14" Rough-In Toilet Choices

[Terry]

Toto Vespin II CST474CEFG with SS114 Softclose seat.
This bowl was installed on a 13-1/2" rough-in using the 14" Unifit adapter.
This toilet was installed in Seattle by us.

The Vespin comes with a standard 12" Unifit, but this was installed with a 14" unifit.
This allows us to slide the bowl back 2" closer to the wall.
There are a lot of homes built in Seattle that had 14" rough toilets.
The tanks were mounted on the wall, and connected to the bowls with chrome plated tube that bent between the two.

[Chris74]

All,

I'm in the same boat. I have limited space for depth from the back wall and a 14" rough-in that I can't change.

I've been laboring over my choices here and found this toilet that I thought I could get some feedback on.

It's 14" Rough-in
27" Depth!!
Round bowl and about $170.

Sterling
Windham™ 14" Rough-in Round-Front Toilet with Pro Force® Technology
Dimensions: 27" x 16-7/8" x 29"

You are reading the spec sheet wrong for the 14" Windham.

Round bowl, 29-1/4" plus 1" behind the tank = 30-1/4" from the back wall to end of bowl.

Elongated bowl, 31-1/4" plus 1" behind the tank = 32-1/4" from the back wall to end of bowl.
Terry Love

List price: $165.20 and up

Product #: 402014

http://sterlingplumbing.com/onlineca.../1022170_4.pdf

Any thoughts? The manufacturer site is here: http://sterlingplumbing.com

Thanks,
Chris

[Terry]

You are reading the spec sheet wrong for the 14" Windham.

Round bowl, 29-1/4" plus 1" behind the tank = 30-1/4" from the back wall to end of bowl.

Elongated bowl, 31-1/4" plus 1" behind the tank = 32-1/4" from the back wall to end of bowl.
Terry Love

You may as well get the 12" then, they use a 12" bowl with a thick tank, so the bowl is still a long ways into the room.
A round bowl Toto Drake round front would stick into the room 29-1/2", the round 14" Windham would stick out 30-1/4".

An elongated Toto Vespin with 14" Unifit would stick out only 28-3/4" from the back wall.

The Windham is a builder grade toilet.
I remove a lot of them from homes.
Not awful, but there are so many toilets out there that don't plug as often.



On the left, would be an elongated TOTO bowl with 14" Unifit, on the right would be the elongated Sterling Windham 14"
Notice how much more leg room the TOTO has?

[Chris74]

I see what you mean. Thanks.

Take a look here, this is what I'm delaing with, obviously, the shorter the toilet depth, the better. I have trouble shelling out the $400 for the toto to gain an inch and a half.

Thanks!

[jadnashua]

How much is a toilet that rarely, if ever, gets clogged worth, especially if it is a once in 20-40 year purchase? Any males, and likely females in the household will appreciate an elongated toilet. Toto list prices are just that...few dealers sell them at list, so look around. I have a Vespin and a Carlyle in my home and over the 10-years or so, I don't think I've needed the plunger. Maybe once...

[Terry]

Any 12" round Toto will be 3/4" closer to the wall then the 14" round Windham.
You could pick up a round Dalton for $185 with the tall bowl.

The Windham is not a good bowl, I throw them away all the time.
But hey, you're the one with the plunger.

If we're comparing apples to apples, the Toto elongated Vespin is 28-3/4" verus the Sterling elongated at 32-1/4"
That's 3-1/2"
That's a lot.
I wouldn't have a round bowl in my home. I'm a guy.


Windham,
Exposed trapway
Round
Standard height
Washdown bowl instead of siphon, therefore it plugs more and is splashy
I haul these to the dump all the time.



Sterling Windham 14"


Vespin II, CST474CEFG
Skirted bowl
Elongated
Universal height for comfort, 16-1/8"
Sanagloss to stay cleaner
High performance 3" flush valve and 2-1/8" trapway with rounded bends.
Of course it sells for more.

Vespin one, CST764SG
15-1/8" bowl height


Toto Vespin II

[Chris74]

I appreciate all the info. I have an elongated in my "man cave", but this is the main bathroom. The partition wall between the sink and tub is the killer, the space to walk between the wall and the toilet is what I'm trying to open up. Scraping by to get to the sink is the real hassle.

