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Thread: Frequency of regeneration

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    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    Default Frequency of regeneration

    Hi,

    I have a 48000 grain Fleck 7000 system. Due to kids growing up and moving out, it's now just me, and my water use is way down. I seem to remember hearing or reading somewhere that you should regenerate every 7 days even if you don't need to. According to the display on the Fleck I am nowhere close to needing to regenerate, but I have the meter set to regenerate every 7 days.

    Is this true that you should regenerate every 7 days? Can anyone explain what happens if you don't? My system seems to be very low on salt usage - seems like maybe only 5 pounds per month - but I feel guilty about wasting the water, since I'm in an area where we have problems and try to conserve. I do feel strongly that I need the softener since my local water company provides well water at 20-23 grains and I know that the deposits crud up everything without it. That was the main reason for installing he softener in the first place.

    Thank you!

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    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    Is there any iron in the water?
    What salt setting or how many minutes is set for the brine refill on the 7000?
    If you are running 9 lbs and 33000 capicity on the unit and one person , you could have 1200 gallons on the meter and a defalt day setting of 14 and it should be good.
    If there is iron let me know that will change the numbers..

    With either gallons or days what will happen is that if you have family over for awhile then the gallons will trip it into a cleaning cycle, while by your self the day counter will most likely over ride it..

    Seven day in my view is more when there is Iron in the water, even a little say .6ppm... then there needs to be a shorted time frame.

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    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    Thank you! I'll call the water company and get the iron level, and if there is some I'll let you know. The settings on the 7000 right now are the factory defaults - the place I got the unit from said it was pre-programmed and best to leave it alone. If no iron, I'll go ahead and put in your numbers. Thanks again.

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    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    Did you get all the information and programing for the 7000?
    PM if you need them and I can get them to you , Programing is not that hard, there is a flow chart to follow and a step by step guide to change a few of the number settings.
    There are some that you will NOT change..

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    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    I think I have it all... its been a couple years, I will have to dig it out of the file cabinet in the morning. If it's hiding, I'll pm you. I remember the flow chart, I think... it was printed on peach colored paper or something like that? I'll get the iron data and post back if there's iron. Thanks again, I really, really appreciate all your help. It's great that you devote so much time to helping folks out.

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    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    The peach color or orange color sounds right for the programing insert...

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    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TWEAK View Post
    Hi, I have a 48000 grain Fleck 7000 system. Due to kids growing up and moving out, it's now just me, and my water use is way down. I seem to remember hearing or reading somewhere that you should regenerate every 7 days even if you don't need to. According to the display on the Fleck I am nowhere close to needing to regenerate, but I have the meter set to regenerate every 7 days.

    Is this true that you should regenerate every 7 days? Can anyone explain what happens if you don't? My system seems to be very low on salt usage - seems like maybe only 5 pounds per month - but I feel guilty about wasting the water, since I'm in an area where we have problems and try to conserve. I do feel strongly that I need the softener since my local water company provides well water at 20-23 grains and I know that the deposits crud up everything without it. That was the main reason for installing he softener in the first place. Thank you!
    Resin and water use usually does best if you regenerate every 7-9 days. Going longer allows a build up of invisible dirt on the resin beads and that's not good for it.

    I see below in another post that you are using the default settings. Your K of capacity and salt dose lbs will not be right, and the time/minutes the cycle positions of the regeneration runs for will be too high.

    With one person at 60 gals/day times 23 gpg = 1380*8 days = 11040 rounded to 12K, you need to set the salt dose to 4 lbs. Four lbs at the rate of .5 gpm or 1.5 lbs/minute is 6 minutes of Fill time.

    Get into the programming and post the data in each field and we'll go over it for you.

    City water rarely has any iron it after it is treated at the plant and especially if the water is chlorinated.

    If you bought the softener online, tell us who you bought it from to help others.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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    DIY Senior Member Bob999's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    With one person at 60 gals/day times 23 gpg = 1380*8 days = 11040 rounded to 12K, you need to set the salt dose to 4 lbs. Four lbs at the rate of .5 gpm or 1.5 lbs/minute is 6 minutes of Fill time.
    I think Gary meant to say that with a fill rate of .5 gpm the needed fill time to get 4 lbs of salt is 2.67 minutes. A 6 minute fill time would give 3 gallons of water and 9 lbs of salt.

