(206) 949-5683, Top Rated Plumber, Seattle
Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst 123456789 LastLast
Results 106 to 120 of 124

Thread: Do I need a softener?

  1. #106
    In the Trades Tom Sawyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Maine
    Posts
    2,942

    Default

    The proprietary systems we sell that are using the Clask WS1 valve come through with a grid but we get systems from another supplier, typically using Fleck heads that do not. It makes ZERO difference in the cleanliness of the brine tank on way or the other. In fact, I can't see where grid or no grid makes any difference at all
    [B]No, plumbing ain't rocket science. Unlike rocket science, plumbing requires a license[B]

  2. #107
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    In the interest of fairness to other valve makers... is there a Clack valve that would be equivalent (or better) than the 7000SXT?

  3. #108
    Water systems designer, R&D ditttohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,707
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by F6Hawk View Post
    In the interest of fairness to other valve makers... is there a Clack valve that would be equivalent (or better) than the 7000SXT?
    Yes, the WS1 or the ws125 are a great match up to the 7000SXT. Both valves have a few flaws, and a few advantages over eachother but if a person has either one, then they have one of the best valves available. Ultra high flowing, larger manifold assembly, excellent bypass designs, highly accurate and inexpensive meters, optical sequencing, etc.

    Really a Ford Vs. Chevy argument that could never be won by either side.

    Regarding bridging and potassium, it can be almost eliminated in two ways, keep the tamperature constant, or as close as possible, or do a brine fill first programming and you will rarely have a bridging issue.

    25 ounces of potassium chloride will dissolve in one gallon of water at 50 degrees Fahrenheit.

    28 ounces at 60 degrees Fahrenheit, this is over a 10% increase with a 10 degree temperature change. Not too bad if that is the only change. Now in AZ where the system is installed in the garage, a night time temperature of 60 degrees, and a daytime temperature of over 110 is not unusual. A 50 degre temperature change causes a massive difference in the amount of potassium dissolved in the water, when the temperature drops, the salts precipitate out of solution and cause the caking (bridging) issue that we are all so fimiliar with. Salt manufacturers have even sent out bulletins about this with suggestions of putting the brine tank off the floor, wrapping the brine tank (like a water heater jacket) etc. All of these solutions do little in these extremes.

    Potassium Cloride based units will rarely bridge if the Brine fill first, or regulated temperature brine tank installation is followed, if not, then it is more likely to bridge.

  4. #109
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Well, I plan on using NaCl, no Potato Chloride here. And not sure if it will help with bridging at all, but I also plan on adding an insulating jacket, due to the cold temps of winter water.

  5. #110
    In the Trades Tom Sawyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Maine
    Posts
    2,942

    Default

    Cold won't bother the salt, it's the humidity that can cause problems.
    [B]No, plumbing ain't rocket science. Unlike rocket science, plumbing requires a license[B]

  6. #111
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Werd. But after a cold brine fill in a warm house, I figgered that would attract/cause moisture.

  7. #112
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Here's my settings now that I have it all installed:

    DF set to Gal
    VT set to dF2b
    CT set to Fd
    C Set to 36.0
    H set to 10
    RS set to SF (But I would like to learn of the benefits of Fixed Reserve Capacity or Variable Reserve)
    sf set to 10
    DO set 21
    RT set to 2:00
    B1 set to 10
    BD set to 60
    B2 set to 5
    RR set to 10
    BF set to 12 (default), but I think it SHOULD be 32, based on BLFC of 0.125?
    FM set to t1.2

    If I understand correctly, the SF is setting the "lead time" for the regen, basically allowing soft water to be had until 0200 the next day after total calculated gallons have been used, is this correct? What about the other settings, Fixed Reserve Capacity or Variable Reserve? Is there a benefit to be realized by using either of these settings instead?

    How do I determine my DLFC?

  8. #113
    Water systems designer, R&D ditttohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,707
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    I am heading off to hockey, so I will answer the more complex questions tomorrow. You are correct in setting your BF to 32, If you water is clear, then set your B1 to 5 minutes, and your RR can also be set to 5 minutes.
    DLFC, remove the grey clip that holds the 90 degree drain line adapter in, and remove the fitting. Inside is a rubber button with a hole in the middle. You should see numbers. Thos number correspond to the flow. 120 = 1.2, 240 = 2.4 350 = 3.5, and so on. Assuming you have a 10" tank and normal temp water, you should have a 2.4 gpm button.

