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Thread: 1-1/4" PEX, is a DIY install possible?

  1. #61
    DIY Junior Member hoffmand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akpsdvan View Post
    Might you have the unit set so that either the gallons or the day over ride takes place?
    If you have a house full of people for awhile the gallons most likely will send it into a cycle, while with just the normal the 14 days..
    Yes, whichever comes first, gallons or days.

  2. #62
    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoffmand View Post
    Yes, whichever comes first, gallons or days.
    Cool.... that is the great benny of a digital control..

    I would leave it the way it is for now , you can always move the gallons up or down or the days up or down later if things are not to your liking after 6-12 months...

    You did good in picking things up ...and then setting things up.

  3. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    I've never used a percentage, I was taught to do the actual math, and for a time clock subtract a day's worth of capacity. I.E. say 15 gpg and a family of 4 at 60/gals/day/person = 3600 times say a 4 day service run would be 5 times 3600 = 18K and in a 1.0 cuft you'd set the salt dose at 5.5 lbs then set the regen days at 4, 8 and 12. That way you regen 18K and it uses 4 * 3600 = 14,400+/-. Your way uses 2.5 lbs more for the same K.

    A reserve for a metered control valve, unless it has variable reserve like the Clack WS-1, you subtract a day's worth of gallons from the total gallons based on the K of capacity. I.E. using the above example, 18K/15gpg=1200 gals - 3600/15= 240 so 1200-240= 960 gallons and with your mechanical meter 5600, it can't accept but whole numbers and the 25 gals increments so you have to set it at 950 gallons. And it would regen on average every 950/240= 3.9 or call it 4 days.

    Doing it your way you use 2.5 lbs more every 4 days times 365/4 = 91 regens times 2.5lbs = 227.5 lbs more salt/yr times 10 yrs = 2275lbs which is 1.2 tons more salt when you don't have to.

    And here there is a 3.0 cuft at did he say 3 lbs?
    This is were you and I differ. You say you use a days worth for a reserve (4*60*16=3600) So 18k-3600=14,400 @ 6 lbs.
    14400/15= 960. So 960/60/4= 4 days between regens. 30/4*6= 45 lbs per month And I use 20k @ 8lbs. So 20000/15/60/4=5.5 days between regen. So 30/5.5*8=43.6 lbs per month. So who's math is right? Mine says you use 1.4 lbs more and your's says I use 2.5 lbs more.

  4. #64
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skip Wolverton View Post
    This is were you and I differ. You say you use a days worth for a reserve (4*60*16=3600) So 18k-3600=14,400 @ 6 lbs. 14400/15= 960. So 960/60/4= 4 days between regens. 30/4*6= 45 lbs per month And I use 20k @ 8lbs. So 20000/15/60/4=5.5 days between regen. So 30/5.5*8=43.6 lbs per month. So who's math is right? Mine says you use 1.4 lbs more and your's says I use 2.5 lbs more.
    You have a serious error in your math; "So 20000/15/60/4=5.5 days between regen.". (the 60 should be 960) but you can't regen on 5.5 days..

    You are saying you would regen every 5.5 days but you can't regen half of a day, whole days only, so it's really every 5 days at 8lbs.

    And with 30 days in a month/5 days (you can't regen on half a day) = 6 regens/month * 8lbs of salt each = 48 lbs/'month.

    And 48lbs per month - my 41.25 lbs per month = 6.75 lbs more for you per month.

    If I have a Clack WS-1 on a 1.0 cuft and want a regen every 4 days, I use 4 people * 60gals/day/person = 240 * 15 gpg = 3600/day * 4 days between regens = 14400 so I'd program it for 15K and 15,000/3333 salt efficiency = 4.5 lbs * 7.5 4 day periods in a month = 33.75 lbs total while your 5600 is using 48 lbs, for a savings of 14.25 lbs/month for my customer.

    If I were selling a softener to that family of 4 in my example above, it would be a 1.5 cuft and regenerate 30K with 9 lbs for 2000 gals on the meter (no calculated reserve required because of the variable reserve in the Clack WS-1 CS) and regen on average every 8.333 or actually every 8 days. 30/8 = 3.75 so 3 regens per month at 9 lbs is 27 lbs compared to my 41.25 in the example 1.0 cuft here, and a very substantial savings in salt of 41,25 - 27 = 14.25 lbs. And IMO salt savings should be calculated on an annual basis and divided by 12 for monthly. There are 46 8 day periods in a year * 9 lbs = 414 lbs per year /12 = 34.5 lbs/month.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    You have a serious error in your math; "So 20000/15/60/4=5.5 days between regen.". (the 60 should be 960) but you can't regen on 5.5 days..

