American Standard Champion toilet Review and comments. Rated #1 by Consumer Reports

**Terry** · 05-08-2009, 05:05 PM

The comments here seem to be from 2004 to 2006. My supply center tells me that AS has now solved these problems. Does anyone have any experience with the newer flush system.

There are sixteen pages of comments.
They did improve the flush valve, but if you read the most current comments, you will see that the "New" and improved flapper is developing blisters in the first year.

But mainly what the plumbers don't like, is the shear bulk of the beast.
That, and the sloppy way it's made, and the fact the A/S will ship broken lids and repaired bowls as if they were grade "A" new stuff.
We are tired of being A/S assembly line checkers,
Some of this stuff never should have left the factory.

A factory chipped Champion tank lid

**jenniferdilts** · 05-14-2009, 06:43 PM

The champion 4 flush valves have been changed since all of those posts. American standard reconized that there was an issue and the fixed the the flushing system on those toilets. I have this toilet for 2 years and never have had any trouble with it. hope this info helps

**dave in WI** · 05-21-2009, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by jenniferdilts

The champion 4 flush valves have been changed since all of those posts. American standard reconized that there was an issue and the fixed the the flushing system on those toilets. I have this toilet for 2 years and never have had any trouble with it. hope this info helps

I installed a Champion 4 (purchased from Home Depot) in October of 2007. I absolutely love it. It just will not clog. I may be jinxing myself, but we have had no problems with the flush valve.

It is a big heavy piece of porcelain, but as a homeowner how many times do you install a toilet (Hopefully just once unless you do it wrong!).

I have no problem recommending one. We will probably be replacing the the other toilets in our house with these.

**csaxon** · 05-21-2009, 08:33 AM

I just picked up my second champion 4. They have been excellent and trouble free. I checked the blue seal on the first one and it's blister free. I've only seen one comment on a blistered seal so it's a possible fluke. The reviews on the updated champion 4 are excellent and I would recommend it.

**tightglue** · 06-03-2009, 01:33 PM

I had installed three AS 2 piece 4260 Champions (vintage May 2005) in a new home. I was influenced to buy these units by a Home Depot demonstration of flushing numerous golf balls. Unknown to me was the characteristic of a "knocking" when flushed (how noisy and distracting). In addition, all three toilets during the past four years started to leak. I contacted AS about my dilemma. I was pleasantly surprised with the very quick service regarding three replacement flushing valves and seals of the Champion 4 type. Although I just installed, I was very pleased with the disappearance of the knocking and I am hopeful the flush valve leaking is now fixed. The new valve assembly was easy to install and certainly the new design looks much less complex.

**whou69** · 06-09-2009, 09:31 PM

My contractor installed one AS champion 4 toilet for a renovation job,I bought this unit at Lowe's. It had stop working with less than one month of usage. The incoming valve just stop working now, no matter how I tweak it, there's no water flow. Any idea ?

I am not sure whether I can return it, since I've threw away all the packaging. I also don't understand the mechnism, the outlet valve is set at 3-4 inches height, I guess for low flow purpose, that means bottom 30% water will never be used, does it make sense to anyone here ?

Sorry for the naive question, I am new home owner.

**Terry** · 06-09-2009, 10:07 PM

If you have one of these, replace with a normal supply.
The Watts Floodsafe will shut off water to the fill valve.
http://www.terrylove.com/forums/show...ight=floodsafe

**micp879** · 06-10-2009, 01:07 AM

My family has had issues with the Champion in the past, so I don't often defend it. But it sounds like your problem has to do with the incoming supply line, not the toilet. If the problem is with the line, you could put any toilet in the world in there, and it still wont work. I would also go to the fluidmaster website, and follow the directions to flush out the fill valve. There may be some debris stuck in it, blocking water flow. Regarding the height of the flush valve, yes the one in the champion tank is elevated a few inches. Even if it wasn't, most low flow toilets only use a fraction of the tank water anyway. The added water height improves head pressure, which helps provide a stronger flush.

Regarding the toilet in general, when everything is working right on the Champion and there are no defects, it is a very good flushing toilet. Unfortunately, American Standard's QC has slipped a bit, especially with the toilets you buy from big box stores. That often means defects and making return trips. That being said, the issues you mentioned dont sound like defects of the toilet.

**whou69** · 06-11-2009, 09:33 AM

Thanks for the reply, but the supply line does have water flow; I will try the fluidmaster trick then.

But a quarter tank of staled water still bothering me. It must be a design flaw, and I failed to see the point of it. Also we cann't get used to the short spurt of flushing, always thought it does not run well. Wish I had kept that old toilet.

**jadnashua** · 06-11-2009, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by whou69

But a quarter tank of staled water still bothering me. It must be a design flaw, and I failed to see the point of it. Also we cann't get used to the short spurt of flushing, always thought it does not run well. Wish I had kept that old toilet.

If you are referring to the fact the tank doesn't empty during a flush, that is completely normal, and expected. They use the height of the water in the tank, just like a water tower that may supply your home, to provide that extra 'oomph' to what does get dumped into the bowl. For a low-flow toilet to work well, it usually tries to dump nearly all of the required water at once. If you design it right, that only takes a very short time. None of this fill the bowl, then think about draining from the old water hogs.

**whou69** · 06-14-2009, 10:27 PM

I see... I guess it will take us awhile to get used to it...

At last, I figured out the toilet problem, it was due to a gadget called "floodsafe" connector, which supposed to shut itself off due to water pressure but somehow switch off for whatever reason; hmm... for whatever its worth, people do make technical advance on this century old technology.

If you look above, I mentioned the Floodsafe problem on the 9th.
Terry

**Andrew21** · 06-20-2009, 07:12 PM

I can't believe it..well, actually I can. I flushed the toilet the other day and the connector inside the tower came out. ARGHHHHHH so now I have no idea how to clip this back on. It looks like 2 black rocker clips but I don't know how this goes on. Any suggestions?

**maddog** · 06-20-2009, 07:49 PM

If you have the old white flush valve, call American Standard and ask them to send you the new Champion 4 flush valve. It is covered under their 10-year warranty. The new flush valve works much better, until the blue seal develops blisters. They will send you a new seal, if you call in. I would recommend keeping one on hand.... -dog

**Reader Review** · 06-30-2009, 02:43 PM

just called American standard, I have a champion crappy toilet also, never sent in my warranty card, told them the date stamped in the tank, was told I had a ten year warranty, there sending me a whole new flush assembly, the new style #3174.200 and new tank bolts being that the tank has to be removed to replace the flush valve,thanks to everyone's input.
jeff

**Terry** · 07-01-2009, 08:56 AM

I just asked Cathy last night what she thinks of her Champion toilet.
She says she's willing to trade her Champion for a Toto.
She's used both, and prefers the Toto.

As she put it,

"She would take the Toto Drake over the Champion any day of the week!"

Cathy's Champion she would like to trade.

She has a TOTO Aquia dual flush in the upstairs bath.

http://www.yelp.com/biz/macys-lynnwood