. The leaking is enough to produce a moldy odor in the bathroom that is causing health problems in those with breathing irregularities. The refill tube does not stay in place and after a flush sprays water outside the commode onto the floor and walls.
    Keeping the humidity low is impossible, when with every flush the toilet distributes water all over the bathroom. The metal grid which holds the drop ceiling in place has begun to rust again after being repainted once since installing this toilet. The bathroom with the American Standard Champion is the only one of three bathrooms that has this problem. No one has been able to repair this monstrocity though many have tried.The best anyone can do is by rigging makeshift repairs which are very temporary if they ever work at all. We are elderly with many health problems and should not be stuck with this problem. We need a whole new flushing mechanism. We bought this model because the advertising convinced us this was the perfect toilet. Boy! were we disappointed when immediately after installation the problems began. The cost of the Champion was so much more than we could have paid for a toilet with less expense and expectations. When the installation of a product causes adverse health problems the manufacturer should be responsible for making things right . The warranty so far has been useless. American Standard needs to put their money where their mouth is by standing behind their warranty. Obviously, ours is not an isolated problem but appears to be the norm. Have we been the victims of false advertising or what?
    G. Stone

  8. #338
    Comments by readers Reader Review's Avatar
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    We purchased 3 AS Champion Toilets in 2005 at Home Depot while doing some home remodeling. All were installed by a licensed plumber to replace older toilets that used more water per flush and were leaking.

    Although the Champion units used much less water and we had far fewer clogs; these units have not been all we hoped for.

    For starters, the "flush tower" system is REALLY loud. They make a distinctive "clunk" noise that usually startles guests in our home. The other issue is the "flush tower" units are made of cheap plastic and are prone to breaking. While AS provides a 10 year warranty for the parts; it's still expensive paying a plumber to show up every couple of years to complete a "warranty" part replacement.

    So far, we have been fortunate that the 3 units we purchased have not had issues with leaks others have experienced. However, given the problems with the "flush tower" design and/or quality, I would not recommend these units to someone considering buying a new toilet.
    B. Rhodes


    Made in Mexico
    Last edited by Reader Review; 09-26-2010 at 11:44 AM.

  9. #339
    DIY Junior Member thdang's Avatar
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    Question Converting AS to Universal Toilet

    Quote Originally Posted by maddog View Post
    Hmmm - a couple of things to try. Examine the seal carefully to make sure there are no cuts, nicks or dents. Make sure the seal is installed correctly and maybe try turning the seal over to see if the other side seals correctly. After installing this seal (and replacing the original garbage flush tower), the Champion has been a very reliable and strong-flushing toilet. Still no clogs and no more leaks. -dog
    Thanks for your tips. I will try again. Something just popped up in my mind: Do you think it is possible to convert the AS flushing system into the Universal one? I do not see the AS flushing system available in any stores. That make me thinking to put the universal (conventional flapper type) in the AS tank but the flush opening size concerns me for the AS flush opening size might be larger? I do not want to waste the whole AS toilet system but not sure if it works. Help me to brainstorm to fix this issue in a economic way, thanks.

  10. #340
    Forum Admin, Expert Plumber Terry's Avatar
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    If you have the old flush tower, just call support, and they will send you the conversion kit for free.

    Last edited by Terry; 04-06-2011 at 03:19 PM.

