New Construction, Toilet Rough In Waaaaay Off

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rrp0968

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Ok Guys.....first post here......need some advice.

I am in the midst of building a new home on Mobile, AL. We are at the point where ceramic tile has been put down (not grouted yet) and toilets have been set. All three toilets have been roughed in in the wrong spot. The 1/2 Bath toilet in my house has the tank 7" off the wall. The other two toilets are noticably not centered......the 2nd bath toilet is prob off by 7"-8" to one side. It is 15" off of the closest wall......but not centered in the space.

My question is.....

Should I leave well enough alone and just live with this or have the plumber fix it. It will involve busting concrete and moving lines and relaying tile. The general contractor said he backchecked the locations of these drains prior to the concrete pour. He also missed the location of the drains on both tubs and had to chip concrete in both tub drain wells to find the drain pipe.

Another fiasco.....his standard install was Briggs toilets. I asked him what the upcharge would be to install Toto Drake's........he quoted $97 additional per toilet for the Toto's. I said....what a bargain....go for it. Now.....they are in my house......wrong location......and they are the Toto Carusoe......not Drakes.

Gotta love it.

Am I asking for trouble later down the line if I have them bust the slab and move these toilets?

So far in this entire process......the plumber has not impressed me at all.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Ron
 

Gary Swart

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You know you don't want to live with any of these screw ups. I would take whatever steps necessary to make this jerk fix the problems, but if that fails, have a real plumber do the job. Then take the first guy to court.
 

Terry

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The Toto Carusoe has a 2" flapper and washdown bowl
The Toto Drake has a 3" flapper and siphon jet bowl.

I wouldn't worry about being "centered" on the toilets.
You do have at least 15" from center to wall. That works.

Seven inches behind the tank?
Now, that's a mistake.

You could live with 2" or so.
It is a concrete slab pour, and things happen.
 

Cass

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Not knowing the layout under the floor or seeing the bathroom layout causes us a problem trying to determine if moving the toilet that is 7" off would be easy hard or not realistic at this point...If you have to live with the 7" screw up...demand that Drakes get put in like what was agreed to...They should change them reguardless of the other problems anyway but with a 7" screw up it gives you more leverage.

Not coming to some kind of agreement and going to court could cause move in delays. I know of people who were delayed by years because of litigation....
 

rrp0968

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I have photos of all of the plumbing that is under the slab before it was covered.....so knowing what is there is not an issue. I am going to discuss it with my builder this AM and get his thoughts.

Am I asking fro trouble later by braking this slab if we do go that route. I am thinking of a foundation issue rather than a plumbing issue.

Should we dowel some rebar into the existing slab prior to re-pouring the area that was chiseled out.

Also.....the 1/2 Bath where the tank is 7" off the wall. This outs the bowl of the toilet in the door way. There is also going to be a pedestal sink in there which has not been installed yet. Not sure how much room is going to be between the pedestal sink and the toilet.

Also.....would it be worthwhile to have them saw cut it first?

Thanks

Ron
 

Cass

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The thing that will have to be determined is who is at fault for the screw up because that is who will be charged for cost of the work to fix it....

I would rebar after saw cutting like you said and for what its worth use concrete bonder on the cold joints...
 

rrp0968

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It is obviously the plumber's error. Nothing has changed on the plans to put the blame elsewhere.

RRP
 

Cass

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Who contracted with the plumber...If the GC then the plumber is his problem and your beef is with the GC....

If you contracted the plumber then the problem is yours...
 
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rrp0968

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I have not contracted with anyone......the GC is handling that. So....with that said.....I guess it is the GC's issue.

RRP
 

Cass

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Yup...there you go...you just tell the GC that it is not acceptable and needs to be fixt right and that the wrong toilets are installed and go from there...

Good Luck...let us know how it goes...
 

rrp0968

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Updates with Pics.........

So....talked with the GC and he at least agreed that the toilet that is 7" from the wall needs to be moved. Now.....my question is what is the best way to do it. I was thinking.....could I use a 14" Rough In with a 1 1/2" Offset Flange? I really do not want to bust the foundation unless it is reallt necessary.