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    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    Yes, thanks to all. I did confirm no iron in the water.

    I was able to find all the original paperwork including the programming info flowchart (a miracle!). Can't find the receipt though.... I did get it online.... I don't remember where. Few more places I can look.

    Due to work issues... won't get to actually playing with the program for a few days, or maybe the weekend.

    I hope I can resurrect this thread then?

    Maybe in the meantime, would any of you experts be able to point to some generic information that would actually describe what all the various setting on that valve actually mean? In other words, I don't understand the stages of the regeneration cycle. I guess there's no reason that I would need to, but I'm curious. The valve seems to go through several steps that make up the regeneration process, but the details of the process aren't actually decribed anywhere in my paperwork.

    Thanks again to all!

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    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    There is a manual to another valve from the company that makes your 7000 , it is a 5600 and in that book is shows the different stages to the service and cleaning stages..

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    DIY Senior Member Bob999's Avatar
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    Here is a link to the service manual for the Fleck 7000 valve. See pages 35-38 for diagrams of the water flow for each cycle of the valve.

    http://www.pentairwatertreatment.com...al%2042775.pdf

  12. #12
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob999 View Post
    I think Gary meant to say that with a fill rate of .5 gpm the needed fill time to get 4 lbs of salt is 2.67 minutes. A 6 minute fill time would give 3 gallons of water and 9 lbs of salt.
    Yes it should be 3 minutes.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    Thank you yet again, gents!

  14. #14
    DIY Member TWEAK's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    Sorry for the long delay - I've been distracted by other committments.

    When I first posted, the cam option was "downflow" - DF. I noticed that there was very little water in the brine tank. In fact, it was literally barely up to the grid or possibly even a tad below it. Is this why I was getting such low salt usage? I do get much reduced hard water buildup at the fixtures, , but still see significant water spotting. To me the water hasn't felt nearly as "slick" as I expect. Has my effective salt dose just been way too little due to the low water level??

    I know the regen cycles are happening. I did go through a manual regen yesterday and confirm that the valve is moving water around as it should.

    Anyway, yesterday I changed the settings to "downflow fill first" and did a manual regen. The water level at the end of the fill (step 1) is much higher. I can reach down into the salt and feel "wet" several inches above the grid.

    Here are the "Master Programming Mode" settings:

    Format: gallons (U--1)

    Regenerant Flow: downflow fill first (dFFF)

    Regeneration Type: meter delayed (7--3)

    System Capacity: 48000 grains/gallon (C-48)

    Feed water hardness: 23 grains/gallon (H-23)

    Regeneration time: 2 am (2:00)

    Regeneration day override: 7 days (A--7)

    Regeneration Cycle Step Programming:

    ** step 1 - refill: 12 minutes (1--12)
    ** step 2 - brine making: 60 minutes (2--60)
    ** step 3 - backwash: 20 minutes (3--10)
    ** step 4 - brine draw: 60 minutes (4--60)
    ** step 5 - 2nd backwash: 5 minutes (5 --5)
    ** step 6 - rapid rinse: 10 minutes (6--10)

    Flow meter size: 82 pulses per gallon (F--82)

    Safety factor: 15% (cF 15)

    Line frequency: 60 Hz (LF 60)


    If I understand your earlier posts correctly (no guarantee of that!!) then it seems like I should change cycle step #1, currently 12 minutes, down to 3 minutes? And after a regeneration cycle is complete, where do I want the water level in the brine tank relative to the grid - or does it matter? Right now the water level is above the grid. I would guess that in down flow fill first mode, the fill level should be below the salt after the regen is complete.

    Thanks again for all the help!!

  15. #15
    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    If your brine flow control is .50 gpm then for 12 minutes there will be 6 gallons in the brine tank, 3lbs per 1 gallon of water or 18 lbs of salt.
    That 18 lbs will take between 2-3 hours to make up.. if any changes I would take the step 2 brine making from 60 minutes to 120 minutes.

    I would take the capacity from 48k down to 38k

    Those are the only two that I would do.

    Just my view..

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