  11. #341
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    I have now that I found this site a champion toilet. Didn’t even know what it was until I run across this site. It was problematic ever since we bought the house a few years ago. It was preinstalled in the house. I don’t mind the noise as it is great to not have to plunge as with so many of the new fangled low flow units. I made a few adjustments to it at first and seemed to work nicely. Now It has began to run on and on draining the tank in only a few hours. Taking it a apart and finding the huge hole (4” or whatever it is) was a bit of a shock when no parts are available and even a net search it is nearly impossible to find anything. After taking the tank off and not having parts for repair I made a few adjustments that may be a temporary fix and some of you may find helpful. The little red/orange seal as others have mentioned had developed blisters. I removed the seal dried everything off and pierced the blisters with the point of a small pair of scissors. I squeezed the water out and put a second hole in the blister to help alleviate re-expansion with water. I reseated the seal on the plunger/piston. I coated the whole thing with petroleum jelly and re-assembled the toilet. The petro jelly also will help disperse water and seal the holes in the blisters. I also inverted the washer so the deformation of the rubber is opposite what it was before helping the seal to contact its mating point and form a proper seal. I would think the petro jelly would assist in keeping this seal in place for those who are having problems with it slipping off. Aslo the seal has a pretty tight fit in the groove of the plunger, make sure it is well seated. (as I mis-seated it a couple times before I got it right). This was about 24 hours ago and I have not lost one drip of water through the valve yet. I am not sure how long this will hold up but maybe until I can get some new parts located. The other problem is the huge sponge washer/seal from the tank to bowl seal. Can’t find one of those either.
    M. Miller
    Colorado

  12. #342
    Comments by readers Reader Review's Avatar
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    I have now that I found this site a champion toilet. Didnít even know what it was until I run across this site. It was problematic ever since we bought the house a few years ago. It was preinstalled in the house. I donít mind the noise as it is great to not have to plunge as with so many of the new fangled low flow units. I made a few adjustments to it at first and seemed to work nicely. Now It has began to run on and on draining the tank in only a few hours. Taking it a apart and finding the huge hole (4Ē or whatever it is) was a bit of a shock when no parts are available and even a net search it is nearly impossible to find anything. After taking the tank off and not having parts for repair I made a few adjustments that may be a temporary fix and some of you may find helpful. The little red/orange seal as others have mentioned had developed blisters. I removed the seal dried everything off and pierced the blisters with the point of a small pair of scissors. I squeezed the water out and put a second hole in the blister to help alleviate re-expansion with water. I reseated the seal on the plunger/piston. I coated the whole thing with petroleum jelly and re-assembled the toilet. The petro jelly also will help disperse water and seal the holes in the blisters. I also inverted the washer so the deformation of the rubber is opposite what it was before helping the seal to contact its mating point and form a proper seal. I would think the petro jelly would assist in keeping this seal in place for those who are having problems with it slipping off. Aslo the seal has a pretty tight fit in the groove of the plunger, make sure it is well seated. (as I mis-seated it a couple times before I got it right). This was about 24 hours ago and I have not lost one drip of water through the valve yet. I am not sure how long this will hold up but maybe until I can get some new parts located. The other problem is the huge sponge washer/seal from the tank to bowl seal. Canít find one of those either.
    M. Miller
    Colorado

  13. #343
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    also bought two of these Tiolets last year, one that is higher for older people and an average size one. The one in my bathroom has started leaking out water also, water bill went up to over fifty dollars, I am a widow on Social Secirity and cannot afford to replace these rejects, had gone by all the hype on the commercials and believed them. A bunch of Bull is what they tell you, oh they flush better but we have to lean down and turn the water on when we use the tiolet then turn it off. My daughter & I are thinking on doing what the one review said GLUE that gasket down!! I keeps trying to go down with the flush. Next time if I can afford it there won't be one of these left in my home. thank goodness the other one hasn't started leaking yet, but it is in the master bathroom where my grandson and his wife use it. Had to have a new sewer line put in then the tiolet started this. Shirley

  14. #344
    Comments by readers Reader Review's Avatar
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    If you have the old style flush valve on the left, call American Standard Tech Support and they will send out the new flush valve on the right.


  15. #345
    DIY Junior Member ImpliedConsent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reader Review View Post
    If you have the old style flush valve on the left, call American Standard Tech Support and they will send out the new flush valve on the right.

    Confirmed. My Champion was installed early 2005 (4260). A.S. is sending out the refit kit gratis.

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