    You are saying you would regen every 5.5 days but you can't regen half of a day, whole days only, so it's really every 5 days at 8lbs.

    And with 30 days in a month/5 days (you can't regen on half a day) = 6 regens/month * 8lbs of salt each = 48 lbs/'month.

    And 48lbs per month - my 41.25 lbs per month = 6.75 lbs more for you per month.

    If I have a Clack WS-1 on a 1.0 cuft and want a regen every 4 days, I use 4 people * 60gals/day/person = 240 * 15 gpg = 3600/day * 4 days between regens = 14400 so I'd program it for 15K and 15,000/3333 salt efficiency = 4.5 lbs * 7.5 4 day periods in a month = 33.75 lbs total while your 5600 is using 48 lbs, for a savings of 14.25 lbs/month for my customer.

    If I were selling a softener to that family of 4 in my example above, it would be a 1.5 cuft and regenerate 30K with 9 lbs for 2000 gals on the meter (no calculated reserve required because of the variable reserve in the Clack WS-1 CS) and regen on average every 8.333 or actually every 8 days. 30/8 = 3.75 so 3 regens per month at 9 lbs is 27 lbs compared to my 41.25 in the example 1.0 cuft here, and a very substantial savings in salt of 41,25 - 27 = 14.25 lbs. And IMO salt savings should be calculated on an annual basis and divided by 12 for monthly. There are 46 8 day periods in a year * 9 lbs = 414 lbs per year /12 = 34.5 lbs/month.
    Don't you think I would know you can't regen on a half day? I only sell meter system so this is an avg. In your first formula you stated 43.6 lbs per month now it's down to 41.25. What gives there. And what is this 7.4 days in a month. You can not regen on a 7.4 day schedule. LOL. It just does not make sense trying to show you something. I give up!

  6. #66
    In the Trades Akpsdvan's Avatar
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    Every 6.5 or 7.4 or 7.1 days works if it is a Twin unit....................

    Same amount of resin in different brand name units will have different salt setting and different capacities ....

    There is nothing new here... just who is going to be the last one standing ...

  7. #67
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skip Wolverton View Post
    Don't you think I would know you can't regen on a half day? I only sell meter system so this is an avg. In your first formula you stated 43.6 lbs per month now it's down to 41.25. What gives there. And what is this 7.4 days in a month. You can not regen on a 7.4 day schedule. LOL. It just does not make sense trying to show you something. I give up!
    You came up with 41.25 lbs from my first example so what do you mean what's up with that?

    The a 7.4 day schedule.... (that 7.4 should be 7.5) and I thought if you can use 5.5 times I can use 7.5 times in a month.

    Personally I think you're pulling out now blaming me because the math shows you are wrong on using your 5.5 average. You know there are 6 5 day periods in 30 days and you will regen 6 times, and 6 times times 8 lbs is 48 lbs. The math doesn't lie.

    BTW, where is your 20% reserve if you use 20K (20K- 20% is 4K and 20-4 = 16K)?
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

  8. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Slusser View Post
    You came up with 41.25 lbs from my first example so what do you mean what's up with that?

    The a 7.4 day schedule.... (that 7.4 should be 7.5) and I thought if you can use 5.5 times I can use 7.5 times in a month.

    Personally I think you're pulling out now blaming me because the math shows you are wrong on using your 5.5 average. You know there are 6 5 day periods in 30 days and you will regen 6 times, and 6 times times 8 lbs is 48 lbs. The math doesn't lie.

    BTW, where is your 20% reserve if you use 20K (20K- 20% is 4K and 20-4 = 16K)?
    My reserve is in the 2 lbs of salt. I set mine for 8lbs not 6 lbs like you do.

  9. #69
    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skip Wolverton View Post
    My reserve is in the 2 lbs of salt. I set mine for 8lbs not 6 lbs like you do.
    That's what I thought.

    That means your customer gets a salt efficiency of only 2500 grains/lb. 20000/8= 2500.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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