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Thread: Refrigerator is Hot - 120 Volts at Handle

  1. #16
    General Engineering Contractor ballvalve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    I agree, Could be the oven also.

    I like to use one of these when troubleshooting.


    Attachment 15283
    Thats a harbor fright $1.99 tester, but they actually work, though not likely safely. I regret to admit I have several spread about in odd places where one need not hunt for the 'real' one.

  2. #17
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballvalve View Post
    Thats a harbor fright $1.99 tester, but they actually work, though not likely safely. I regret to admit I have several spread about in odd places where one need not hunt for the 'real' one.
    Can't afford to buy new batteries for that price.

    A Cat II is fine for around the house.

    You don't even have to stand on them spare tires.
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  3. #18
    DIY Senior Member Rich B's Avatar
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    "If the HOT was wired to the wrong side of the outlet and the fridge has the neutral bonded to the metal body with a polarized type plug....you would get shocked when you touched something else that is grounded....."

    I really should have said COULD get shocked not WOULD get shocked.



    I quoted myself from an earlier post......Thats why they pay me the big bucks.....LOL


    I just had another machine in my shop.....a welder. A 3 phase male plug on it and it was a single phase machine. They used one of the normally hot terminals in the plug for the ground. I am sure the recepticle it is plugged into is wired to make it work but if by chance the machine was plugged into the same type recepticle that really was wired to supply 3 phase power the machines metal parts would all have been energized and shock anyone who came in contact with it and a ground. The last thing I do when completing a machine repair is check the input cord and plug. Most times I have to disconnect that cord to connect my house power as there are too many variations. I have 2 different 230 3 phase supplies I can use for testing machines......
    Last edited by Rich B; 01-31-2012 at 07:49 AM.

  4. #19
    DIY Senior Member Homeownerinburb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molo View Post
    Final Determination:

    The electrician used a single strand of 12-2 wire and pushed the end (stripped of it's insulation into the ground opening on the GFCI outlet. He then used his multi-meter to check the voltage at each opening of the outlet. The multi-meter showed voltage at the wrong side of the outlet.

    Bill
    That is both dicey and an unnecessary risk. Better practice surely is to plug a proper extension cord such that you would run a power tool on, into the questionable outlet, then take the female end to an outlet that you know to be properly wired. Then one uses a proper multi meter with probes into the various slots (carefully!).

  5. #20
    DIY Senior Member kreemoweet's Avatar
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    @molo: So what did the electrician do about the energized fridge? The reverse polarity at the plug should not
    cause anyone to get shocked , because the fridge should not be connected to either of the conducters. If you
    don't fix that, you still have a hazard.

  6. #21
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
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    If the ground was connected properly then you should not get shocked even if the AC polarity was reversed.


    Did you get it wired correctly ?
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  7. #22
    DIY Senior Member BobL43's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    If the ground was connected properly then you should not get shocked even if the AC polarity was reversed.


    Did you get it wired correctly ?
    It may have been just capacitance building up voltage on the fridge's frame without any real conductance, or, on the other hand, a leakage current from the circuits in the fridge and enough to give a good tingle or more; still, can't be too safe without a gound to drain it away or trip a breaker if it was a real short to the frame from the hot.
    I am definitely not a pro plumber, but I am a pro crastinator

  8. #23
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
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    I would have expected it to pop the breaker, just as soon as plugged in. Or it has no Proper Ground.

    I think there is more to this picture.

    I have some Popcorn.
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  9. #24
    DIY Senior Member molo's Avatar
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    The electrician rewired the outlet. There is no ground wire and the wire is two insulated wires wrapped in a rubber/plastic type coating.
    "Any American who is prepared to run for President should automatically, by definition, be disqualified from ever doing so."
    Gore Vidal.

  10. #25
    DIY Senior Member BobL43's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molo View Post
    The electrician rewired the outlet. There is no ground wire and the wire is two insulated wires wrapped in a rubber/plastic type coating.
    Kleenex
    I am definitely not a pro plumber, but I am a pro crastinator

  11. #26
    General Engineering Contractor ballvalve's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ballvalve

    Thats a harbor fright $1.99 tester, but they actually work, though not likely safely. I regret to admit I have several spread about in odd places where one need not hunt for the 'real' one.
    Can't afford to buy new batteries for that price.

    A Cat II is fine for around the house.

    You don't even have to stand on them spare tires.
    Whats terrifying is that they came WITH a battery and actually work.

  12. #27
    DIY Senior Member BobL43's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ballvalve View Post
    Originally Posted by ballvalve




    Whats terrifying is that they came WITH a battery and actually work.
    Man you got that right!
    I am definitely not a pro plumber, but I am a pro crastinator

  13. #28
    DIY Senior Member Homeownerinburb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molo View Post
    The electrician rewired the outlet. There is no ground wire and the wire is two insulated wires wrapped in a rubber/plastic type coating.
    Ah. Old non-metalic cable without a ground. I found a bit of that in a house in Pasadena. I think the wire dated to the '40s or early 50's, to judge from the other elements that I saw.

    There was a good bit of knob and tube in the house as well. Apparently there is quite a bit of that left in Pasadena and the towns around it. A real pain when combined with lath and plaster.

  14. #29
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobL43 View Post
    It may have been just capacitance building up voltage on the fridge's frame without any real conductance, or, on the other hand, a leakage current from the circuits in the fridge and enough to give a good tingle or more; still, can't be too safe without a gound to drain it away or trip a breaker if it was a real short to the frame from the hot.
    Sounds like you were correct Bob.

    If there is no ground connection in the box then you would be measuring the device leakage.
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  15. #30
    DIY Senior Member BobL43's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    Sounds like you were correct Bob.If there is no ground connection in the box then you would be measuring the device leakage.
    Oh, how shocking! Thanks Don
    I am definitely not a pro plumber, but I am a pro crastinator

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