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Thread: Uh...Ian.......Whats up with This ???

  1. #1
    Extreme DIY Homeowner Scuba_Dave's Avatar
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    Default Uh...Ian.......Whats up with This ???

    Huh ?

    Ex-soldier faces jail for handing in gun

    Tuesday, November 17, 2009, 12:15
    A former soldier who handed a discarded shotgun in to police faces at least five years imprisonment for "doing his duty".
    Paul Clarke, 27, was found guilty of possessing a firearm at Guildford Crown Court on Tuesday after finding the gun and handing it personally to police officers on March 20 this year.
    The jury took 20 minutes to make its conviction, and Mr Clarke now faces a minimum of five year's imprisonment for handing in the weapon.
    In a statement read out in court, Mr Clarke said: "I didn't think for one moment I would be arrested.
    "I thought it was my duty to hand it in and get it off the streets."


    The court heard how Mr Clarke was on the balcony of his home in Nailsworth Crescent, Merstham, when he spotted a black bin liner at the bottom of his garden.
    In his statement, he said: "I took it indoors and inside found a shorn-off shotgun and two cartridges.
    "I didn't know what to do, so the next morning I rang the Chief Superintendent, Adrian Harper, and asked if I could pop in and see him.
    "At the police station, I took the gun out of the bag and placed it on the table so it was pointing towards the wall."
    Mr Clarke was then arrested immediately for possession of a firearm at Reigate police station, and taken to the cells.
    http://www.thisissurreytoday.co.uk/n...l/article.html
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    Customer Service Manager Plumbing Wholesale Peanut9199's Avatar
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    He also showed jurors a leaflet printed by Surrey Police explaining to citizens what they can do at a police station, which included "reporting found firearms".

    Quizzing officer Garnett, who arrested Mr Clarke, he asked: "Are you aware of any notice issued by Surrey Police, or any publicity given to, telling citizens that if they find a firearm the only thing they should do is not touch it, report it by telephone, and not take it into a police station?"

    To which, Mr Garnett replied: "No, I don't believe so."

    Prosecuting, Brian Stalk, explained to the jury that possession of a firearm was a "strict liability" charge therefore Mr Clarke's allegedly honest intent was irrelevant.

    Just by having the gun in his possession he was guilty of the charge, and has no defence in law against it, he added.

    I guess it's the old adage "Ignorance of the law is no excuse".

  3. #3
    Plumber Cass's Avatar
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    This sums it up very well.....

    The life of the law has not been logic, but experience. This was the great jurist Oliver Wendell Holmes's famous description of how the law operates in our lives. It is perhaps the single most telling observation in all of legal history. To learn how the law works, look not to the law's presumed foundations in logic but rather to our real-world experience of the law. What Holmes might have added, however, is that experience can be brutal.
    How often is it that a person finds unsatisfactory the application of a particular law to his/her situation or individual predicament? This experience is quite common and usually involves a law that one would have expected to help rather than hinder or even hurt one's ultimate cause. In these instances, people are likely to become cynical, even despairing of the law in general, inclined to disbelieve claims of the law's intrinsic merit.
    This skepticism of the law is nothing new. In the sixteenth century, the essayist Michel de Montaigne complained bitterly that "laws maintain their credit, not because they are just, but because they are laws. This is the mystical basis of their authority; they have no other. They are often made by fools, and more often by men who, out of hatred for equality, are lacking in equity, but always by men: vain and unstable creators. There is nothing so grossly and widely, nor so ordinarily faulty as the laws." Montaigne backed up his argument by going even farther back in time to quote Epicurus, a philosopher of the fourth century, B.C.: "As we once suffered from crimes, so now we are suffering from laws."

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    Plumbing Designer FloridaOrange's Avatar
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    Sounds almost like the old pot laws. It wasn't illegal to have pot if you had a gov't issued stamp for it. To get the stamp you had to take the pot to the office to get the stamp....therefor you had it in your possession prior to having the stamp and were subsequently arrested for it.
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  5. #5
    Senior Robin Hood Guy Ian Gills's Avatar
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    We're very strict with guns.

