Shut off valve question

jaheinzel · Jan 2, 2011

I have an old shut off valve in my system and I'm not exactly sure how it works and don't want to force something the wrong way and break it. This is a picture of the front and back of the valve. The back side is threaded and the front looks like it can be turned, but I think you have to do something with the nut on the back before turning. Any help would be great.

Cacher_Chick · Jan 2, 2011

The side you listed as "front" needs to be rotated 90 degrees to turn it on.

With an old valve like that, there is a chance that it will leak after being moved for the first time in 40 years, so you need to be prepared to shut off the gas at the meter to replace the valve.

Sponsor · 2022-01-29T12:20:58-0800

jaheinzel · Jan 2, 2011

So what about the nut on the "back"? I thought I heard someone say something about both sides needing to be turned, but I could be wrong.

Dlarrivee · Jan 2, 2011

jheinzel said:
So what about the nut on the "back"? I thought I heard someone say something about both sides needing to be turned, but I could be wrong.

Leave the nut on the back alone.

Whoever said you needed to mess with it, surely isn't a gas-fitter.

Cacher_Chick · Jan 2, 2011

Both sides must turn together, as it is all one piece. The valve bore is tapered. If it is stuck, loosen the nut a 1/2 turn and tap on it to help release the tapered fit. Snug it back up after you have moved it.

jaheinzel · Jan 2, 2011

Thanks I'll give it a try and let you know how it goes. Sorry dlarrivee, this is for my boiler's water lines, not gas, probably should have said that.

jaheinzel · Jan 2, 2011

Worked great thanks!

Dlarrivee · Jan 2, 2011

I guess I'm too young to recognize that as a water line...

hj · Jan 2, 2011

THAT valve is NOT and had NEVER BEEN a "water" valve. It is strictly a gas valve. Water valves would NEVER have been made of cast iron like that one it, nor would any REAL plumber have used cast iron fittings on the lines. You have a "hack job" done by some DIY or handyman who used whatever he had in his miscellaneous basket at the time.

Dlarrivee · Jan 2, 2011

What are your thoughts on backing that nut off when the valve is being used in gas service (proper install)?

jaheinzel · Jan 2, 2011

Well I can agree that there are plenty of "hack jobs" on this house. It's 102 years old and has only had two owners, the builder and his daughter. That "shutoff" is right between and elbow and a union. I could always pull it and replace it. The reason I'm not thinking of doing that is the whole system is probably going to be replaced in the next couple of years anyway.

Gary Swart · Jan 2, 2011

Still wouldn't be a bad idea to put in a 1/4 turn ball valve. It wouldn't cost much and could be reused if you do replumb the house in a couple of years.

hj · Jan 3, 2011

When used in gas service, those valves typically leak after being operated, because they depend on a layer of grease between the body and plug for sealing, and that grease often "disappears" after a number of years. If the valve does NOT turn, then loosening the nut should free it up, but it should be retightened, AND the valve tested for leakage, after it is rotated, NOT just after it is turned on again. In this case, it is probably something the builder did because he KNEW that "anyone can do plumbing".

Ian Gills · Jan 3, 2011

Most people can do some plumbing.

That valve is sure in much better shape than the one outside on my gas meter.

Ballvalve · Jan 3, 2011

Those are ductile iron fittings, and black nipples, likely ductile. And if its that old, the valve was very likely intended for water use also. Especially with the bronze portion.

Ballvalves depend on plastic seals, and that valve depends on a machined taper. Its not much different than a gate valve, which also closes on a taper. This one is simply round, not flat. It's a beauty and I would not change it.

I don't think this is a hack, but a pro job - check out the link on ductile nipples:

http://www.harcofittings.com/products/Ductile Iron IPS/PF110-ADINipples.pdf

Ductile can replace brass! Few are aware of this and they see a black pipe in a drinking water or boiler system, and start ripping it out. Sad.

Rich B · Jan 3, 2011

As usual HJ is right on the money here. I shut off my gas furnace's supply valve just like the one pictured and when I turned it back on and ran the furnace I smelled gas. Got some bubble solution and found the leak at the valve. They do use grease as a packing. I replaced it with a sealed gas ball valve and I believe that is what is required under current code. I had a plumber do a repair once and he installed one on a nat gas fired water heater for that reason, to meet current code.

Ballvalve · Jan 4, 2011

jheinzel said:
Thanks I'll give it a try and let you know how it goes. Sorry dlarrivee, this is for my boiler's water lines, not gas, probably should have said that.

First it was water and now its gas??

Shut off valve question

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