Here is a shot of the other two. Not as bad....prob will not do anything with them. I may chat with him about putting an offset on the master bath.....(pic without the tub) to move it to the left 1 1/2". I am talking of the offset that are full flow.

It just makes me mad that I am paying over 300K to build a new house and I am going to have to live with it like this or break the slab. Something that should never have to be done.

Anyway.....advice on how to best fix the one that is 7" off the wall is the prioroty.

Any help is greatly appreciated.
 
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As Cass pointed out, your GC selected the plumber and is the one who is responsible for signing off on their work. It's the GC's responsiblity to make sure it is right.

Why in the heck would he tile this before realizing it was FUBAR? That's a problem with the GC. It doesn't look like either of the professionals (plumber or GC) has a clue. You would think in this housing environment the GC would be able to get the very best plumber for a reasonable price. Instead, it looks like he tried to pocket some cash by hiring a screw up. Time to show the GC the foolishness of the greedy cost shaving he attempted.

And definitely make them put in the toilet you agreed to, for the price you agreed to.
 
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Frenchie

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This thread makes my brain hurt.

What kind of hacks do the sheetrock... tape... tile... paint... install the toilet... do anything to that bathroom... with this situation in front of their face every day?

It'd be obvious from the day framing was started - the minute you laid out the plates.

I don't understand... I just... don't... understand.
 
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supasquirrel

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And I thought I had plumber problems:eek: At least mine does a good job when he DOES show up even if he is SUPER slow.
I certainly wouldn't be happy with any of those toilets - it would bug the **** out of me every time I looked or sat on it!
Call Mike Holmes:D:
 

rrp0968

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Needless to say I am not very happy. I have been back checking and watching everything as it goes up. The GC checked the layout of the plumbing rough in and I trusted that it was done. Shooting myself now for not doing it myself. Guess the saying that you do not get what you expect, you get what you inspect is true.

I never did notice the rough in for the 1/2 Bath toilet being off until the actual toilet was installed. It is almost like a closet....no real reson to go in there.

Also......this is supposedly his top notch "Master Plumber". Go Figure.

I have a call into him this AM to discuss a path forward.

RRP
 

rrp0968

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This is the rough in that needs to be moved.

It needs to go ~6" to the near side.

Think there is enough room to move it and keep it centered?

The one of them that is centered is 7" off the wall.

RRP
 
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Cass

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While I am not condoning the sloppy work you could build a shelf directly behind the toilet for your wife to decorate or something and not bust the floor up it would look different but would prevent further damage to the floor...Your wife may realy like it...

You could have the GC build a very expensive wooden box, Oak, Walnut, Cherry and extend the water plumbing through it...the box going from wall to wall...up to the ceiling with shelves and lighting...it would look nice and be very expensive think creative...

Just throwing out some ideas...
 

rrp0968

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Talked to the GC a min ago.....

He said if I was not happy and wanted them moved, he would make it happen......no problem at all.

So.....we are going to meet with the plumber later today to come up with a game plan.

RRP
 

hj

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toilets

When I rough in plumbing I always make sure the framer and I are measuring from the same point, especially with one pour floor/foundations. An error of 7" usually implies someone measured from the wrong side of an exterior wall, and I would recheck the dimensions to make sure it was not the framer. But if the plumbers piping was "rechecked", especially by the contractor, then that implies it was where it was supposed to be and something else is off. As for the offset toilet, some would prefer that to give more room to access the bathtub.
 

Alchemist

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If you think this is all bad, consider that about a month ago, I went along with a building inspector and we saw the following:

1. 110V wire going THROUGH a HVAC return.

2. The return was 'chased', had a sheetmetal floor, but otherwise, had joists for 'sides' and plywood for a top. You're pulling in unfiltered air.

3. Small 2x2 tobacco sticks suspending HVAC plenum and solid ducting in an attic.

4. No adhesive used to affix insulation to hard ducting. Just tape. House was just 30 days built and duct insulation already falling off.


This is not a 1970's home but a 2009 home.
 
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