(206) 949-5683, Top Rated Plumber, Seattle
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 41 of 41

Thread: Troubleshooting Well Pump Electric

  1. #31
    DIY Member CHOLLA BOB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    64

    Default

    Tone Generator: I had imagined some Tesla resonant frequency. Will leave the audio tone generator in storage.

    Neutral 10ga Wire: no neutral with the 240 water pump as had been stated. At the main breaker box, the ground is a white wire which runs into UF to the pressure switch ground terminals. It should be a green wire coming from the bonded ground buss bar. I had that moment of doubt at the Depot: green or white? Bought green.

    I bought a Harbor Freight disposable amp meter and if I get this pump running soon, I will test current through water pump wires. The electrician had said to replace the 240 2-pole 20 amp breaker with a 240 2-pole 30 amp. Everyone on the forums disagrees: stay with the 20 amp unless wiring a sub-panel. DonL started to figure out the possible amp draw. The drillers of this well (1970's) are out of business. I guess the only way to tell is with the amp meter/probe. I did not want to put a higher amp breaker in as it will give the pump more time to get damaged by any remaining or future problem.

  2. #32
    DIY Senior Member Chad Schloss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    327

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    I think if I was a kid and was digging and started finding toys, I would keep digging deeper, To see what other treasures I could find.

    As kids we made the 10 foot snow drifts into Hideouts. Sometimes they collapsed when it warmed up.

    Sounds like You made good progress.
    we would dig tunnels underground in the old burned down vacant lots when I lived in Detroit when I was a kid. must have been 4 to 6 ft deep and at least as long. perfect hideaway.

  3. #33
    Porky Cutter,MGWC Porky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Virginia Beach, VA
    Posts
    727

    Default

    It's simple, either you have a defective component to the pump control box or a short somewhere. Most electricians don't know how to trouble shoot submersible pumps. I'd disconnect all power then dicconnect the wires at the well head, then check each wires resistance to ground with a high reading Ohm meter. If you have any reading you have a short. If there is no short there, check each wire to ground with a high reading Ohm meter. If you get a reading you have a short in the drop cable, the splice near the pump motor or the motor it's self. Replace the component that has a reading to ground and everything should work normal again.
    Porky Cutter, MGWC
    (Master Ground Water Consultant)

  4. #34
    DIY Member CHOLLA BOB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    64

    Default

    With the control box face off (no connection to pressure switch), both the electrician and I had audio continuity readings indicating a short below. When I did resistance, meter was reading 11.5 to 15 ohms resistance in the three pump wires. The electrician thought the pump was shorted, but after his test, set the main breaker on and everything ran. Breaker flipped off a few hours latter. It would stay on in frozen ground and not stay on in thawed, wet ground. When the breaker tripped with the underground line disconnected, I assumed it was the line or the main breaker. There could be multiple problems. I stopped turning on the breaker a week ago in the hopes of not exposing the pump to anymore shorts. By the time this is over, I would not be surprised to lose 4 grand to pull and replace that pump, but hoping I get to a less expensive problem first.

    I was wondering if the audio continuity was from the Franklin box itself. The Franklin box has not been troubleshooted with relay and capacitor testing. I was trying to get the pump wires disconnected from the Franklin terminals for a better test when the electrician arrived. From Porky's post, it sounds like I have a short in the drop wire or pump or the control box. If the pump has to be pulled with a well service, I do want all these other issues resolved to protect the new pump. I am even thinking about getting a surge protector as country electric is dirty with spikes and surges.
    Last edited by CHOLLA BOB; 12-23-2011 at 03:42 PM.

  5. #35
    General Engineering Contractor ballvalve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    northfork, california
    Posts
    3,261

    Default

    Why scare the guy. He said the breaker tripped with the pump DISCONNECTED. that leaves the pump OUT.

    Right, electricians dont know squat about pumps. so go to the Franklin AIM manual online and get your drop wire readings parameters. In the mean time get some good wires to the pump and report back.

