HDClown
New Member
I live in Orlando Florida area, so it's warm-to-HOT 9-10 months out of the year. Our cold months are usually in the 40's, but we've seen high 20s and low 30s the past few weeks (which is unusual to see for that length of time). We might see 1 week total of those temps on average.
My house is re-piped with PEX. ALL of the hot and cold water supplies runs through my attic. In the summer, I get boiling hot water instantly, very shortly after it gets lukewarm, and then back to hot water. In the winter, I get extremely cold (Freezing cold sometimes) water, and then 20 seconds later (depending on proximity to the HWH), I'll get my hot water.
I have a 40 gallon HWH that's about 18 years old. It's on my list to replace this month or next, as a pre-emptive replacement, and it's obviously not energy efficient by today's standards (although that's the least of my concerns). House is 1850sq ft with 2 bathrooms (1 with regular tub, one with walk-in shower). We MAY (it's a good 2 years out, if it even happens)expand the house adding a new master bath with a new walk-in shower and large soaking/whirlpool type tub.
I've talked to 4 different gas/plumbing companies now about tankless/tank. They are all pushing tankless. 3 of the 4 said they wouldn't bother with indoor because I need venting upgrades, so they all said outdoor. 1 of the 4, who happened to be one of the least expensive, said he would do indoor, and he wouldn't need to modify the roofing. He said he would slightly enlarge the flange on the roof, and then feed the new SS vent through it, and seal it with some kind of sealant that was not effected by the hot temps.
All 4 companiese have recommended the Noritz 751 (now branded NR98). Due to incentive programs with my gas company, I'm end up looking at roughly $500 out-of-pocket cost for the outdoor mount noritz, or about $200 for the guy who wants to do the indoor. I'd have zero out of pocket cost to just get a new 40gallon tank. Tax rebate on the tankless would help offset part of that out-of-pocket cost. These costs are really not a concern however, but I just want to cover all my bases.
One of my main concerns with a tankless is noise. The indoor and outdoor mount locations are against my 3 year old daughters bedroom. I did some tests with a cordless drill (around 70dB SPL), and if the drill touches the wall, you hear it loudly. If it doesn't touch the wall, you can't hear it at all. So the vibrations caused by the fan in a tankless, transferfing through the walls, would not be very good. There is 1 position outside that I can mount it where it's against an exterior garage wall, but it's right by the front of the house and exposed (next to my electrical meter). I don't like the idea of the exposed shut-offs and the unit from an aesthetic unit, and other people possibly trying to mess with it.
My other concerns is my repiping and water sandwiching that may come into effect, or issues with the units operating properly in summer due to burning hot water being in the pipes initially. My wife and I are already used to turning on the hot water and having to wait 5-30 seconds for the temp to normalize, and I'm not really expecting this to change by getting a tankless. I don't want it to get to be hugely worse however.
Have I had demand issues with my 40 gallon tank? Nope, not really. Only time I have complaints is when it's in the mid-to-low 30s or worse and I'm using my master bath which is across the house from the HWH. I constantly have to turn to the hot water side to keep warm water. Will a tankless fix this? Don't know the answer. Is it my reason for looking at tankless? Not really. So, why look at tankless? No particularly wowing reason. I wouldn't mind having the space in my garage occupied by the tank unit to be free'd up. That's about the only reason I've come up with. Don't care so much about energy savings, being green, etc.
So, after all this, I'm still undecided on what to do. Hoping for some people with first hand experience and more technical knowledge to weigh in on my concerns and applications relative to my environment/situation.
Thanks!
My house is re-piped with PEX. ALL of the hot and cold water supplies runs through my attic. In the summer, I get boiling hot water instantly, very shortly after it gets lukewarm, and then back to hot water. In the winter, I get extremely cold (Freezing cold sometimes) water, and then 20 seconds later (depending on proximity to the HWH), I'll get my hot water.
I have a 40 gallon HWH that's about 18 years old. It's on my list to replace this month or next, as a pre-emptive replacement, and it's obviously not energy efficient by today's standards (although that's the least of my concerns). House is 1850sq ft with 2 bathrooms (1 with regular tub, one with walk-in shower). We MAY (it's a good 2 years out, if it even happens)expand the house adding a new master bath with a new walk-in shower and large soaking/whirlpool type tub.
I've talked to 4 different gas/plumbing companies now about tankless/tank. They are all pushing tankless. 3 of the 4 said they wouldn't bother with indoor because I need venting upgrades, so they all said outdoor. 1 of the 4, who happened to be one of the least expensive, said he would do indoor, and he wouldn't need to modify the roofing. He said he would slightly enlarge the flange on the roof, and then feed the new SS vent through it, and seal it with some kind of sealant that was not effected by the hot temps.
All 4 companiese have recommended the Noritz 751 (now branded NR98). Due to incentive programs with my gas company, I'm end up looking at roughly $500 out-of-pocket cost for the outdoor mount noritz, or about $200 for the guy who wants to do the indoor. I'd have zero out of pocket cost to just get a new 40gallon tank. Tax rebate on the tankless would help offset part of that out-of-pocket cost. These costs are really not a concern however, but I just want to cover all my bases.
One of my main concerns with a tankless is noise. The indoor and outdoor mount locations are against my 3 year old daughters bedroom. I did some tests with a cordless drill (around 70dB SPL), and if the drill touches the wall, you hear it loudly. If it doesn't touch the wall, you can't hear it at all. So the vibrations caused by the fan in a tankless, transferfing through the walls, would not be very good. There is 1 position outside that I can mount it where it's against an exterior garage wall, but it's right by the front of the house and exposed (next to my electrical meter). I don't like the idea of the exposed shut-offs and the unit from an aesthetic unit, and other people possibly trying to mess with it.
My other concerns is my repiping and water sandwiching that may come into effect, or issues with the units operating properly in summer due to burning hot water being in the pipes initially. My wife and I are already used to turning on the hot water and having to wait 5-30 seconds for the temp to normalize, and I'm not really expecting this to change by getting a tankless. I don't want it to get to be hugely worse however.
Have I had demand issues with my 40 gallon tank? Nope, not really. Only time I have complaints is when it's in the mid-to-low 30s or worse and I'm using my master bath which is across the house from the HWH. I constantly have to turn to the hot water side to keep warm water. Will a tankless fix this? Don't know the answer. Is it my reason for looking at tankless? Not really. So, why look at tankless? No particularly wowing reason. I wouldn't mind having the space in my garage occupied by the tank unit to be free'd up. That's about the only reason I've come up with. Don't care so much about energy savings, being green, etc.
So, after all this, I'm still undecided on what to do. Hoping for some people with first hand experience and more technical knowledge to weigh in on my concerns and applications relative to my environment/situation.
Thanks!