Tired of Rheem Ecosense, need suggestions for new tankless

[springboard]

I've had a Rheem tankless for 3 years and it has never performed well. Bath water would need to be turned on to get kitchen sink to get hot water. I've run the gamut with Rheem and their local choice for plumber (he wanted to sell me something different and wouldn't do any work on the Rheem). I've cleaned it, replaced what I could, and it still doesn't heat consistently.

I'm not new to tankless heaters. I ran Palomas in the 80s and 90s, no electricity and they worked great. I know the downsides.

Here's my question: I'd like to get a tankless without bells and whistles, preferably no electric parts, and can run a household with four teenagers. Our Rheem is outside and I would need the new one to be there also. Price is not the objective, though a good quality heater at a good price would be great! Any suggestions?

[lifespeed]

I just installed a Noritz NRC-1111DVNG tankless. It will start up even at low flows, like a half-on bathroom faucet. It is specified to operate at outputs as low as 16,000 BTU, less than any other brand.

I have never tried other brands so can't offer a comparison.

[tarjan]

The rinnai rc98i shows .4gpm and 9600btu as minimum.
http://www.rinnai.us/tankless-water-...ka3237ffud-us/ click on specs

The newest ecosense rheem shows .4gpm to start but can drop to .26gpm to continue. 11kbtu minimum draw
http://www.rheem.com/product/condens...ct-vent-indoor

The nrc-111 natural gas is also 11k btu as per the web page, but the owners manual lists 16k and .5gpm. One of the two is wrong, probably the manual that was written a while ago and never updated to take into account updates in the hardware.

So I think any of the new condensing top of the line units would do it? They all have outdoor versions though I linked the indoor ones.

[springboard]

Thanks for the reply. From looking around at specs and performance, it looks like Rinnai and Noritz will probably be my best bet. Simple would be best but I haven't seen large ones without a lot of electronics.

[Dana]

Takagi's outdoor units aren't bad either. The vendor with better local support in terms of local factory-certified installers and proximity to distributors is probably more important factor in choosing a manufacturer.

In Oakland OR it gets cold enough that you could run into freeze damage issues on clear cold night should you ever lose power during sub-freezing temp. Most have resistance electric freeze protection. The thermal mass is low, and the heat exchanger works both ways- it doesn't take sub-zero weather to destroy the heat exchanger if the power goes out- a light wind at 28F can do it. Building an air-tight & insulated bump-out to accomodate an indoor-unit might be a better way to go long term.

[springboard]

Thanks, I haven't looked at the Takagis yet. You're right about looking at local support. The Rinnai local installer is the same outfit I was disappointed with on my Rheem and I'm not looking forward to using them again.

I hadn't thought of building an insulated bump-out to use an indoor unit. It is probably better long-term and increases my selection possibilities. Is there a price difference in ext/int heaters?

[tarjan]

A few days or so ago I tried to reply but included a few links so it is in the process of being moderated. That being said, take a look at all of the top of the line units by any of the manufacturers. They all have between 9600 and 15kbtu minimums (including the 111 mentioned, the manual has one number and the brochures another, I think the manual was printed a while ago so your unit is better than you assumed ) not to mention rheem's condensing units are up there with similar specs as well. Which one do you specifically have? Do you have the specs for it?

I think it is probably best to get into detail on what is going on vs just throwing a new unit at the problem, though it may be the best solution. Does the Rheem have any sort of mechanism to show what it believes is the flow rate? You could try to compare the estimated flow rate to the actual flow out of the kitchen sink. Just turn on the tap to hot only, see what it says the flow is and while that is going get a bucket with a known size (a gallon or so) and time how long it takes to fill.

If you get 1gpm out of your tap but the unit only shows .5gpm, then the problem is probably the sensor or circuit board.

If it is the same you might want to check to see what temperature it thinks the water is. If the sensor there is bad it could make it go wonky.