I don't think I want to put in a tall boy, 16 1/2-17" and my wife will be nagging that her feet don't touch the ground.

Depth is definitely the deciding factor here. You guys talk about the Toto like Al Bundy talked about his "Ferguson", so I'll take your word on it. If I could find something in the 26" depth, I'd be in hog heaven, but now I'm looking at 29-32...inches...mere inches.

Ok, Vepsin looks like the one then...gotta do it.

The 14" rough-in is the killer here. I have to check the Toto Unifit models, but you say the Vespin is the shortest depth model, I'll take your word. It's more work than I thought choosing the right bowl for the business.

Thanks, yet again!

Chris

[jadnashua]

Those Totos that use the Unifit adapter (Vespin is one of them), use exactly the same toilet, regardless of the 10, 12, or 14" rough-in. It comes with a 12" version, you have to buy extra the 14" version, and then throw away the 12" one. It would be nice if they packaged the adapter separately, but they include it in the box (12" is the most common). It is the adapter that adjusts the toilet to the various rough-ins. Thus, instead of a toilet that has a thicker or thinner tank, Toto just adjusts to the rough-in with the adapter...it always sits the same distance off the wall (nominally 3/4").

[Chris74]

I will now have to move the water line, but that's no big deal. I would prefer to have it just a straight chrome pipe coming out of the wall, but now I'll have to make it 90 to the left 3 inches and then 90 back out..

I saw that Terry doesn't deliver outside the Seattle area - Terry, wanna drive one to NJ? I was looking at online vendors. I guess all I can do is give them a shot and pray that it arrives in one piece.

Well, thanks for showing me the light...

I was checking out those washlets on the Toto sight...interesting...that may be next.

Chris

[Terry]

The CST764SG can get by with 6.5" to the left of center on the shutoff
The CST474CEFG and get by with 5.5" to the left of center

If you 90 over on the shutoff, just use a short piece and then the shutoff.
You don't need to 90 back again.
One 90 el will be fine.

[Chris74]

I've been looking for a vendor that sells the Vespin II without raking me across the coals and I'm not having much luck. If I find one for $100 cheaper after I order one, then I'll feel like I flushed my money right down the toilet! (a little potty humor)

As for your comment 2 notes above this one, you mentioned the Vespin One - Bowl Height 15-1/8"? I thought they were 15".
However, I'm just going to pull the trigger on one today. Sanagloss is the way to go, right?

So much to talk and know about with toilets, who knew?

[Chris74]

Ok...I did it. You'd think I was buying a new car or something. It's just a toilet...right?

I went with the Vespin One, I ordered the soft-close seat as well because I read some reviews about how solid, comfortable and quiet they are and I got the 14" unifit adapter.

Now, I'm a fairly handy guy. I can sweat pipes, install electric, install tile, do dryway and trim work, etc. I'm not a master-anything or expert-anything, just generally handy. I'll post back from a DIYer's perspective for ease of installation for the Toto unifit models.

Terry: Your site is an awesome resource and I'm really greatful to you and all of your contributers for sharing the knowledge and expertise!

Chris

[Fox]

I have the limited space for depth from the back wall and a 14" rough-in that I can't change problem as well.

The specs for the ProFlo PF2200 series round bowl show a 27 3/4" depth from the back wall and I would add 2" to that for the 14" offset.

29 3/4" is only 1" more than the elongated Toto Vespin with 14" Unifit.

Am I figuring this correctly? I need two of these for a budget remodel and the ProFlo would save me allot of $.

Thanks for any information or suggestions.

[Fox]

On the left, would be a TOTO bowl with 14" Unifit, on the right would be the Sterling Windham 14"
Notice how much more leg room the TOTO has?

Is that a round bowl TOTO @ 28 3/4" on the left and an elongated Windham @ 32 1/4" in the photo above?

Oh, it is an elongated Vespin...

[Terry]

Yes, so again, the "elongated bowl" Toto takes up less space then a "round bowl" from someone else.

If you don't care about space, and money is important, you can always install a round bowl and have it set out from the wall about 3"

But if you want to pull a bowl back closer to the wall, and pick up "leg room" and space in the bathroom, then using the skirted Toto bowl with the 14" Unift is the only solution.



On the left, would be an elongated TOTO bowl with 14" Unifit, on the right would be the elongated Sterling Windham 14"
Notice how much more leg room the TOTO has?