    Only sissies have them.

    Real men use their fists, a stick or a short knife.

    That's why when our police respond, they do not wear riot helmets or have shields.

    Here, the Police shoot first and ask questions later.

    It's cultural and has a lot to do with what your dad taught you.

    "It's not a fair fight if you shoot the burglar son, use your fists."

    In England a policeman will not hit you, unless you hit him. Then he will kick your arse and probably only use his fists.

    We just love a fight. Guns take away that pleasure.

    That's probably why we lost America. We came looking for a friendly punch up and your daddies decided to use the guns in the shed. Oh, and the French.
    Last edited by Ian Gills; 11-19-2009 at 09:25 AM.

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    Does that include these?
    Last edited by Cookie; 01-15-2010 at 07:05 AM.

  7. #7
    Senior Robin Hood Guy Ian Gills's Avatar
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    No, not allowed.

    Too impersonal.

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    Customer Service Manager Plumbing Wholesale Peanut9199's Avatar
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    My Dad used to be in the Merchant Marines and the Officers used to sew razor blades in the rim of thier hats (in case they got in a fight on shore leave).
    One on top and one on bottom and what that would do is if you were cut, because the cuts were so close together you wouldn't be able to get them stitched up properly and would always have a nasty scar.
    Last edited by Peanut9199; 11-19-2009 at 12:19 PM.

  9. #9
    DIY Senior Member Runs with bison's Avatar
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    Seems pretty nuts to me. See, the U.S. isn't the only country with daft jurors, overzealous prosecutors and law enforcement.

    So in England, if you want to ruin some enemy's life, just obtain a gun, toss it in their car/luggage/whatever and make sure they are found with it in their possession. According to the judge, jurors, and law enforcement the person is screwed, even if a weapon fell out of the sky apparently.

  10. #10
    Customer Service Manager Plumbing Wholesale Peanut9199's Avatar
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    No what the police say is

    if they find a firearm the only thing they should do is not touch it, report it by telephone, and not take it into a police station?"
    so as long as you don't touch it and that means pick it up and bring it to a police station it's ok.

  11. #11
    Plumber Cass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Gills View Post
    We're very strict with guns.

    Only sissies have them.

    Real men use their fists, a stick or a short knife.

    There is only one rule in a fight...that is to win...

    I would rarher be a live sissy with a gun than a dead man....

  12. #12
    Senior Robin Hood Guy Ian Gills's Avatar
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    One of two things will happen with the case because we are smarter than Americans and more pragmatic.

    Either:

    a) they will discover it was really his gun

    b) they will concede that this was a responsible act but remind the public of the proper procedure.

    Notice how they arrested him without shooting him. Good eh? You might want to take a leaf out of that book, just in case the guy your Police did shoot didn't actually do it.

    May I also remind you that a ploy that a young boy was flying away on a weather balloon would just not work in England. Simple maths. Balloon too small, therefore no need to call the Police.

    Not so in America.

    It's the same with the Healthcare Bill. Public health provision will save you money and improve health outcomes.

    But there's just no helping some of you. I blame the mainstream conservative media, which obviously cannot count or perhaps even read.

    There is only one rule in a fight...that is to win...

    I would rather be a live sissy with a gun than a dead man....
    Where's the honor in that? Let me speak to your dad about your upbringing.

    I like the Canadian approach myself. That being guns are to hunt and fists are to fight with.
    Last edited by Ian Gills; 11-19-2009 at 02:53 PM.

  13. #13

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    I have a hot purse.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cass View Post
    There is only one rule in a fight...that is to win...

    I would rarher be a live sissy with a gun than a dead man....

    Got that right. I would rather you be a sissy too. LOL I'll loan you my purse.

  15. #15
    Plumber Cass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Gills View Post

    It's the same with the Healthcare Bill. Public health provision will save you money and improve health outcomes.

    .
    It will never happen...ever...you really don't understand politics, power and control...

    If I am the only game in town I control it in every way...

    One thing man never learns from history....is that man never learns from history...

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