Redgard for tiled shower? Waterproof...

[worrywell]

Hello all,

How do I waterproof a walk-in shower? I am attempting to waterprrof a walk-in shower that will be tiled on all three walls. The size of the shower will be a standard 60 x 34. Is Redgard a good waterproof sealer for the floor and walls and then tile over it. Is this possible?

I do not want to use a pan liner, just a liquid waterproofer. The reason is that the home is located in Baja Mexico and liners are practiced yet.

The subfloor is cement and the shower is located on the second floor. I just installed the 1/2 durolock cement boards for HD on the walls. What is next?

Thanks!

[jadnashua]

Redgard is a good product, have you read the installation instructions? They are fairly detailed.

You really do need a sloped bed and a preslope, though for the pan.

The hardest part of the install is ensuring you have the prescribed thickness without voids or bubbles.

There are surface applied membranes that work well, too. www.schluter.com makes Kerdi, which may be eaiser in some ways, and is maybe less prone to install errors. Noble makes some that work well, too.

[jimbo]

I would check over with the tile guys at this forum: www.johnbridge.com, to see if redguard by itself is can be the waterproof foundation on walls or floors, in lieu of cement board on walls, and vinyl liner or copper pan on floor.

[jadnashua]

REdgard is an approved substance to build the liner of a pan with. Most of the pros prefer Latticrete's version which requires embedding fiberglass reinforcement bands on the corners. The procedure is described on www.custombuildingproducts.com website. Most of the pros don't particularly like it - they prefer a traditional liner, a sheet surface membrane like Kerdi, or to just use the Redgard as a wall, niche, surface waterproofer and do the pan normally. When you are painting/rolling the stuff on, it is really hard to know when you've built up the required thickness so it will work properly. Too thick and you've got stability problems, too thin, and it is just too easy to breech it.

[worrywell]

Question applying Redgard. After I apply the Redgard it to all shower walls and floor, do I have to apply a coat of cement on top of the redgard or can I start tiling with my mortar?

Thanks!

[jadnashua]

Once the Redgard has dried/cured, it is designed to have the thinset and tile applied directly. Suggest you go to their website and read the installation instructions...you'll want to follow all of the proper steps to make the system waterproof.

It's been awhile since I read them, but I think they intend the pan liner to be done in a similar manner as if you had used a sheet liner. Double-check...if this is true, there is a preslope, Redgard, then the final setting bed, then the thinset and tile. I'm not sure it is designed for direct placement on the pan for tile. In other words, on the floor (as opposed to the walls), I'm not sure if it is intended to be tiled over directly. Normally, you'd use a clamping drain with weep holes that allow the moisture that gets under the tile and grout to flow down to the waterproof membrane, and out the weep holes.

The only systems I'm familiar with that have the waterproofing right underneath the tile is Wedi, and Kerdi. There may be others, double-check the installation instructions for Redgard. I loaned my TCNA spec out, and can't look it up, but the www.custombuildingproducts.com website should have their installation instructions on it.

[johnfrwhipple]

I have never done any shower pans before with Custom's RedGuard. I prefer working with Ardex 8+9, Kerdi DS or Noble Seal TS.


Red Guard by dranney, on Flickr

Here is a good example of a Red Guard installation on Flickr. You can see the Wonder Board (Cement Board) has been installed correctly and the seams taped with most likely a mesh and thin-set. It also appears that the bottom of the wonderboard has been Kerdi-Fixed or Siliconed.

JW

[jadnashua]

John, John, John, this thread is 3-years old...

[johnfrwhipple]

John, John, John, this thread is 3-years old...

Is it? All this time and no new information. Glad I could help out.

[geniescience]

Great information. I think that there have been millions of showers built with liquid applied membranes. On the internet, it appears to be quite the opposite. (and that smells fishy.) I am glad that someone who has built more than a handful of showers has posted a few more details.

[johnfrwhipple]

If your Walk In Shower is barrier free you might consider working with products like Kerdi, Noble and Ardex. All allow for easy temporary dam construction.
JW

[jadnashua]

I'm by no means against a good liquid waterproofing system - they work, and work well. There's a big BUT in there, though. Many first-timers do NOT get the required thickness, and if you aren't careful, you can have a pinhole leak. that's a lot harder with a sheet membrane. And, the stuff is fragile until it is covered and accumulates dirt if it sits very long that's hard to clean off. I just think that there is more redundency with the overlap on a sheet membrane. Now, if you've done many, a good liquid applied membrane is fine, but I'd rather use something other than RedGard, but that would work if you follow the instructions (important for ANY system!) and reliably get the proper thickness with no voids or pinholes.

[geniescience]

it's not fair, to point out fine grained details that you have heard or read somewhere. It would be easy for me to build counter arguments that make people doubt the orange sheet membrane. Very easy.

[johnfrwhipple]

"...There's a big But in there..."

LOL

[johnfrwhipple]

Here is a tub to shower renovation where Hydro Ban was used with a standard CanPlas three piece clamping drain. I'm going to install a linear drain over this rough in and make this shower a one way slope. Left to Right. Over the low profile curb will be a fixed glass panel and single door.