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Thread: Softner Recomendation

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    Default Softner Recomendation

    I am a plumber, not a water guy. Don't want to be a water guy and hate messing with all that stuff. However, my own house would seem to be in need of some sort of filter as the measured hardness is 465 ppm. Any recommendations? or should I buy what my supply house sells. ?

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    Master Plumber nhmaster's Avatar
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    What does your supply house sell?

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    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
    I am a plumber, not a water guy. Don't want to be a water guy and hate messing with all that stuff. However, my own house would seem to be in need of some sort of filter as the measured hardness is 465 ppm. Any recommendations? or should I buy what my supply house sells. ?
    Unless you went with nanofiltration, or RO, there is no filter to solve the problem, only a softener will remove hardness.

    I say the control valve is the most important component of a softener. I also say you should decide if you are going to want to be a DIYer and fix a problem with your control valve or if you want to be dependent on the usually one and only local national brand dealer. If you want o go with a national brand dealer, you're locked into whatever they sell.

    If you want to be an independent DIYer, buy a softener with a Clack WS-1 control valve. It was designed to be the easiest to program and repair. I have sold going on 1300 of them over 5.5 yrs and have had only 24 problems. So IMO it is also high quality, and it has the most successful design of all valves, the Fleck invented piston, seals and spacers design, but with huge improvements and many features that only a couple Fleck valves have.

    What does the plumbing supply house sell? Over the years I have found more than a few that didn't know what brand of control valve they were selling.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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    My supply house sells GE Logic and I have an account there.

    I'm pretty sure that I don't want to have anything to do with lowes or HD for obvious reasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by biermech View Post
    I would agree that the Clack valve would be a good valve IF, it didn't have the electronics. I DO NOT like electronics on water softeners. I have been in the field servicing all kinds of water softeners for over 19 years. The corroision of the electronics makes them useless. Get a Fleck 5600 metered demand system.
    We use both. I can't say that I have had any corrosion problems with the Clack valve yet but then we have not been using them as long as Fleck. Like it or not, electronics are where the industry is going.

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    Master Plumber nhmaster's Avatar
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    Yes..... and have you had corrosion problems with Clack valves? I'm just saying that so far I have not had anything that is unusual in the way of corrosion problems. I suppose the environment the equipment is installed in would be a factor but the majority of the equipment we install is in full, pretty dry basements. If I had an unusually wet environment to deal with I would probably use the Fleck head, but you have to admit that if moisture and leaks go undetected it will pretty much trash anything.

    I ocured to me that by electronic we had not defined the product. I was referring to digital read out and digital data acquisition. You know, all the bells and whistles stuff as opposed to a motorized head with all the pins.
    Last edited by nhmaster; 09-06-2009 at 07:41 AM.

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    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biermech View Post
    I would agree that the Clack valve would be a good valve IF, it didn't have the electronics. I DO NOT like electronics on water softeners. I have been in the field servicing all kinds of water softeners for over 19 years. The corrosion of the electronics makes them useless. Get a Fleck 5600 metered demand system.
    You have never seen corrosion on a Clack.

    I have never heard of any corrosion on a Clack valve; and I've sold going on 1300 of them over 5.5 yrs and all across the US, installed inside and outdoors.

    From pictures I've seen and what you have said, the corrosion you talk about is on Kenmore and other big box store brand cabinet models (that you serviced for 16 yrs) where the valve is under a cover on the salt tank with salt air environment all around them.

    And very old Culligan and other brands that had Fleck 2500 type valves that were made for Culligan, with a leaking piston valve stem o-ring and/or the a brine valve leak. The leaks only occur during a regeneration and it is a small amount of water (a tablespoon at most usually) but it rusted the steel back plate on the inside and outside as in the picture below. And the looks doesn't mean the valve doesn't work.

    Bottom line, other than the metal case on the 12vdc motor of a Clack, there is nothing to corrode. And since it is an automotive motor, I seriously doubt it will ever corrode.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by Gary Slusser; 09-06-2009 at 12:48 PM.
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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    Thanks Bier, I think I'll take your advice and go with the Fleck unit.

    Hey, since I'm a plumber do you think I should dump the drain hose into an unvented trap cut into the main like you guys do Just kidding, you guys don't do that do you?
    Last edited by Terry; 09-11-2009 at 12:12 PM.

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    That's all folks! Gary Slusser's Avatar
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    The Clack WS-1 doesn't have any flashing lights and for most people (they read and follow directions...), it takes less than a minute to program a Clack WS-1.

    The display shows, in everyday English, what is in the field in the database and you use the Up and Down arrow buttons to increase or decrease or change it, then you push the button labeled Next to go to the next field.

    There are like a total of 11 fields and I'm sure you could handle that Pete because I know a set of 72 yo spinster female twins in FL that did it. Actually it's as easy as heating a cup of coffee in a microwave.

    Below is what it looks like. The data shown is the factory default. My customer changes that data to the their specific data that I give them. It takes less than 60 seconds to do it.

    Have you looked at what it takes to program a Fleck? Especially a mechanical metered Fleck?
    .
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    Gary Slusser Retired (= out of business)
    Click Here to learn how to correctly size or program a water softener.
    CAUTION, as of Nov 12 2013 all YouTube videos showing how to rebuild a Clack valve have an error in them that can cause damage.

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