Salt dose...?

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Wally107

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Wally, When I read your post earlier you memtioned about not changing the BLFC from the .125 you currently have in it to a .5. Now I don't see it. What happened?

Sorry mialynette, I probably should have carried this over from my other thread. I was emailing back and forth with Wayne at Pentair...here's my question(s) and his replys (in italics):

Question: Brand new 7000SXT. Came equipped with .125gpm BLFC. Any problem
changing it to .5 or 1.0 BLFC (to shorten BF and therefore overall regen time)?

Yes, the refill rate is based on injector size due to this unit refills the
brine tank with soft water back through the injector orifice size. Your unit is
giving you treated water after rapid rinse, not refill. Nor does it need to be
back in service before you have treated water. You have until the next regen to
have that brine tank refilled.


Ref the .125gpm BLFC: I should NOT change it, since it is correlated (my word)
to the injector...i.e. change one, change both (prob more work than it's worth.
Correct?

No, but the injector size is critical to the performance of the system.

To be honest, I'm still a little fuzzy on whether there's a correlation between the BLFC and the injector. But regardless, Wayne's point is...the .125gpm is fine. I just figure 8 minutes per gallon instead of 2 minutes. IOW...8 minutes to dissolve 3 lbs of salt, instead of 2. And as he points out, the system begins flowing soft water after the rapid rinse, so who cares how long the brine fill takes? As long as I do the math right, it's same same.
 

Tom Sawyer

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You are probably pretty close in your estimate then. If you have been talking to Wayne you have been talking to the right guy. I think you have it pretty well sorted out now.
 

Gary Slusser

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I guess you agree with the 36 lbs in a 2.0 cuft getting 64K. I'd like to see a resin manufacturer's spec sheet to prove that. 15lbs/cuft = 30lbs for 60K regenerated capacity with 2.0 cuft of regular mesh resin.

And I disagree with his suggesting 48K requiring 16 lbs when Wally is setting the valve for variable reserve which only requires 33600 or 34K using 11.5 lbs; a savings of 4.5 lbs every regeneration. Or 202.5 lbs more per year.

Wally, you may want to ask him why 48K when you don't need it. You don't add a days worth of reserve with variable reserve valves.

I'd go with salt efficiency of 3333 grains/lb (34K @ 11.5 lbs) and 8 minutes backwash, 45 mins brine draw/slow rinse. That increases water use efficiency. I've sold many hundreds of softeners with those settings and I don't hear of any problems from those customers. And since all were sold due to my posts in forums, I'm sure if there were problems they'd be posted in the same forums. They would also be posted on my own forum and there aren't any there or on other forums.
 

Wally107

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I just want to thank each of you for keeping this a civil and respectful debate. We all know how these forums often degrade into mud-slinging urination contests. Thankfully, you all have kept this thread from going that way.

Gary - I agree with your thoughts on water efficiency, so I'll go with your setup. If I have any issues, I'll be sure to let you know.

Thanx again to all - Wally
 

Wally107

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Before I post this, a little disclosure: I purchased my system from qualitywaterforless.com. I did NOT consult them prior for any sizing assistance, recommendations, etc. My purchase was based solely on info obtained BY ME from several sources (forums, friends, etc.) Price was in line with what other on-line vendors were offering, and shipment was quick and problem-free.

I just wanted to share an email exchange between me and Todd @ QWFL. For brevity, I edited my portion, but left his as is (in italics). Essentially, I was sharing my programming with him to get his input, and I asked him about Reserve Selection:
=====================================================================

7000SXT 64K 2 cuft resin

Use: 300 gal per day X 14 gpg hardness = 4200 grains per day

I'd like to use 8 days between regen (DO=8) 8 X 4200 = 33600 + 1 day reserve = 37800 to regen

I currently have it set as:

Capacity: 40000
DO: 8 days
B1: 8 minutes
BD: 45 minutes
B2: 5 minutes
RR: 5 minutes
BF: 31 minutes - which gets me close to the 12lbs salt dose I want

Also, is there a reason you prefer a Safety Factor of 10% - versus a Fixed Reserve of 300 gal (1 day) - or using the Variable Reserve? It seems the Variable Reserve is pretty goof-proof - just curious.

Up the day overide to 21. The settings are fine. You have a 64,000gr. not a 40,000. Set it however you want. Brine fill is too high, set it at @ 12 minutes. The safety factor versus fixed reserve. Coke & Pepsi Ford and Chevy. It does'nt really matter.

=====================================================================

I'm trying very hard not to sound cocky, because I realize I'm very, very new to this...but:

"Up the day overide to 21." Doesn't this set me up for possible channeling, and overall poor resin health?

"You have a 64,000gr. not a 40,000." Even though it's a 64K (60K) system, right now I'm only using approx 40K, from a "reserve" perspective, isn't it better to use a Capacity of 40K?

"Brine fill is too high, set it at @ 12 minutes." This really has me confused. Is my math right:

12 minutes / 8 minutes per gallon X 3lbs salt per gallon (4.5 lbs salt) X 3333 grains = 14999 grains regen'd?

"The safety factor versus fixed reserve. Coke & Pepsi Ford and Chevy. It does'nt really matter." Hmmmm....

Again, I don't want to cast any aspersions against QWFL, nor deter anyone from purchasing from them. Nonetheless, some of this is radically different from what I (think) I've learned so far.
 
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Mialynette2003

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Wally, You'll drive yourself crazy going back and forth. With softening, everyone has there own ways. Water is always different so what works for me may not work for others. Notice the 60K in ()? I was taught that 1 cf has 30K not 32K. So your 2 cf unit has 60K and not 64K. If I were you, I would but a soap test kit and test the water before a regen, If it maintained soft water until a regen, leave it.
 

Wally107

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mialynette - I concur.

Y'all have taught me enough (I think) about salt dose, capacity, etc., that I feel my current settings are going to get me near the "target". And as you suggested, I'll have test kit in hand before the next regen to "fine tune" it.

I'll consider this thread closed. However, I do want to start a new one regarding "variable brining". It seems like such a useful tool, but there's very little discussion of it.

Thanx again to all!
 

Tom Sawyer

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I was going to give you an explanation of variable brining and then I remembered this from awhile back. It's a pretty good synopsis of what variable brining is all about and how the Fleck 7000 handles it.

http://www.catalystsystems.org/?p=96

Personally, I'm not sure just how much money variable brining is going to save you especially when you figure in the added equipment cost but to be honest I sell the stuff, and install the stuff and tend to believe what my distributor tells me about the stuff and unless I have a customer complaining about the stuff I rarely see it again. I suppose I could try keeping track of selected customers salt use and such but.....that's a lot of work and the figures may be skewed also and since they are happy, why open that can o worms.
 
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