  9. #114
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Yes, it is a 2.4 button. And yes, a 10" tank, but water temps are lower here. How will that figure in?

  10. #115
    Water systems designer, R&D ditttohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,707
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    The viscosity of water changes with water temperature. Cold water will backwash resin more than warm water will. A top screen should be installed in locations where water temperatures vary considerably. See the attached chart for more detailed information. Many companies do not use a top screen, but if very cold water is the norm, a smaller DLFC button and a top screen may be in order.

    Name:  temp.jpg
Views: 89
Size:  44.6 KB

  11. #116
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    Just ran the tap to see... it came out initially at 70, 30 seconds later, it hit 90, then back to 70 at about 60 seconds. Let it run another minute, and it steadily crept down to 49~50.

    The 70 makes sense, cuz the house stays between 65-70. I have NO idea how it hit 90. That has never happened before. The cold water always comes out cold, and gets colder, period.

    Back in mid-March http://www.terrylove.com/forums/show...l=1#post338267, it was as cold as 42. Based on this, should I reduce my backwash times, or change the DLFC? And as for adding a screen, how to do that? Is it flexible, and can it be slipped down over the tube in the tank?

  12. #117
    Water systems designer, R&D ditttohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,707
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    If your temperature is 42 degrees, I would change the DLFC to a 2.0 GPM. A top screen will simply lock into the valve. If you unscrew the valve, you would simply twist to lock the screen onto the head. This will slip over the riser tube.

    Do not shorten the backwash time to correct cold water issues, this will not work, it is a matter of bed expension.

    Without a top screen, a lot of people check their resin tanks a few years later and notice that a lot of resing is simply missing. They start to get hard water before the system regenerates, and then they call a service tech.

    Regarding the 90 degree water, does your plumbing go through the attic? Attics out here can get well over 120 degrees on a nice day.

  13. #118
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    No, the water comes in from the crawlspace, down into my basement (currently at 55) where the softener is, then up from there to the first and second floors. In the past, I typically got room temp water for 30-60 seconds, and it progressively got colder. Last night was the first time since I have lived here that I noticed a warming followed by cooler temps. It is weird. I DID take a bath prior to that, and am thinking perhaps the cold water pipe is under the tub prior to going into the sink, and the radiant heat form the tub warmed the pipe. That is all I can think of.

  14. #119
    Water systems designer, R&D ditttohead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,707
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    There are some excellent plumbers on this forum, maybe they know what can cause this. I am stumped about the rise to 90 degrees, but your conclusion makes some sense. The common causes of temperature rise will keep the water at an elevated temperature.

    I was at a major hotel chain a few months ago doing a survey walk for some water treamtent for a company we supply. A lady cam out of the bathroom and asked if we worked there or had anything to do with the water. She then started telling us in detail about how she almost burned herself when she sat on the toilet, the water was steaming hot in the toilet! It was over 140 degrees, needless to say we found the problem quite easily but the panicked look on her face... she acted like she had never seen a toilet with hot water before.

  15. #120
    DIY Senior Member F6Hawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Default

    I'm assuming you are not talking about 17.............................1.................. ............18280................................. . Collector, Top, 1" x .011, Gray from the service manual, but a larger-diameter, finer mesh screen? Any idea if it has a part number? Google and I can't seem to find one.

    Thanks!

Similar Threads

  1. Softener ID
    By Pclark in forum Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and reviews
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-23-2011, 05:59 PM
  2. Softener Outside
    By Oros95 in forum Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and reviews
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 03-11-2010, 03:06 PM
  3. Can you ID this softener?
    By brewrevm in forum Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 04-24-2009, 11:05 AM
  4. Can you ID this softener?
    By brewrevm in forum Water Softener Forum, problems, installation and reviews
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-23-2009, 11:59 AM
  5. Can you ID this softener?
    By brewrevm in forum Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-23-2009, 11:59 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •