Franklin Constant Pressure MONODRIVE installation help, PLEASE!

My pump, 1 HP Sta-rite, is 100 feet from my house with a frost free hydrant about 10 feet from the well. All the branch lines come next and the tank tee, Pressure switch, 40-60, and the last thing is an 80 GAL Pressure tank.
Franklin says to install the P tank between the pump and P switch in line from the pump to the house, not exactly what I have here! I read the installation directions from Franklin and it says you can change the pin settings if you have a line before the P tank, but all of my lines are before the P tank and the last thing in line is the P tank. I have started to have hydraulic shock or hammering when my under ground sprinkler valves shut off. Not every time but about 3 out of 8 zones and it sounds like the pipes are going to come out of the wall. I stopped by the pump dealer and talked with them about it and they said 2 options, a valve at the bottom of the pump, $200 or the MONODRIVE box, $1000. I would most likely do the MONODRIVE myself and save a little money, but after reading the install directions I now have questions as to if it will work at all?? Any help or ideas would be most appreciated and thanks in advance for all responses.
Lyle Pfeifer

The following is a story of a similar installation.

A recent installation at a "Smart House" close to Branson, Missouri used a Sub Drive, the home owner called an "on demand" system. The multi-million dollar house was all computer controlled, and used a Sub Drive system with a 3 gallon pressure tank. The pump man installed the pump, the plumber installed piping to the house, the electrician wired the system, then the irrigation contractor came in to set up the sprinklers system.

The well head was a couple of hundred feet away from the main house and the mechanical room. The Sub Drive controller and 3 gallon tank where installed in the mechanical room. The irrigation contractor teed into the water line in a vault out by the well head.

Problems were encountered as soon as the irrigation system was turned on. The long distance to the Sub Drive controller, and pressure sensor with a 1 PSI bandwidth, caused the sprinkler system to pulse. The sprinklers would throw 35', then drop to 20', and the process kept repeating itself over and over. The pulsing problem at the sprinklers was similar to the pulsing seen on a standard pump system with a water logged tank.

The irrigation contractor had already purchased and installed a CSV at the well head, prior to the tee to the irrigation. There was no pressure gauge at the well head or on the irrigation system. The system was still pulsing, so the irrigation contractor called technical support at Cycle Stop Valves. Without knowing the pressure settings or being able to see a pressure gauge, the tech at CSV recommended turning the adjustment bolt on the CSV counterclockwise one full turn. The pulsing immediately went away, and the sprinklers began hitting the 35' mark precisely and continuously.

Installing the CSV turned out to be a much better solution than ditching through the yard, and boring a new hole through the house to install the sprinkler line, after the Sub Drive pressure sensor. It was also not an option to put the Sub Drive controller in the vault, as the humid environment would quickly destroy the computerized electronic controller. It was also quickly noticed that the CSV keeps the Sub Drive system from pulsing while small amounts of water are being used in the house. Without the CSV, the Sub Drive pressure sensor was pulsing the pump system 45 times per minute, while a shower or other water use was on. With the CSV, the pressure remains constant, and the pump does not pulse, while a shower or other appliance is being used.

The irrigation contractor was very happy with the CSV retrofit of the Sub Drive system. However, he soon realized that the CSV was doing the "constant pressure" control, and that the Sub Drive itself was no longer being utilized as the main control. Since the CSV is the only "constant pressure" control that is needed, replacing the Sub Drive controller with a standard controller, will eliminate the "harmonics" and "stray voltage" problems to the "smart house" that can be caused by variable speed control of the Sub Drive system.

Valveman, if the Franklin monodrive would work in my installation, it would be much easier to hook up than digging up the area around the pump casing to install that valve.
Lyle

"If ifs and buts were candy and nuts, we would all have a Merry Christmas."

I say go for it. After you have gone through the headaches and cost of replacing the Monodrive controller and/or motor a couple of times, a little digging won't seem like much trouble at all. And that way all of us manufacturers can make a little money off you. Of course the others will make good money off a couple of VFD's that won't last very long, while I will make very little on a CSV that will last a long time. I can wait. Most of my customers have already been through the VFD stage, it usually takes two or three years. But thats why they call me. Been replacing VFD's with CSV's since 1993. The only thing that has changed over the years, is that there are more VFD's to replace. Pump guys/girls that sell VFD's, either don't understand how pumps work, or they just sell them because they make a lot more money.

Actually you can install the CSV in the well without doing any digging. Just pull the pump up a couple of feet and install the CSV under the well seal or pitless adapter, and set the pump back down. Just call me when you get to that point. Even if it takes a few years, I won't be mad at you. And I promise not to say I told you so!

PS;
There is also one more phase you can go through. Others will tell you they have a valve that works just like a Cycle Stop Valve, only cheaper. There are several out there trying to copy the Cycle Stop Valve. They even use names that are close to Cycle Stop Valves. Sometimes people say “I already tried a valve just like a CSV, and that didn’t work either”. So they give up on finding anything that will work. Just don’t give up on your pump system until you have tried an original Cycle Stop Valve. So again, you can call me after you start thinking like the guy below. I promise not to say I told you so!

“I use my well and pump for 1 outside spigot to just water my lawn. Last fall I ordered a ***XX 1" ***XX stop valve and a JR-6 tank. I used it last fall for about a month and then drained everything for winter. I just tried using it for the first time this spring and the pump is cycling on and off every few seconds. My cut in is about 40 and out is about 60. Last fall I had the cycle stop valve (see what I mean because it wasn’t a CSV?) adjusted to around 55. I tried adjusting the screw on the valve to no avail. These things better have a warranty, I bought the more expensive brass one because I was told they would last much longer.” Homeowner

(After the first warranty valve....)
"Ok, this is ridiculous, I use the well twice a week (Sunday and Wednesday morning for an hour). It stopped working properly again and is now regulating at 42PSI (was around 59) which doesn't shoot the sprinkler very far. I tried adjusting the bolt and it didn't change..."
Homeowner

Valveman, the pump guy showed me a valve, not sure it was yours, but that is what he said they had to pull the pump for?? I also looked at this valve and could not imagine a pump and 140' of pipe hanging on by a PVC valve. I beleive he said it went at the bottom of the pump, but maybe he ment at the pitman. Either case I would think you would want a bronze or cast iron vavle?? That is the whole reason I was looking into the Franklin box as I know would not have to worry about my pump being moved and if that valve failed having to have the pump pulled again or worse loose it to the bottom of the well. We do get some sediment and sand occasionally. I will talk with them again and see which vavle they use. He said about $200, that is why I was guessing the PVC.
Lyle

The plastic valve with the weight bearing coupling can handle 3400 pounds. It is stronger than the PVC pipe. I wouldn't hang that much steel pipe on it but, a lot of people do. The plastic valve and coupling are 134 bucks. Should be red and white.

The CSV1W is a brass valve that will fit in the casing, holds 7,000 pounds, cost 200 bucks. Bet that is the one he is talking about.

Plastic valve has less friction loss, cost less. Brass valve handles more weight and sediment but, has more friction loss. Friction loss only matters if you have zones that already max out the pump. The pressure will be lower when maxing out the pump flow.

I have the plastic valve in my well. 214' deep, 1.25" PVC, 2 HP pump, no sand. I changed the first valve out after 14 years, just to dissect it. Second one has been in for 3 years. Should have put the old one back, it was fine. I tried hard to tear up the first pump on a CSV . Probably put about 30 years of normal wear and tear on it in 14 years.

You won't have to move the pump to install the Franklin box, just have to pull it later because of the Franklin box. I think you should try it, and come back to this thread in a couple of years or sooner and let us know how it is going.