  6. #36
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    3,662

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CHOLLA BOB View Post
    With the control box face off (no connection to pressure switch), both the electrician and I had audio continuity readings indicating a short below. When I did resistance, meter was reading 11.5 to 15 ohms resistance in the three pump wires. The electrician thought the pump was shorted.

    That is a shame, You would think that a Electrician would know how a motor should read.

    I would not call that shorted.
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  7. #37
    General Engineering Contractor ballvalve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    northfork, california
    Posts
    3,261

    Default

    And speaking of getting water, I would have rolled out a piece of NM any flavor cable onthe ground and had the pump running in 10 minutes. Do the detail and dirt work later.

    I have 160' of interior NM 14g cable laying on the ground for 9 years now, sending 9 volts thru it with a old cell pnone charger. The valve it actuates via a float is rated for 24 volts, but works fine on the 4 or 6 that make it back. So much for "thwm water resistant" cable!

  8. #38
    Jack of all trades DonL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    3,662

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ballvalve View Post
    And speaking of getting water, I would have rolled out a piece of NM any flavor cable onthe ground and had the pump running in 10 minutes. Do the detail and dirt work later.

    I have 160' of interior NM 14g cable laying on the ground for 9 years now, sending 9 volts thru it with a old cell pnone charger. The valve it actuates via a float is rated for 24 volts, but works fine on the 4 or 6 that make it back. So much for "thwm water resistant" cable!

    Sounds like fun. I would have ran a 600 V extension cord, or had the generator connected to that bad boy.

    He must have a very pleasant wife.


    I Love it when a plan comes together, If it meets code or not...
    Theory only works perfect in a vacuum.

    Cyber Security Protection for Windows C:\ > WWW.WinForce.Net

  9. #39
    DIY Member CHOLLA BOB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    64

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DonL View Post
    Sounds like fun. I would have ran a 600 V extension cord, or had the generator connected to that bad boy. He must have a very pleasant wife. I Love it when a plan comes together, If it meets code or not...
    Thanks! I shutdown for Christmas as I was shortchanging the holiday. Running a cord or surface UF line has been an idea since the beginning. I have my conduit/wire ready to go and could have done a temp splice, but if the pump is dead, I sure didn't want to know for this weekend. Once you get used to no water and get a system going, it isn't so bad. But I am half dust bowl Okie. The wife has been good about this, even though her nickname at work is Nasty. Will run conduit tomorrow and electrician probably for Friday. H A P P Y H O L I D A Y S ! ! !

  10. #40
    DIY Member CHOLLA BOB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    64

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chad Schloss View Post
    we would dig tunnels underground in the old burned down vacant lots when I lived in Detroit when I was a kid. must have been 4 to 6 ft deep and at least as long. perfect hideaway.
    I lived in a war zone in Brooklyn, but digging bunkers in Detroit; that is something.

  11. #41
    DIY Member CHOLLA BOB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Mexico
    Posts
    64

    Default

    Followup: Well running again. Electrician hooked up underground wire in conduit and everything is fine again. A short in the underground UF line had caused the problem. Thanked everybody on the electrical thread covering this: http://www.terrylove.com/forums/show...s&goto=newpost

    When the electrician was getting ready to leave, the water still was not running. I asked about taking a readings on the relay and capacitor of the Franklin Control box, and when opened, we noticed that the plastic/brass wire terminal was knocked out of alignment with the lid contact teeth (had happened that day). With alignment, the water was running in five minutes.

    Appreciate the help as this made the new year! Thanks.

Similar Threads

  1. Electric Wire Size for Submersible Pump
    By lray882 in forum Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-06-2011, 10:08 AM
  2. electric heat pump in cold climate?
    By flatlander dave in forum HVAC Heating & Cooling
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 06-13-2009, 08:08 AM
  3. Well Pump electric use skyrocketing
    By scottvalley in forum Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 09-24-2007, 06:38 AM
  4. troubleshooting a electric water heater
    By Peevee in forum Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Tips & Tricks
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-03-2007, 08:02 PM
  5. converting electric to hand pump
    By DavidL in forum Pumps and Tanks Well Forum & Blog
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 03-31-2006, 07:07 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •